Do you really hold the chainsaw with both hands ?

[TreeVB]

I like irony, and if you pay attention you can see a lot of it. The "I don't do that safer thing because it is slows production down" argument is common in every single industry on the planet. My favorite is when they use coat hanger wire to bypass the safety devices on equipment, because it's faster.

In every case when I've asked "how much faster?" the answers are always related to a few seconds or a minute saved each time you do it. Then multiplied by how many times the action in question is performed. But, never do they look at the time savings over the course of the work shift... because there is LOTS of time lost to stupid shit over that time. Somehow, though, those seconds or minutes saved are important... more important than the twenty minutes they wasted smoking cigarettes outside the back door when the boss wasn't looking... more important than the fifteen minutes they spent smoking weed in the bathroom four times in one shift... more important than the slowed down production caused by them shooting the shit about football or blaming China for making stuff for American companies... more important than the three days of lost production because some dumbass used a coat hanger to bypass the safety devices on equipment just before an OSHA inspection.

Nobody ever says, "I one-hand my chainsaw because I think it makes me look badass!" or "I one-hand my chainsaw because I'm an impatient idiot and I'm too lazy to get better positioning!" or any other, believable reason. No, it's always "It's so much faster!" when anyone who's done it knows perfectly well that it's only slightly faster on a good day.

I'm not like that, at all. I one-hand my chainsaw because my pecker is so huge, that if I don't keep one hand on it, it will flop out and the tree will snap off at the ground.

All of that time and effort reading your well thought-out response, and all I decided was that from now on you should be referred to as "kickstand".

 

[JeffGu]

It's possible that I may have taken a bit of literary license with that post.

 

[moss]

It's possible that I may have taken a bit of literary license with that post.

It was a strong TEDtalk until the last sentence or two, which made it better then a TEDtalk.
-AJ

 

[*useless info*]

Repetitive motion abuse disorders can appear in short time with these usages.
.
A whole another aspect of this is how you use the saw, floating or on bumper spikes.
How far from body/leveraged, and pure horizontal or less usage angle of saw
How many bull dogging thru at what rate for how long
2 handed pre-cutting staging up to MINIMAL 1hand time etc.
.
Kinda, a perfect world/make perfect choice, vs. real world/make real choices thing at some point.
Just takes years to fairly evaluate that there is no other way;
then to minimize,
and know every which way saw could go etc.
To not handi-cap initial growth to that crutch and philosophy;
and fairly evaluate and minimize crossing line,
then to stay so dedicated to keep chasing with better style etc.
It really won't make you a worse climber.
.
It is just highly select fire, taken very seriously; and not jumped into.
To include, very purposefully not setting, bad example.
Darwin, greedily awaits in these corridors.

 

[Edi]

Just was trying to find out. when and why someone use one hand on the chainsaw. My case was the pine tree. I assume all of us know the risks and consequences when we do it. But some individuals take this to the next level and personally assuming the are superior and smarter because they follow the "rules" and other way of working that doesn't fit their criteria is stupid.
Believe me I have seen certified arborists climbing a tree with spikes just to prune it, butchered the park district trees...

I guess one hand chainsaw is like driving and looking at the text on the phone is unlawful and dangerous but we do ito anyway once in a while.

 

[JeffGu]

...but we do ito anyway once in a while.

I think that's a fair assessment. If you get in the habit, it's harder to break yourself of the practice. I think most of us don't want people who are new to chainsaws or tree work picking up the bad habits, so that's a motivator to publicly denounce it as a bad practice. I don't think that, in most cases, there's really a "holier than thou" attitude.

 

[SomethingWitty]

I just saw this ad.
I thought I would share.

 

[JeffGu]

LoL... yeah, I went to one of those sites that finds various service providers and contractors for you, in your area. There were just tons of these pictures of them doing stuff that would give OSHA a reason to cringe. It was almost comical, if it wasn't so sad.

 

[cerviarborist]

Just was trying to find out. when and why someone use one hand on the chainsaw. My case was the pine tree. I assume all of us know the risks and consequences when we do it. But some individuals take this to the next level and personally assuming the are superior and smarter because they follow the "rules" and other way of working that doesn't fit their criteria is stupid.
Believe me I have seen certified arborists climbing a tree with spikes just to prune it, butchered the park district trees...

I guess one hand chainsaw is like driving and looking at the text on the phone is unlawful and dangerous but we do ito anyway once in a while.

 

[Bigtreeguy]

I understand that logic to a degree.

Would you tell a baseball pitcher to throw the ball slower so that his shoulders will last longer? I can only imagine that the pitcher would continue to throw the ball as fast as he could for as long as possible.......

I think I might be at more of a risk of having a heart attack from how anxious and annoyed I would feel if I were rigging 50 tiny branches on a tree and taking all day to do I job when I knew it were all unnecessary.

I respect your opinion, but I can't say I fully agree. If I sound like a prick, I don't mean to be.

That's as far as I'm going to go on this matter!

If you one hand your are asking to get injured. I would say that it’s important to do good work and not one hand if you’re trying
To run a profitable healthy business @Sfoppema

 

[Bigtreeguy]

I understand that logic to a degree.

