Tie into Load Line:OSHA Regs

All i was saying was that considering the actual regs, and events like what happened on my job site that day, maybe the larger crane companies who own 100-200 ton cranes can do without the rental income from tree guys that want to ride the ball since they have seen unexpected failure in the past. Maybe those companies just choose to stick to standard industrial work which already makes up the majority of their business.

The failure in question has nothing to do with riding the ball in fact, because in the basket or on the ball you are dead. I was pointing out that maybe there is a reason they don't want to let you.

It is also important to note that the specific failure didn't happen on a tree job, it was a communications antenna install.

Lastly, and in no defense of the companies maintenance since obviously I dont perform it, but the company we rented that crane from was one of the biggest and most successful in the Midwest. Just for perspective.
 
Also, just to clarify things, I wanted to say I'm glad you posted that so we could discuss it.

So, I just wanted to say thanks for taking the time to post the pictures and discuss your opinion.

Think about this, lets say someone and I have a stupid dare contest.

Contest is this: There is a hurricane with 60 mph winds coming.

You have the pick between a bucket truck in which you ride in the basket at full vertical extention. With a basket weight safe rating of 600lbs (what are they anyway? I never owned one).

Or you have the choice to be on a crane, extented as high as the bucket truck, with a safe working rate of 4,000 lbs at that height.

You have to hang out at that height for the full day.

What are you going to pick? What do you think is more stable?

.......... then why can't we be tied into a crane?
 
X,

I am with you... I have seen thousands of car crashes, still drive. Cranes tip over, still stand next to them. Dogs kill people and maim kids, I own two...I am not saying AT ALL that we shouldnt ride the ball, or that we should.

My only point objective was to share what COULD be a reason for the crane companies to be hesitant.

Look at a cars, they crash all the time, but millions travel daily without incident... That doesnt mean it is ok to ratchetstrap yourself to the roof and go cruising down the highway, sure you would likely be ok, but 40k times a year you are dead as a doornail.

I rode the ball a dozen times on Friday, I am not being hypocritical, just sharing a story.

I am glad you liked the pictures and likely I would choose the crane in your little hurricane dare :)
 
The reason crane companies dont want people riding the load line is because of liability and osha standards per construction ....period,

As far as that picture/incident being the reason ,that is poor logic. If you had climbed the tree rigged it and cut a piece it could have fallen on you. That case is an example of absolutely poor practices causeing the failure.

How far was the basket in the air when it broke?


As far as being up in a bucket truck vs a crane with high winds it should be noted: the lifting capacity is based on straight down force. Many cranes have seperate load charts based on wind speed. They are not meant for severe side loading like in extreme windy conditions
 
I've never understood why we can't put a wire rope grab and/or prussik on the actual cable (both could be possible). It would abviously be placed above the ball. If, for some crazy reason, the ball came off the cable, the climber could stay on the cable...

Granted... if the ball fell... it would fall on the climber.
bangtard.gif
 
I used a prussick a couple times. No good. Oil and rope dont mix and if the wire picks it wouldnt be good either.
 
[ QUOTE ]
All i was saying was that considering the actual regs, and events like what happened on my job site that day, maybe the larger crane companies who own 100-200 ton cranes can do without the rental income from tree guys that want to ride the ball since they have seen unexpected failure in the past. Maybe those companies just choose to stick to standard industrial work which already makes up the majority of their business.

The failure in question has nothing to do with riding the ball in fact, because in the basket or on the ball you are dead. I was pointing out that maybe there is a reason they don't want to let you.

It is also important to note that the specific failure didn't happen on a tree job, it was a communications antenna install.

Lastly, and in no defense of the companies maintenance since obviously I dont perform it, but the company we rented that crane from was one of the biggest and most successful in the Midwest. Just for perspective.

[/ QUOTE ]

The size of the crane doesnt relate to the experiences they have had.
Biggest and most successful doesnt mean safest or best trained. I would like to know more about that accident. How was the test lift done and at what point did the wire rope fail.How far did the basket fall(I cant imagine far ). Are they using the man basket or down haul weight today?
 
