2nd Ditch Witch roller bearing failure

Serf Life

Serf Life

Been here much more than a while
Location
Maine Island
Second time the rear bearing spindle has bent to all getup. We just maxed out a hydraulic press at a friend’s machine shop without it budging! Last time it pressed out easier. She lasted about 250hrs.

Soaking it in pb then heat and beat with a sledge. Any tips? Pretty sure I anti-seized it last time too.
 
Try heating the outside of it real nice and hot, and then hit the spindle itself with some nice cold water, to cool it while the outside is hot. That sometimes gives you more clearance and let’s something move that would be stuck otherwise.
 
Serf Life said:
Awesome, totally forgot that one!
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Most people don’t know it, but it frequently works well and it’s something anyone can do. The ideal method requires liquid nitrogen and an induction heater, but the redneck style with a torch and cold water fits our shop budget a little better.
 
Good luck with it.

Is this a common failure? I may be looking to replace my vermeer pretty soon and am considering my options
 
Not sure really, we do a bunch of woods work over roots and ledge etc. Very little in town over lawns and mats, so they see abuse. I’m not stoked that we have gone through two of them and a drive motor shaft in less than 700hrs, but we ask it to be a skidder…
 
I think mechanical problems are common with my high hour ditch witch, but never the same one, and not these ones that are described.
 
Jehinten said:
Good luck with it.

Is this a common failure? I may be looking to replace my vermeer pretty soon and am considering my options
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What model? I just did a few rollers, sprockets and front idlers.. it was pretty cake, my 4 year old and I did it in a few hours. Shit was pretty hammered too. Crazy expensive for parts, but designed as a plug and play ‘kit’.32F5FE5E-86C4-4D49-BE7A-94FFA8E126BA.jpegD2501B7D-1948-43D4-91D0-068730C19E02.jpeg
 
Reach said:
Try heating the outside of it real nice and hot, and then hit the spindle itself with some nice cold water, to cool it while the outside is hot. That sometimes gives you more clearance and let’s something move that would be stuck otherwise.
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Quenching hot metal will make it harder, but more brittle. That may not be good for a spindle that will be reused.

Heat without quenching is commonly used for separating parts with tight to interference fit. The key is to apply enough heat quickly enough to the part to be expanded, otherwise both parts get hot and nothing is gained. We used to commonly have issues separating coal pulverizer yokes from the 8" diameter tapered shafts. So much heat was required to heat the yokes (which weigh 2+ tons), several acetylene cylinders had to be manifolded together in order to not exceed the maximum safe withdrawal rate.

Although most folks here don't work on pumps, impellers should never be heated in an attempt to remove a shaft. Any traces of trapped water can flash to steam, causing catastrophic failure with injury potential.
 
evo said:
What model? I just did a few rollers, sprockets and front idlers.. it was pretty cake, my 4 year old and I did it in a few hours. Shit was pretty hammered too. Crazy expensive for parts, but designed as a plug and play ‘kit’.View attachment 83443View attachment 83444
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I'm looking to replace my s600. It's a wheeled machine, so I've never dealt with tracks repairs at all.

The biggest issue with my machine is that it's an '06. Anytime something goes wrong it's often a 4 week wait for parts despite a Vermeer dealer being less than 10 minutes away.

The most recent issue is a solenoid for a hydraulic valve that I waited 2 months for then was told that the part is obsolete. I've managed to solder the wires back together to use the mini in the mean time but it's affecting its performance.
 
Jehinten said:
I'm looking to replace my s600. It's a wheeled machine, so I've never dealt with tracks repairs at all.

The biggest issue with my machine is that it's an '06. Anytime something goes wrong it's often a 4 week wait for parts despite a Vermeer dealer being less than 10 minutes away.

The most recent issue is a solenoid for a hydraulic valve that I waited 2 months for then was told that the part is obsolete. I've managed to solder the wires back together to use the mini in the mean time but it's affecting its performance.
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Why not an avant? By most of your work photos, that would be a good fit.
 
Finally got it out, heated and beated, did the cold water thing, soaked in pb all night. Then heated and then pb flood and saw some getting drawn in (like paraffin wax trick). No dice at home so headed back to buddy’s shop press and it broke free. Bent multiple stainless drift rods, sheared one and the bearing rod, 10x’s more difficult than last time.

Going to clean immaculately and then use fluid film this time, hope for the best.

Left is inside of track (tapered retainer thing held with big bolt), right is hub side (spindle is sheared off. Replacement hub assembly is $160.

B8B91FB6-470B-4A5A-88B2-95A47833B021.jpeg
 
A machinist once told me to avoid hammering things apart because you can peen the shaft, increasing its diameter and dooming yourself to trouble or failure. If it's not a precise fit, a thermal shock cycle can disturb a rust or corrosion layer to break something free. Talking near red hot, mass water quench the separate. Keep metal temper issues in mind if fancy parts.
 
Talked to the parts and service folks at my dealership who have been stellar. Main culprits are: sucking up rocks/material/branches into the tracks which over tensions to them leading to failure, bashing the tracks into stuff (stumps, rocks, curbs etc), and lifting too heavy loads. I asked if we should run the tracks a bit looser to save the bearings and he said not to as they will throw more, as expected.
Hope that helps.
 
And it bent again, same damn one, 1000hrs. Right rear idler which is the side with the brake, maybe contributes? Applied fluid film last time and worked amazing, 3 two-handed swings with framing hammer and she popped out. Stoked but also…wtf!?E62C6DCC-CB96-42A1-80A9-70BD06146C92.jpeg
 
Serf Life said:
And it bent again, same damn one, 1000hrs. Right rear idler which is the side with the brake, maybe contributes? Applied fluid film last time and worked amazing, 3 two-handed swings with framing hammer and she popped out. Stoked but also…wtf!?View attachment 93339
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Glad it popped off easy but jeez 2 times in 1k hours doesn’t seem right!!
We have a 1550 and a 900 and no failures on the any of the undercarriage!
Working it hard maybe ?

I make sure our Team never try to lift anything that lifts the tracks back end off the ground because it’s not designed to operate on half of the tracks. Cut it smaller so it’s lighter.
Curbs are hard on them also
 
That’s the third idler spindle to bend and the drive motor shaft sheared on the right side at ~400hrs. We do ask lots of it and are working in rural areas, roots, tip-and-mound woods, ledge heavy coastal. Two spindles and drive shaft on one side in 1k hrs just seems wrong.
Maybe the club looking piece which holds the rear idler and slides with the grease ram has too much play side to side? I’m baffled and $160 per with shop time each time. Thankfully have two spares in the shop as now they’re probably $190…
 
VenasNursery said:
Glad it popped off easy but jeez 2 times in 1k hours doesn’t seem right!!
We have a 1550 and a 900 and no failures on the any of the undercarriage!
Working it hard maybe ?

I make sure our Team never try to lift anything that lifts the tracks back end off the ground because it’s not designed to operate on half of the tracks. Cut it smaller so it’s lighter.
Curbs are hard on them also
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How do you like the 900?
 
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