Tibloc / Ropeman backup ?

[Gareth]

I'm looking at different ways of backing up my petzl hand ascender on a 11 mm rope for SRT.
I did some research and found that the top hole in the hand ascender has a strength rating of 20 kn. The bottom two holes are 18 and 15 kn.
The Tibloc is rated for 12kn and is toothed.
The ropeman is rated for 15 kn and has a cam.
So, all the above are under rated for our industry. Where to now ? Any suggestions ?
Also interesting was that during a shock load , a bloke weighing in at 80 kg , falling two metres, would generate approx 6 kn, which is enough to tear the rope apart ! Help.
Check out the photos.
Photo one : Tibloc

 

[Gareth]

Photo two : Ropeman

 

[Gareth]

Photo three : prussik (diestal)

 

[Kevin]

I use my climbing hitch and keep it separate from the ascenders, the fall would minimal.
The back up is just in case the ascender failed, it keeps the ascender from slamming into the climbing hitch.
The nice thing about having your hitch separate is you can bail out in a hurry and leave everything else attached to the line.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

The Tibloc was made to work with a very specific size and profile biner. If I remember right, the Kong that you have in the picture is not the right one to use. Go to the Petzl website or read the instruction sheet to find the correct biner for the application.

When the Tibloc first came out I used it for a while and it really chewed up my rope. I would NOT want to use it for a backup at all.

Rather than using a backup above, and so close to the handled ascender, my preference is to use an ISC Rocker attached to my harness bridge with a biner. This keeps the two rope attachment points separated by a long distance. If something were to cause one attachment to fail it's very unlikely that it would effect both at the same time.

 

[Murph]

I just use a simple short prussik tied into the top holes of the ascender. Works well and easy to attach.

 

[Murph]

Woops forgot to attach the pic

 

[Murph]

I tried your distel configuration once but I found it problematic. First it doesn't load the carabiner the way it was designed to (along the spine) and second when you open the cam and try to load the hitch bad things happen. See pic

 

[semprebene]

hi guys you have to try also the "lift"..a devoice from Camp
check it on www.campitaly.com...we use for back up also double ascenders...you can use also for descending with a figure 8..

 

[semprebene]

sorry www.campitaly.com

 

[Gareth]

Thanks guys.
Looks like a new rope there Ryan !

 

[Gareth]

Thanks Stefano.
The "lift" looks very similar to the "rocker"

 

[Murph]

Sure is Gareth, I could say the same for you too! If you want to see the lift in person they have one down at Valhallah, or at least they did. Looks like an interesting little goodie. I couldn't think of much of a use for it that would be different than a microascender or ropeman though.

 

[Treespotter]

Murph,

Why don't you just only use the prussic and forget all of the hardwear dangling under it.

If the diameter of the prussic cord is thin enough it's the best/safest way to secure yourselve.

 

[Murph]

Treespotter,
That may be but the application in question here is for access. I definately prefer a prussik for footlocking on a double but for single lining you can't beat the efficiency of an ascender. Besides I don't know if you've tried footlocking on a single 11mm line with just your hands but it hurts.

 

[Gareth]

Hey Ryan and co. do you think a croll (chest ascender) would suffice as a backup too ? Just curious.

 

[Lazarus2]

Yes, a croll chest ascender set up in the frog system is the best all round system for single line ascent.

Safe, uncomplicated and efficient. Can be used close to the stem, away from the stem or feet free when using the branches as footholds.

 

[NickfromWI]

Gareth, you mentioned the strength of the ascender as an issue as well. Perhaps you could/should upgrade to the ISC ascenders?

love
nick

 

[Mahk_Adams]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm looking at different ways of backing up my petzl hand ascender on a 11 mm rope for SRT.

[/ QUOTE ]

Lots of discussion about this at this thread here on TB:



http://www.treebuzz.com/forum/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=55159&page=0&fpart=2&vc=1


You might skip my long posts about the ITCC (which you probably would anyhow) and go to my post on the second page of the threadf, post #56110. That is where discussion about this setup begins.


basically, in your third photo, simply place your tether (the cord that attaches you to the ascender) and place that cord directly on the bottom of the same carabiner that is in the ascender. That will solve the problem that Murph showed in his photo and it ties you directly to the friction hitch, not to the ascender, which, as you noted, is not rated high enough for our industry.

Also, I agree that the Tree Frog is a great system for ascending, but the Croll is rated even lower than the handled ascender (all of this is in the other thread). You don't really need it either, since the friction hitch serves as the backup for the ascender (and keeps you in compliance with ANSI--think of this setup as putting a handle (the ascender) on a friction hitch).

 

[SRTTech]

interesting how ascenders can be rated for big walls, caves, rescue use, tactical use, yet in a tree they are not rated high enough......are we going a bit too OVERBOARD with the ratings here folks?

just saying.