Are you considering a lowering and lifting device?

Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

Grover is back , wow ! Frans doesn't know sh*t about lowering devices , if he did , he wouldn;t have drop a volswagon on one , the way he did it . Take all the math and bring it back to school . This isn;t about math . Sohner , I have alot of respect for you , so I'll keep this light . If the first "Hobbs" hit the market today , would it be allowed ? Greg Good came out with the GRSC because he knew , like us , that their was something better . Better = safer . This "ain't" about lifting and loading . The man who sells the "hobbs" is not the man who built the device and his coattail got stepped on .
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

At this point I must defend Frans and his desire to explore the curious side of demolition. I honestly had know idea what to expect when the car hit the end of the line. Knowbody knew, that is why it was done. Mostly curiosity. It was, and still is, an on going learning exprience for us all who were present and one not to be repeated at home. Of course their was danger but the outcome proved worthy regardless of the eventual findings. Good or bad, thanks, Frans for the organization and allowing us all who were present to witness for ourselves what can happen when folks who operate such a piece of specialized equipment, need to look out for. The limits were needed to be tested and that we did and we are all the better for the drop test. Our means to calulate were a bit in the round figures but the point being that we had to raise to bar each time until something broke. Each time something snapped their was a great deal of discussion as to why it happened.
Anybody ever have things break on the job and nobody knew how it happened ?
These devices need to go to the laboratory and be tested under controlled circumstances if you really want to get picky and precise.

Hey, Riggs your question is somewhat irrelevant since the newest model of the H-2 Hobb's device is better then the older version of the Hobb's and therfore = safer, if I read you right? Better = safer ?

Anyway nobody is riding anybody's coat tails or are they feeling like they got their's stepped on, in my opinion.

The knowledge of each generation must TRANSCEND from one to the other. Enjoy the improvements for what they are, for it maybe a while before you see the likes of such a genius as Ed Hobbs. A true master of his craft who has the industrial fortitude to carry out his dreams and excercise his earnest desire to contribute to the welfare of the arboriculture profession. May the great spirits always be your guide, Ed...
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

Hmmm....
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Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

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At this point I must defend Frans and his desire to explore the curious side of demolition.

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Heck yea! I love that video!
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

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If I do the math some what close a 600lbs log dropped four feet could potentially produce approximately 4,800lbs of force on the line.Ouch on the equipment. Yes many factors enter into the total equation but the statistics are something to contemplate.

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Yes, it could potentially produce that much force.

But, "the rigging point experiences approximately double the force in the rope(anchor point) because there are two parts of the line acting on the arborist block." -The Art and Science of Practical Rigging p.127

Therefore the anchor point, in this discussion GRCS, is not taking on as much force. (In the context of blocking out a 600lb log being used as an example).
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

I was thinking about this a little more.

So, the demonstration video was to illustrate an extreme case. I'll give the Hobbs device "credit where credit is due" that's for sure. It was impressive that it held the 3,000lb Volvo with 10' of slack in the line.

So, when the Volvo was dropped into the GRCS with 10' of slack it failed. Again, I don't know anyone in their right mind who would "send" a 3,000lb log with 10' of slack in their rope.

In comparison of usability and effectiveness, I think the GRCS is the better of the two. IMO.
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Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

Peace , Love and lowering devices . Whoa dude. The only reason the Hobbs is always improving is because of the GRCS.
The GRCS is the best device . Transcending knowledge , thats beautiful , words to live by .
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

" The original noise is what counts. Most people are merely echoes." - McCray News

I coudn't agree more that the GRCS is the best device for some situations. The H-2 Hobb's has earned its place in this industry because it is bomb proving and drop tested.

Love lowering devices. Peace....
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

Why can't one lowering device be the best for all situations? Is the question too broad or too deep? C'mon it's 2008 , lets drop a Volvo hybrid on the situation .
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

Right or wrong its one way or the other.

