If its a cast ring the problem could go all the way back to the pouring process. The metal could have been slightly to cold, when they removed the mold for the finished ring they could have stressed the ring exc. I worked in a foundry casting products and you would be suprised at the number of product that gets thrown out and recycled. A QC guy most likely missed the defects during inspections.
Broken Aluminum Ring!
- Thread starter TLHamel
- Start date
- Location
- Asheville,NC
See ya'll later, go'in climbin'.
- Location
- Dana Point ,CA
The aluminum rings are not load rated.You should never climb on hardware that is not loaded rated.The welded stainless rings that are posted are not loaded either.It is not just about aluminum or steel.There are many different alloys and forging methods used to produce all kinds of products. If it is not load rated don't risk it.Also look for ANSI labeling on flipline and laynard products to be sure they are manufactured to ANSI standards.
Climb Safe
Climb Safe
ahem, the steel ring i posted is TIG welded INOX steel , from 11mm rod stock and it is load rated. The INOX ring 12,500 LBs MBS, the plated steel ring 8500lbs MBS, both are WELL over the OSHA and ANSI ratings for treework.
as well, when i contacted the manufacturer, they stated the ring was for setting up anchors or rappel points and that it was perfectly usable as a tree anchor point (AKA friction saver) . When we set up a friction saver in a tree, that IS a rappel point or anchor (wether treeguys like to call it that or not, thats what it is...). So using these big beefy steel rings IS PERFECTABLY ACCEPTABLE. The exact same ring is used in industrial settings, rescue, fire evac etc.
as for the ANSI stamping on equipment......i have YET to see ANY tree equipment , be it slings, biners, harnesses helmets etc stamped with ANSI logo...
only thing i got with ANSI logo is my steel toe rubber boots....and ALL my treegear is STANDARD , readily available in any arb store, tree gear that is used EVERYDAY all over the world....
as well, when i contacted the manufacturer, they stated the ring was for setting up anchors or rappel points and that it was perfectly usable as a tree anchor point (AKA friction saver) . When we set up a friction saver in a tree, that IS a rappel point or anchor (wether treeguys like to call it that or not, thats what it is...). So using these big beefy steel rings IS PERFECTABLY ACCEPTABLE. The exact same ring is used in industrial settings, rescue, fire evac etc.
as for the ANSI stamping on equipment......i have YET to see ANY tree equipment , be it slings, biners, harnesses helmets etc stamped with ANSI logo...
only thing i got with ANSI logo is my steel toe rubber boots....and ALL my treegear is STANDARD , readily available in any arb store, tree gear that is used EVERYDAY all over the world....
- Location
- Asheville,NC
[ QUOTE ]
The aluminum rings are not load rated.You should never climb on hardware that is not loaded rated.The welded stainless rings that are posted are not loaded either.It is not just about aluminum or steel.There are many different alloys and forging methods used to produce all kinds of products. If it is not load rated don't risk it.Also look for ANSI labeling on flipline and laynard products to be sure they are manufactured to ANSI standards.
Climb Safe
[/ QUOTE ]
You dont' climb much then. Think outside the box. ANSI stamps aren't all that. Go test it if you have questions. Are you a troll?
The aluminum rings are not load rated.You should never climb on hardware that is not loaded rated.The welded stainless rings that are posted are not loaded either.It is not just about aluminum or steel.There are many different alloys and forging methods used to produce all kinds of products. If it is not load rated don't risk it.Also look for ANSI labeling on flipline and laynard products to be sure they are manufactured to ANSI standards.
Climb Safe
[/ QUOTE ]
You dont' climb much then. Think outside the box. ANSI stamps aren't all that. Go test it if you have questions. Are you a troll?
RyanCafferky
Been here a while
- Location
- Hood River, Oregon
Has anyone heard about the CE rules that say for a piece of gear to carry a CE stamp it must be pull tested to half of its strength? I think that would be a great rule for all of our gear.
I have heard that REI is requiring this for all gear sold in their stores. Should Sherrill do the same?
I have heard that REI is requiring this for all gear sold in their stores. Should Sherrill do the same?
R
rich_h
Guest
My guess is that they already do, either with their own testing or getting the results from the manufacturers testing.
Every batch of hardware that I import comes with the results from the random testing that is performed by a third party (APAVE). At least one of every type of product is tested and the numbers are always WAY above the listed strengths.
Considering the ridiculous tendency for lawsuits in the States I can just about guarantee that the company providing these rings and all hardware have very stringent quality control practices and test all of their products regularly. This tendency to sue is also why we don't get to see as much of the latest European gear in the States. Some companies are downright nervous ,and rightly so, to sell in the States.
Every batch of hardware that I import comes with the results from the random testing that is performed by a third party (APAVE). At least one of every type of product is tested and the numbers are always WAY above the listed strengths.
Considering the ridiculous tendency for lawsuits in the States I can just about guarantee that the company providing these rings and all hardware have very stringent quality control practices and test all of their products regularly. This tendency to sue is also why we don't get to see as much of the latest European gear in the States. Some companies are downright nervous ,and rightly so, to sell in the States.
SRTTech, where do you get your steel rings? I have been trying to find steel rings that are the appropriate sizes for making a ring/ring FC without much luck (not at Wesspur, Sherrill, Bishop, etc.). I have been able to find several rings at rock and rigging shops online, but I need 1/2" stock rings to provide ample bend radius for climbing lines. All the 1/2" stock rings I have found have diameters that are much too large for a friction saver.
