I am looking into getting a Cinch but I need to know that it will work with my ropes first. I will be using it on Fly and Blaze. Has anyone used the Cinch with these ropes? If so, was the diameter of the ropes compatible with the Cinch? I am asking because I heard the Cinch is very specific with regards to which rope diameters will work in it. Thanks.
Cinch rope compatibility
- Thread starter emr
- Start date
- Location
- Austin, TX
I found it didn't work well with that diameter rope (I use Velocity). I ended up selling the Cinch because I don't like using 10mm for my lanyard and moving to a ART positioner with the swivel.
I wish I had bought it when it first came out. Sooo smooth.
I wish I had bought it when it first came out. Sooo smooth.
- Location
- Haddonfield, nj
I love my positioner. I too sold my cinch for the same reason.
The only problem with the positioner is that the "trigger" that helps release the tension is metal and can dig into my thigh from time to time when I'm in awkward positions.
The only problem with the positioner is that the "trigger" that helps release the tension is metal and can dig into my thigh from time to time when I'm in awkward positions.
- Location
- Austin, TX
That happened to me too. When I mounted the swivel option though it took care of the problem. I find the swivel is a must in the setup.
- Location
- St. Paul, MN
Fly is too bulky for the Cinch. Blaze is what I used at first but it tends to swell after some use. I've been using Velocity for a while now and it runs through the Cinch well while still providing a fair grip for the hand. Haven't run 10mm through it yet. However, if and when I do it will be Ocean Polyester, Sterling HTP, or KMIII.
- Location
- Home of the New Jersey Devils
I believe that the Cinch is made to work best with dynamic lines.
- Location
- Home of the New Jersey Devils
I actually think that the cinch is a good choice for a lanyard. I also like the positioner and a VT rope version. Hope it helps.
- Location
- sunny Madison, WI
Try 10mm kmIII or bee line
- Location
- St. Paul, MN
As Mark said earlier, and I learned this summer... The Cinch is designed to be used with DYNAMIC ropes (EN 892). The package and user instructions say this. The access lines and arborist climbing lines we use are LOW STRETCH (EN 1891 or NFPA 1983) . To my knowledge, tests have resulted in the Cinch completely severing low stretch ropes while leaving dynamic ropes intact. (Edit here. After checking with Chris's post, the Cinch was likely to fail. Ropes were not severed.) I have not personally seen these test results, but it gives you something to think about! Does this mean it is unsafe to use low stretch rope in the Cinch? Not necessarily, IF you manage the risk of falling into the Cinch with enough force to do damage.
Personally, I manage the risk on both ends. I don't expose myself to falls into the Cinch (especially when using my lanyard in a single-leg configuration), and I use PMI's 10.6 mm Cirque dynamic rope.
Personally, I manage the risk on both ends. I don't expose myself to falls into the Cinch (especially when using my lanyard in a single-leg configuration), and I use PMI's 10.6 mm Cirque dynamic rope.
- Location
- St. Paul, MN
That depends on what do you mean by fine. The elongation is not that noticable by feel (not enough to bother myself in such a relatively short length). The Cirque, and I've used 10.2 mm Mamut SuperSafe as well, tends to run through the Cinch (on or off load) easier than Velocity or Blaze. However, these are the only ropes I've tried with the Cinch. Also, I've only ever used the Cinch as a lanyard adjuster (doubled line) or short-length positioner (singled line). I have not used it in a RADS or abseil situation.
- Location
- AZ
I've used a few mech. devices on my lanyard before, but nothing works as well for me as a nice tight VT and the lightest micro pulley you can find.
- Location
- Chattanooga
FWIW, I don't know how familiar you are with the famous 'Gibb's' rope grab, a Microcender type device, but in the instructions that come with the Gibbs, it clearly states that if a force of 2000 lbs (memory here) is applied to it, it can completely sever a 1/2" rope.
And, I've used the Cinch in a RADS on PI and Lava without any problems, for what that's worth, but I haven't fallen on a Cinch.
However, if one were planning to fall, one might want to use a shock absorber of some sort, perhaps, a single length of dynamic rope, and not a doubled rope configuration - a doubled dynamic rope would reduce the stretch by half. But depending on the specific configuration could reduce the force applied to the Cinch also by half.
And, I can't help but add this: one, the Grigri, so widely used and accepted in tree and rock climbing, IIRC, was really developed as a belay/fall catch for rock climbers on dynamic rope. Two, a toothed ascender will start to tear and shread the cover of a rope at about 1000 lbs.
Just when you start to feel safe...
And, I've used the Cinch in a RADS on PI and Lava without any problems, for what that's worth, but I haven't fallen on a Cinch.
However, if one were planning to fall, one might want to use a shock absorber of some sort, perhaps, a single length of dynamic rope, and not a doubled rope configuration - a doubled dynamic rope would reduce the stretch by half. But depending on the specific configuration could reduce the force applied to the Cinch also by half.