Not everything is right for everybody....

Life is, chance and choice.

Lift and lower safely my fellow ground folk.....

Climb on!
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

any way .... GRCS . infomercials would do well on the buzz. Buy the GRCS because it will get all of your jobs done , on time , less pay !
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

Had a great time on Friday at our local Calif. Arborist Association's Climbing skills workshop.

We had about 80 people there.
Of interest to me (and very popular with the climbers) was a speed line set-up. Used a GRCS to tighten the line and the climbers then got a ride down being braked by a pull back line.
It was a big hit and very easy to set up with the GRCS.

On the Aerial rescue station I used another GRCS, the drill attachment, and the generator, to quickly and easily haul the rescue dummy back up in the tree after every rescue.

It is very easy to also lift the spotter back up into the tree. Normally the person who sits up by the rescue dummy (to make sure the climber rescues the dummy safely) has to sit up there for long periods of time. With the drill attachment, we can have the spotter come down for little breaks and then just whip them back up into the tree with no effort at all.
I got thanked numerous times by many people for bringing the GRCS, drill attachment, and generator.

I understand there is somewhat of a controversy between which device is 'safe' or 'better'...
but for me personally I had another great day using the GRCS, and I know that it made the day ALOT easier and fun for the rest of the group.
 
Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

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I have a question about the HOBBS and GRCS. Do they ever take a hit at the bottom of the tree? I have used both (someone else’s)and was quite uncomfortable with was having such an expensive, fixed piece of kit at the bottom of the tree.

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Well, quite often there's never a suitable (adjacent) ground anchor around when you need one, so I guess I have my answer

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No I dont own one. Right now it just wouldn't solve anything for me so I couldn't really justify buying either device.
However, if I could purchase without the winch facility, less the cost, then I might be tempted.


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I am seriously considering a new lowering device but need some convincing about the practicalities and cost effectiveness of the lifting part.

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Billson said he could lift a load all the way up to the Rigging point with his GRCS if he so wanted, great for building a tree-house then! But why are you guys putting so much emphasis on raising these loads? Where are you taking them? Are you lifting them up to simply let them down again?

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Finally, safety concerns of having a guy winching at the bottom of the tree. Is it individual common sense and experience, or are there rules of thumb? Unless it were possible to mount the winch elsewhere I'd be very uncomfortable with that idea.

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Quite a negative vibe to these quotes, and I'm sorry to say....all mine!

Well, I hearby take them all back. I purchased the H.2 last week and I'm already convinced that its the best work-related money I’ve ever spent.

Now dont get me wrong, I can rig, balance, bend and manipulate a branch structure with my eyes shut.....at the risk of sounding cocky, I just KNOW what to do.....ALWAYS!
But after only 4 days with the Hobbs, I suddenly feel like an enlightened blind man who up until now has spent years fumbling around in the dark.

I have used someone elses GRSC on and off over the last couple of years and I have to be honest, the earth didn't exactly move for me. But I think that perhaps I just wasn't getting the room (such were the jobs) to take full advantage of its attributes.....

However, today I actually had some space to let rip on a large cedar. Just one example is the pre-tension facility, which just allows for so much more length on the horizontals, especially the ones closest to the ground which might otherwise prematurely touch down.... just beautiful. And the rest!

Why did I choose the Hobbs over the GRCS? Partly, as a freelance climber, to avoid the complications associated with working with different guys week to week, and part other reasons which I'm going to keep to myself if that’s ok.

I'll finish by saying that if, like me, you've been managing with a portowrap or similar budget device, but prefer to rip off big sections rather than lots of little bits.....then you truly don’t know what you're missing
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Re: Are you considering a lowering and lifting dev

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But after only 4 days with the Hobbs, I suddenly feel like an enlightened blind man who up until now has spent years fumbling around in the dark.


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That's the most accurate sentiment I've ever heard .
Well put,
Phil
 
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