Tie in to nifty lift

treebing

treebing

Been here much more than a while
Location
Detroit, Mi.
Had a very dead tree that I rented a nifty lift for. I quickly lost patience with trying to steer it around the tree and so I just parked it over the top of the tree, tied into it and used it as a sky hook. It worked great but I couldn't help but wonder if I was doing something stupid or is this an acceptable use of a nifty lift?
 
While Nifty Lifts have a 500lb capacity, they aren't rated for using as a material handler. Some people say 500lbs is 500lbs, and they aren't wrong. Some people say a lift is a lift, not a crane, and they aren't wrong either. Some lifts are both a lift and material handler by design, Niftys aren't.


Was this one of your first times using a lift? What model Nifty was it?
 
Hey Kevin, were you using the lift as a material handler (Carl's interpretation), or as just as a tie in point to access the tree?
 
Huh, I would have to work hard to remember not to grab any limb or material and pull it hard thus upping the lifts felt load to near or over 500 lbs. Also I wonder how far I would need to fall into my rope before the dynamic load on the lift would go over 500 lbs?
 
So I was just using it as a tie in. It was a 60 foot reach nifty lift. My concern was going out far on an angle. Like on limb walks. It felt weird watching it sway so much, it seemed to sway much more than I was in it. It still had to have been safer than tieing into the tree. It was my first time using one.
 
Merle, 500lbs is a safe capacity for the machine, there are safety factors built in. By hand, I would have a hard time overloading the machine holding onto a limb, and I believe I'm considerably heavier than you.

treebing, that is also not an approved use. The lifts are rated for 500lbs loads, 90lbs of side load (pulling/pushing on something while in the basket), and up to a 28mph wind. Everything has a safety factor built into it, but those are the published specs.
 
Definitly exceeded 90 lbs side load a few times during my climb I'm sure. That's a bummer, or maybe a blessing as I was thinking how it would be nice to own one. You mentioned that there are lifts with a greater capacity. What would those be. The idea of having a sky hook wherever i wanted like that would be so amazing. Actually moving the bucket around though to go where I wanted to go was soooo slow and frustrating and would have had to move it at least three times to get access the whole tree, a short but widespread American elm. Using the nifty as a high TIP was great. But I suppose I shouldn't be counting on that as an option.
 
Material handling bucket trucks come to mind.... think heavy duty (and heavy in general) bucket trucks.


The 90lb side pull isn't something that I give much thought while working. I figure everyone exceeds that from time to time. How much do you weigh climbing?
 
I'm 170 naked. Here is the question I guess, could I, while standing on the ground pull over a 60 foot nifty lift with a 100 foot rope. If I walk out on a limb, or say I use my DRT and put horizontal load on the lift. What am I endanger of doing. Has no one else done it. It was my first instinct getting into the thing and it honestly wasn't my plan. I used it on a second job where there was a limb on the roof. I tied in repelled out and mainly walked on the roof, to clean up etc. Something I may have done without tie in at all in a previous time.

Working out of the bucket is cumbersome, although I can see getting better at it. If I were to own one I can just see raising it as high as possible over your tree and jumping out. I can see spending as much time out of the bucket as in it. But what are the forces it can withstand, and is tipping over the worry? Or is it mechanical failure. I really liked it and was amazed at how fast it set up. Don't know why I didn't think to rent one before, I've always refererred those jobs to bucket companies and walked away.
 
Would it be better to run a base tie? And fishing pole rig the boom? To disperse forces and maximize the compression forces dicectional with the construction of the boom. What about using the nifty lift as a redirect with the principle tie in point being another tree? How tall do they make these things.
 
You could always remove the bucket altogether and use the brackets for a tie in point. That would reduce the hydraulically supported weight by a considerable amount and quite probably offset any additional live load forces generated by your climbing. Just a thought.
 
This is cracking me up, and it's a good safety conversation. There are three questions I have, which come from my general chemistry course in college. First, will the bucket fail? Second, by what path? Third, to what extent?

I'm aware, by word of mouth, that when a bucket goes down out of control it is the rebound that really messes the operator up, when they are not tied in. That's why you're supposed to tie in to the bucket - to keep you from bouncing out of the shark cage. Using it as a TIP would potentially put the climber under the bucket in this circumstance, or at least at the business end of the atlatl... Just one problem I can think about.

I agree that it feels natural to use it as a superior TIP, despite the fact that it isn't industry standard.
 
We rent a Nifty VERY often and run into it's mobility issues, so I tie into the tree, jump out, and work often. But it still makes us money and speeds production

While I love the machine, over time, I've become very concerned - any Joe can rent it and the rental place has had to replace the entire machine, basket, leveling arms, controls, etc. I know people's first thought is - I'm going to rig off this thing then crane it over.

I NEVER use it as a crane or rigging point because 1. It's a rental - that thing is beat to shit. I'm scared they don't do the necessary maintenance or test the welds. 2. 500 lbs is nothing.

I like your idea though. Build something versatile! And compact


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I just heard a discussion this past week about the use of some big cranes not being permitted for rescue of injured personnel from height, due to the fact that they were not "life-support rated" or some such phrase.

These were 60 ton cranes he was talking about. Apparently, for use as life support, a crane has to be tested much more frequently, and certified for the use. I think these are OSHA standards that were being referred to. I cannot quote the applicable section from memory, unfortunately. This was in a place that tries to do things by the book. Obviously, most of us would trust a 60 ton crane to support us without the certs, but it might be illegal. Now that I think of it, I thought I read a thread on here once in which possibly @treevet said the OSHA rules do not apply to the owner/operator of a company.

So if you get to make your own safety rules, the game is to find the smallest, most mobile machine that is rated high enough to support a climber's weight even if he takes a sudden fall and really yanks on the thing.

Too much money and trouble, but I'm thinking an actual crane is the right answer. A big fat boom arm on a big fat truck might work well enough, though.

I sure would not want to have to sit there watching a manlift going over sideways with me still attached to it, sixty feet away.

Tim
 
TimBr said:
....Too much money and trouble, but I'm thinking an actual crane is the right answer....
Click to expand...

Close, Tim. This has actually been discussed for years. A purpose built and light weight telescopic boom with over a hundred foot height capability and running climbing line on the spool would make for a rated and safe tie-in point. Add a wireless remote for the climber and it could always be in an overhead and fully supportive position.
 
A crane isn't usually rated for much side load either.


A tie in point machine won't weigh or cost less (Tie in likely costing more due to volume and liability) than a lift of equal height.
 
Has anyone not thought of the shock loading if you were to drop, being tied off of the basket? It seems to me it would take a pretty big lift to withstand that force.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
 
Personally, I would only consider a tie in point on the nifty lift during dead/ danger removals. Maybe you have stumbled upon a new product ( mobile secure / reliable tie in points) , but this kind of negates the need for the lift IMO. Lots of climbers are faster than lifts-that's why they are valuable.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

New threads New posts

Kask Stihl NORTHEASTERN Arborists Wesspur TreeStuff.com Teufelberger Westminster X-Rigging Teufelberger
Back
Top Bottom