Tough Jobs: Tree trimming business

Regarding Mahk's posts...

The guy in the green hoodie is not operating any equipment. As long as he's not currently standing under a limb being lowered, he looks normal to me.

The climber with no PPE... is that how they did it back in the day? Yes. Is that acceptable? Depends on how you look at it. Is it safe? No. Is it acceptable practice in today's workplace? No.
 
What gets me is this isn't the first time a news cast has aired a story without much investigation. Make you wonder if its just the people writing the stories or if we aren't getting the word out enough. This is the second in less than 3-4 weeks.

It does bother me that the company I work for takes so much time to drive home PPE that the folks that get the 15 mins of fame are the guys that don't know or don't care. We pay in the long run and these guys fly under OSHA's radar while the larger and more professional companies get hit.

just my .02
 
I'm in all from you guys. Here ya'll are bashing yet another guy for not having ppe. Yet none ya have anything to say about certed arborist topping trees, just silly how ya trun a blinds eye. I think most of ya bash these guys cuase ya jealous that it anit you on the tv. Fear not most will some day have your 15 mins of fame, just pray it anit in the Awakenings part of this forum.

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I took big pieces and snubbed them off

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Go big or go home, check out the sack they'er huge <---- only the highly skilled can take big all day and not have a mishap. Takes alot of correct rigging and knowlage, and ya'll know if you don't know how to do it you have to take littttttle tiny ones. OOO or you just get pruning jobs
 
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Jammin, I would love it if someone were to interview you and we could see all that you had to say and critique it.

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I wouldn't mind that at all. I have nothing to hide. My integrity and work practices speak for themselves. And I know I can still learn more from folks in our trade. I welcome critique. Why? Because, being corrected or taught something benefits me in the long run. I can learn how to worker safer and more efficient. Nothing wrong with that. That is why I invest a lot of my time here on the Buzz. I'm soaking it all in.
 
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Would you say the same about the worker in this attachment?

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Mark. Maybe I should have elaborated more with my short statement. I wasn't basing my comment on their appearances.

When I saw the video, I based my comment on their work practices. I'm sorry, but I have a much higher set of standards and expectations for myself and our industry. These standards aren't just something I invented with my own imagination either. I have borrowed them from reputable people from this industry.
 
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What are these guys doing to make you all cast stones? Humper, people get hurt all the time doing their very best to be safe, things still go wrong, even when you are trying to do everything right.

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What the guys are doing is unsafe workpractices namely non-compliance with PPE regs, no second tie-in while using a chainsaw aloft, etc... As for the guys behind the shoot they are further undermining efforts by the industry to promote safe work practices. Noel, said it, they impact our W/C and other insurance rates.

The BCMA you refer to Hollen was taken to task in the same manner that these guys are; chastised by some, defended by others and bashed by a few. Such is the nature of an online community.

I did cringe at the reporter feeding the chipper but she did so in the manner the crew operated and were able to show her. TCIA, ISA where are you!!! GET OUT THERE AND SHOW A CAMERA CREW HOW TREE COs ARE SUPPOSED TO OPERATE!

As for preaching the gospel, I have and will continue to do so. As well as learn from what others do both good and bad. 20 years ago we did things differently without the same attitude towards safety as today. We adopt new methods and adapt our practices to reflect a greater understanding. The problem I see here is the exact opposite.

PPE and all the other safety measures implemented do not eliminate the dangers and risks of our work but, they mitigate them. That is why there is always pressure to improve them. As long as people are injured and killed there will be a need for better safety practices.
 
I think Rob explained it well. I vote for Rob to be the new "voice" for the Tree Care Industry!!!
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Mark. Maybe I should have elaborated more with my short statement. I wasn't basing my comment on their appearances.

When I saw the video, I based my comment on their work practices.

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I realized that and I firmly agree that there were some serious safety concerns. I just thought the comment didn't leave much room for helping or allowing those guys to improve. Mark C. said it well in another thread:

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One thing to remember is that none of us knew what we were doing wrong until someone was kind enough to explain it to us- in a manner that didn't cause us to become defensive and walk away.


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Here's the same climber some time later. Helmet, safety glasses, hearing protection, kerf cuts, double-tied (with a lanyard and a choked climbing system), first aid kit, extra 'biner and webbing sling, speedline sling. Just took some time, education, and people willing to help.
 

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The gentlemen in the video are very capable of doing the job, that is not in question. The fact that yet another video has aired showing workers without PPE, or allowing a news-caster to chip brush without PPE, goes against what we are tring to change.