And, I can't help but add this: one, the Grigri, so widely used and accepted in tree and rock climbing, IIRC, was really developed as a belay/fall catch for rock climbers on dynamic rope. Two, a toothed ascender will start to tear and shread the cover of a rope at about 1000 lbs.
Just when you start to feel safe...
- Location
- St. Paul, MN
Low stretch/static ropes are allowed in the Grigri when rapelling or top-roping (limited fall factor).
http://www.petzl.com/files/all/technical-notice/Sport/D14%20GRIGRI%20D14601-I.pdf
see ppg 6 and 7
http://www.petzl.com/files/all/technical-notice/Sport/D14%20GRIGRI%20D14601-I.pdf
see ppg 6 and 7
- Location
- Chattanooga
TLH,
Granted, it is allowed for rappelling and ascending (RADS) 'now'. But somehow I got the impression when Petzl first introduced the Grigri, its sole purpose was as a belay device for dynamic rope???? Maybe I got an inaccurate impression about that.
But if that were the case, the Cinch may develop along the same lines. However, the BIG difference to me, between the Cinch and the Grigri is that I am not aware that the Grigri will sever ropes, i.e. it slips before it damages the rope. Purportedly, by the OP, the Cinch can sever the rope if loads get too high.
Even then though, one has to wonder if that's really an issue since we do climb on ascenders that destroy rope at about 1000 lbs and the Gibbs rope grab instructions state that it can sever a 1/2" rope at 2000 lbs.
Granted, it is allowed for rappelling and ascending (RADS) 'now'. But somehow I got the impression when Petzl first introduced the Grigri, its sole purpose was as a belay device for dynamic rope???? Maybe I got an inaccurate impression about that.
But if that were the case, the Cinch may develop along the same lines. However, the BIG difference to me, between the Cinch and the Grigri is that I am not aware that the Grigri will sever ropes, i.e. it slips before it damages the rope. Purportedly, by the OP, the Cinch can sever the rope if loads get too high.
Even then though, one has to wonder if that's really an issue since we do climb on ascenders that destroy rope at about 1000 lbs and the Gibbs rope grab instructions state that it can sever a 1/2" rope at 2000 lbs.
- Location
- St. Paul, MN
I agree with you Ron, that equipment will always evolve and/or be used effectively and safely in ways it was not originaly designed and tested for. Yes, we use ascenders that can strip a mantle at 5kN. This has been established, tested, and well known. As a result, we have established, tested, and well known procedures and configurations with which to use ascenders safely.
One could argue that a Cinch should not be used as a lanyard adjuster because it was not tested in that configuration; not approved by Trango. Realistically, in that config, the Cinch is doing what it was designed for: allowing rope to run through it in one direction and halt progress in the other. AHA! But what type of rope?! We need to keep testing. We can't assume anything. Not just talking about the Cinch, here. A tool "borrowed" from a unique industry or sport (heck, even something specific to our industry) might be used in configurations outside of its design intentions, or worse, design limits! We need to be aware of these limitations and carry out tests for new configurations. If the results are unacceptable, then we design a new tool. A great example of this is the Treemagineers. Well documented testing of real world configurations and innovative, functional designs of new tools as a result.
For now, I will continue to use my Cinch with dynamic rope only.
One could argue that a Cinch should not be used as a lanyard adjuster because it was not tested in that configuration; not approved by Trango. Realistically, in that config, the Cinch is doing what it was designed for: allowing rope to run through it in one direction and halt progress in the other. AHA! But what type of rope?! We need to keep testing. We can't assume anything. Not just talking about the Cinch, here. A tool "borrowed" from a unique industry or sport (heck, even something specific to our industry) might be used in configurations outside of its design intentions, or worse, design limits! We need to be aware of these limitations and carry out tests for new configurations. If the results are unacceptable, then we design a new tool. A great example of this is the Treemagineers. Well documented testing of real world configurations and innovative, functional designs of new tools as a result.
For now, I will continue to use my Cinch with dynamic rope only.
- Location
- AZ
[ QUOTE ]
But somehow I got the impression when Petzl first introduced the Grigri, its sole purpose was as a belay device for dynamic rope?
[/ QUOTE ]
That's what I used it for long before I got into trees.
But somehow I got the impression when Petzl first introduced the Grigri, its sole purpose was as a belay device for dynamic rope?
[/ QUOTE ]
That's what I used it for long before I got into trees.
- Location
- Chattanooga
I agree, TLH, there are differences in the specs between a Grigri and a Cinch, specifically, a Grigri is spec'd for static rope, well 10 - 11 mm rope, and the Cinch is not spec'd for static rope at all.
- Location
- Costa Rica
I have to say that despite what I have been told about the cinch's downfalls "literally" I climb everyday on SRT with one or two of them on Snakebite and have not DRT'd in over a year. I am still waiting for petzl to come out with "some new device" which I can not talk about! Spiderwebbing an SRT line is the only way to go... Gri-Gri's are either off or on, at least with the cinch you can limb walk smoothly. Just down take a fall more than three feet or the cinch will blow up!!!
Stay tied in ,
X-man
Stay tied in ,
X-man
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