[/ QUOTE ]The size of the crane doesnt relate to the experiences they have had.
Biggest and most successful doesnt mean safest or best trained. I would like to know more about that accident. How was the test lift done and at what point did the wire rope fail.How far did the basket fall(I cant imagine far ). Are they using the man basket or down haul weight today?

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly!
We'll probably never know all the circumstances. I'll bet 'cycles to failure' played a major role.

The 2 crane companies I deal with in NE Illinois have outstanding safety records and are extremely cognizant of routine maintenance. This is very comforting, since they let climbers ride the ball.
 
They picked up the basket, set it on the test weight, locked the weight and started the test pic. The basket only got about 6-12" off the ground before the cable snapped. The cable broke right where it entered the jib.
 
223 Thanks for the explanation.

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Man am I glad that it broke during the test pick. The one thing this does prove is that a man basket would not have been a big help here at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a good example of why we should do test picks. It sounds like maybe it wasnt on sheeve right.
Another reason buckets are supposed to be operated at the platform first too.
 
[ QUOTE ]
223 Thanks for the explanation.

[ QUOTE ]
Man am I glad that it broke during the test pick. The one thing this does prove is that a man basket would not have been a big help here at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a good example of why we should do test picks. It sounds like maybe it wasnt on sheeve right.
Another reason buckets are supposed to be operated at the platform first too.

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Agreed... How do you do test pics? do you bring test weights?
 
you just bring in a really obese person, say a 300 pounder. let him tie into the cable above the ball, test it by picking him up first. If he makes it, send up the real climber.
 
I agree with X, and this article posted by Mark Adams. This article can be found on the Buzz, under Articles: Titled Cranes Best Practices in Tree Removal Hoisting a Qualified Arborist. Thought this one might provide some insight and answer some questions.
“Are climbers allowed
to ride the crane to access the tree?” and,
“If the climber can ride the crane, what are
the best ways to do this?”
This article will focus on two things:
First, it will comment on the American
National Standards Institute (ANSI) standards
that guide the arborist industry for
the use of cranes in tree removal and how
those standards relate to the Occupational
Safety and Health Administration (OSHA);
second, it will discuss the particular issue
of the climber using the crane to access
and/or work in a tree that is being removed.
OSHA or ANSI?
The majority of workplaces in the
United States are covered by the
Occupational Safety and Health Act (OSH
Act) of 1970. For many industries there are
specific standards within the OSH Act that
govern workplace practices, procedures
and equipment. For other industries there is
no specific standard within the OSH Act,
but those industries are still required to
abide by what is commonly called the
General Duty Clause. The General Duty
Clause states that each employer must:
“…furnish to each of his employees
employment and a place of employment
which are free from recognized hazards
that are causing or are likely to cause
death or serious physical harm to his
employees.”
The tree care industry is one of the
industries for which there is no specific
OSHA standard. To identify ‘recognized
hazards,’ OSHA will typically look to
industry consensus standards and for the
tree care industry; those consensus standards
are the ANSI Z133.1-2006. Through
this rather circuitous route arborists are
bound to follow the ANSI Z133.1-2006.
State, local or company regulations may be
stricter than ANSI Z133.1-2006 and, if so,
they supersede the ANSI Z133.1-2006. ANSI Z133.1-2006 does allow arborists
to attach themselves to the crane in order to
access the tree. Section 5.7 is titled “Log
Loaders, Knucklebooms, Cranes and
Related Hoists” and addresses the general
use of these pieces of equipment. Section
5.7.9 focuses on using a crane to lift and
position the climber. Section 5.7.9 states:
“A qualified arborist may be hoisted into
position utilizing a crane if the arborist is
tied in with an arborist climbing line and
arborist saddle and secured to a designated
anchor point on the boom or line. The following
procedures shall be followed when
an arborist is to be lifted by a crane…”
The term “qualified arborist” is used
because it specifies that the arborist must
have the experience, skills, knowledge, and
equipment to perform the work. The qualified
arborist must be tied-in with a
climbing line and saddle that meet the
specifications stated in other parts of the
ANSI Z133.1. The tie-in point on the crane
has to be on the crane’s boom or line
(cable). The arborist may not tie-in to the
hook. [image]http://tinypic.com/r/24fbwk0/5[/image] [image]
24fbwk0.jpg
[/image]
 

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