I have no problems with the strength of the aluminum rings on the AFC I recently made, but I am dissapointed to see that there are already light scratches and abrasions on the rings. I don't like the idea of my ropes running over rough metal. I got these rings from Wesspur.
I have no problems with the strength of the aluminum rings on the AFC I recently made, but I am dissapointed to see that there are already light scratches and abrasions on the rings. I don't like the idea of my ropes running over rough metal. I got these rings from Wesspur.
yo Leon, i buy my rings from a local rescue/industrail/wilderness/ rope outfitter shop. for the small friction saver ring i use a FIXE INOX steel 3/8" stock rappell ring. For the other end i use a mallione rapide 12mm stainless Pear screwlink, (threads locked with red locitite, and a small micropulley.
- Location
- Boulder County, CO.
No Bivy,
Since you had both rings at one end of the testing machine, we can assume that the one that broke would have gone at half the pull, if you had set it up end to end, right?
Since you had both rings at one end of the testing machine, we can assume that the one that broke would have gone at half the pull, if you had set it up end to end, right?
- Location
- Asheville,NC
Probably, but you don't ride a friction saver that way?
- Location
- Boulder County, CO.
Sure I do! No, actually, good point. I have two krabs, with a micro pulley on one of them, on an adjustable FS.
I will certainly take a good long look at the ring I use as the slider on my bridge Monday, though; it is the same make as the one that Taylor found the cracks on.
I will certainly take a good long look at the ring I use as the slider on my bridge Monday, though; it is the same make as the one that Taylor found the cracks on.
- Location
- Asheville,NC
This thread led me to toss my Aluminum Figure 8.
I dropped it about 70' onto a parking lot.
You could here the Ping over the chipper.
Now I'm fearing internal fractures.
Better safe than sorry I presume.
I dropped it about 70' onto a parking lot.
You could here the Ping over the chipper.
Now I'm fearing internal fractures.
Better safe than sorry I presume.
^ right on! it sucks to have to buy a new one ($$wise) but peace of mind and lifesafety is priceless.
I have a policy of NEVER climbing on anyones equipment except my own, unless it is a dire immediate life threatening emergency. I know the history of my equipment, i know how i care for and treat my equipment, I cannot say the same about other peoples gear.
I have a policy of NEVER climbing on anyones equipment except my own, unless it is a dire immediate life threatening emergency. I know the history of my equipment, i know how i care for and treat my equipment, I cannot say the same about other peoples gear.
- Location
- Springfield MO
A close look at the ring pictured shows what look like peens indicating a history of drops. Sorry...I'm just saying what I see and it doesn't look like a good history. I'm convinced to switch back to steel non the less. Whiz
- Location
- St. Paul, MN
I would think that the manufacturers of this equip. takes the time to test it. and it's capabilities. I would imagine that assuming liability for a bad product isn't worth the risk for those multy million dollar companies. plus they have the resources to produce and test properly. As far as rapelling, some people mistake it with base jumping. And by the way, some one mentioned that the rings get worn by the dirty ropes? What professional who is meticulous climbs with dirty ropes. I dont believe that this equipment is that frail.however, having the option of steel is great. In my opinion checking the equipment before climbing, providing that the equipment is rotated diligently will suffice. It is the climber's responsiblity not to expose the equipment to forces too extreeme. Keep it bellow reasonable and the equipment is less likely to fai. bye
- Location
- Asheville,NC
[ QUOTE ]
^ right on! it sucks to have to buy a new one ($$wise) but peace of mind and lifesafety is priceless.
I have a policy of NEVER climbing on anyones equipment except my own, unless it is a dire immediate life threatening emergency. I know the history of my equipment, i know how i care for and treat my equipment, I cannot say the same about other peoples gear.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hahahahahahahah! I trust my friends and thier gear, almost 20 years under my belt, alot on others gear.I definitly don't beat my gear with a hammer though.SRT what happened to your pardigm shift of going ultralight and climbing on Black Widow, did you scare yourself? Bodean, good call on that retirement, I have a box of em' if you want one, I use an ATC.
^ right on! it sucks to have to buy a new one ($$wise) but peace of mind and lifesafety is priceless.
I have a policy of NEVER climbing on anyones equipment except my own, unless it is a dire immediate life threatening emergency. I know the history of my equipment, i know how i care for and treat my equipment, I cannot say the same about other peoples gear.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hahahahahahahah! I trust my friends and thier gear, almost 20 years under my belt, alot on others gear.I definitly don't beat my gear with a hammer though.SRT what happened to your pardigm shift of going ultralight and climbing on Black Widow, did you scare yourself? Bodean, good call on that retirement, I have a box of em' if you want one, I use an ATC.
- Location
- St. Paul, MN
I am getting a lot of flack for hitting this ring with a hammer. Knowing the results of my five rings "tested" with the two hammers; if we could turn back the clock, would any of you volunteer to hang your life on the ring in question?
I began this post out of a concern for safety.
A metalurgist is in possession of the ring and will conduct a "scientific analysis". I don't have anything to prove... I will be happy (yet puzzled) if the ring comes back with no defects detected.
I began this post out of a concern for safety.
A metalurgist is in possession of the ring and will conduct a "scientific analysis". I don't have anything to prove... I will be happy (yet puzzled) if the ring comes back with no defects detected.
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