HÖLLENREICH:[ QUOTE ]
I think most of ya bash these guys cuase ya jealous that it anit you on the tv.

[/ QUOTE ]HÖLLENREICH, Do you even care about working safe? or do you just like to poke the bee's nest?

I guess 170+ deaths a year is aceptable to you, well it's not for me, and I will act on taking a proactive stance to lower these numbers.

Better yet why don't you take the time to talk to a family member of a killed or injured tree worker.
PM me and I'll give you Sharon Kelly's number, so you can hear first hand.
 
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The fact that yet another video has aired showing workers without PPE, or allowing a news-caster to chip brush without PPE, goes against what we are tring to change.


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Different from the point I was addressing, but, to be clear, I firmly agree.
 
just read the whole thread - isn't the buzz a place to share/learn/receive/give/critique/advise? everyone does things a bit different but if it's based on a sound safe foundation it should be ok. the guys in the video do have experience - but it's based on that "common sense" that comes from, well, common sense. The thing about common sense is that it is only as good as your experiences have allowed it to be. The difference between tree guys is where they get their sense beyond "common sense". After watching and listening to the video - it's hard to defend their disregard for ALL safety related concerns. The list is so long it's not worth trying to, well, list. Going "big" isn't just about being good at it. It's also about putting into practice proven and knowable limits and techniques in order to make the job safe and effecient. The guys in the video don't demonstrate that they know or care about standards, proven or otherwise. not good for our image at all.

my .02

peace,

Matthew
 
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I guess 170+ deaths a year is aceptable to you, well it's not for me, and I will act on taking a proactive stance to lower these numbers.

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well said. to me, this is more to the point than our public image as an industry. yes, it would be (will be) nice for arborists to be seen as skilled professionals - of course. but in the meanwhile, i'm gonna do my part to change those statistics. every three days a tree worker in north america dies, according to dr john ball. many of these deaths are avoidable. a sad waste.
k.
 
It's all about the Benjamins. $$

And I'd say 99% of customers just don't have a clue. This is an industry of small businesses, so we can understand the big picture, which is why it makes us upset to no end.

I'd compare it to the larger skateboard scene in alot of ways. No body wears a helmet really. It's not in the culture. BUT... you take a look at the pros who are really throwin' down hard and really know what their doing, they're always wearing helmets. Yet, to the spectators, it's all just craziness that they just sit and gawk at.

...and in the end... it's all about the Benjamins.
 
I have never been shy about my past, I've never hidden the fact that I used to climb with spikes on at all times, I used to top trees and I never wore ppe. I was educated to change my ways but not before being thrown under the perverbial bus here on treebuzz. At first it almost made me stick to my guns and continue to do what I was doing, but then I stopped being so arrogant and stupid and realized that, yes, I was being yelled at, but by industry professionals who gave me there valuable time and consideration, even if it was with sword sharp tongues (or fingers).

It boils down to the people involved. I know tons of people, that if put in my same situation, they wouldn't have changed a thing, they would have, not only stuck to their guns, but would have also focused on bashing those who didn't adhere to their ways.

I've never incountered anyone that, when approached properly, wasn't willing to at listen, and possibly learn. How's the saying go about sugar and vinegar?
 
Familytree, I first heard that line about honey and vinegar from a collections agent. She was the top agent in her office and a real gentlewoman.

JAMIN' I'm there if they want to sign me up with proper remuneration and travel allowance. I'm passionate about safety but my creditors like to get paid.
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HÖLLENREICH, Do you even care about working safe? or do you just like to poke the bee's nest?


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LMAO are you kidding me? Dude I'm one of the safest workers around. 21 years of doing this and no (none) days missed work from accidents. What puts the piss into my vinager is you whinnie bitches about no helmet and no this when one of your own is out topping trees and doing who knows what eles and not one of you certed clows is going to trun him in for it. Seems a code of ethics is being broke everytime I come on here and read the crap spude from the mouths.
 
Hollenreich

why so hostile? you're not gods gift to tree work, you do know that right? and you do also know that not everyone views the world as you? you have made quite the name foor yourself here, not one aspect of which is good. its great that you've never missed work from being hurt. is it because you're really that safe, or afraid to take chances?

also........not quite sure that veing certified means were the tree police? who we gonna turn to? treebusters? you shouldn't bash people just because they are educated. take a page from their book maybe!

good luck to you! and hopefully we will see you in February @ New England Grows, or in July @ ISA in RI. only 5 or so hours from Jersey!
 
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