Would you tell a baseball pitcher to throw the ball slower so that his shoulders will last longer? I can only imagine that the pitcher would continue to throw the ball as fast as he could for as long as possible.......

I think I might be at more of a risk of having a heart attack from how anxious and annoyed I would feel if I were rigging 50 tiny branches on a tree and taking all day to do I job when I knew it were all unnecessary.

I respect your opinion, but I can't say I fully agree. If I sound like a prick, I don't mean to be.

That's as far as I'm going to go on this matter!

Would a doctor operate on me with one hand?? If so I wouldn’t want them to do any work on me. Tree work is dangerous and should be taken seriously.

 

[Treetopflyer]

Ohhh good one and Welcome big tree guy, I shall invite you to reread every one handed thread in the archives as well.. please revisit this thread from start to finish and pay special attention to the gifs and emojis ! I think your going to like it here!

 

[Paul Lloyd-Jones]

I have vacillated more than once on whether I think it's reasonable to always avoid one-handing. When I first started and had no instruction or education, I obviously developed a bad habit. Throughout my time entering the world of informed and connected industry professionals, discovering the Z, and earning a couple credentials myself, I nearly broke the habit. Then, after hearing some arguments (by some educated, experienced industry professionals I really respected) that it was not a reasonable "law" to abide by, I felt a bit lost for a while. And then I started to get lazy. It has been a steady decline. I am sad at the example I have set for my crew in recent years. Even if 2-handed use is not the best and only option 100% of the time, that is no excuse to get lax and exacerbate the problem by setting a bad example and hurting "the faith" of those who are watching and learning from us as the "educated and experienced leaders".
This thread inspires me to resolve to at least try one year without breaking the rule, and see how I feel then. Knowing that I have done it before, and that there are others who truly live without one-handing, makes me think that by the end of the year I'll decide I can go longer and that it's worth it.

 

[Paul Lloyd-Jones]

That being said, I do have one dilemma I have not found an answer for. I live in central Florida, and despite all my efforts to get my company's owner to say "no" to palm trimming altogether, I've been unsuccessful. We trim a good amount of Washington and sabal palms that are very commonly planted to surround pool screen cages. It is not uncommon to have to make 40 to 70 individual cuts (fronds and seedpods) annually. These palms grow tall compared to the cages, and on windy days (and sometimes even not-so-windy days) a palm frond can become a near-lethal projectile on it's flight to the ground, sometimes requiring a strong and calculated throw of each one in the opposite direction of the cage (or tile roof). One bad throw or miscalculation can lead to a pricey screen repair that could eat all the profit of the given job. So just letting fronds fall is not an option. I have never heard of or seen fronds (of these species) being rigged. Washington fronds have thorns, which greatly complicates the sling option, and sabal fronds are extremely slick and so light that they will slip right through a sling. Dead fronds (which comprise the majority) typically are not able to be cut with a hand saw. If you've never done this before, it's hard to describe. Imagine trying to cut through a 1/2" thick piece of cardboard 6-12" wide and 4' long while only securing it from movement on one end. Snap cuts are not feasible.
We've often put two people in the bucket: one holding and one cutting. But this obviously introduces a new hazard I really don't like.
I've done more one-handing of the chainsaw here than anywhere else.
I've slowly been able to convince the boss to raise prices for this type job, but at some point, you really just start to look like you're trying to rip people off when you're price is already double or triple the market price. This is not good for reputation, and it's still not like we're even doing things according to the Z.
Thoughts?

 

[ATH]

I've never done palms, so no first hand experience to offer specific to those. Is it feasible to make 75% of a cut with chainsaw and finish it off with a handsaw?

 

[Paul Lloyd-Jones]

I've never done palms, so no first hand experience to offer specific to those. Is it feasible to make 75% of a cut with chainsaw and finish it off with a handsaw?

It's a good idea. It might be risky at times, but I'm not sure. I could experiment with it in scenarios where it's not critical. Thanks!

 

[treebing]

I was really good at never one handing while climbing. Unnecessary.

Then we got a lift. I dont know how to use that thing without one handing. Seriously have not figured it out.

 

[treebing]

I've never done palms, so no first hand experience to offer specific to those. Is it feasible to make 75% of a cut with chainsaw and finish it off with a handsaw?

The palms I have worked on, the fronds can be cut like butter with a handsaw. Or a sharp knife.

 

[Edi]

Maybe I had been around the wrong tree guys for all this years because I haven't seen any of them working 100% two hands on the chainsaw.
And the funny part is that we tell the newbies always use two hands.

 

[JeffGu]

The Echo tophandle saws come with an attachment on the end of the bar that is an anti-kickback device... it covers the tip of the bar/chain so the chain can't contact other branches, etc. that you might not see. Everyone I know removes it immediately. It interferes with much of the cutting we do. However... since cutting palm fronds allows you to slice across it easily, it would probably prevent the overwhelming majority of any kick back threat, in what you're doing.

Just a thought. I believe that Echo may have stopped equipping them on the saws from the factory, but it is still available as an accessory. Could certainly make one-handing in your situation a lot safer.