I've read a lot of this thread but not every page. This may have been answered ..... Has anyone switched between SRT and DdRT on the same climb? Wondering what experiences have been. Any cam adjustments? I would guess yes but I want to here it from you Pioneers.
This is the Akimbo
- Thread starter JMerritt
- Start date
Worthaug
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- North Cakilaki
JustinK
Participating member
- Location
- Sherrills Ford
What allows you to do that with the settings the same? Just curious. In a perfect friction free world, a #200lb guy puts #200 on the device running SRT. Say you're over a pulleySAVER or something of the sort and in theory, friction free at your TIP. You're now at #100 on the device.
What do you attribute to allowing the same settings for both styles, and to work beautifully?
Worthaug
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- North Cakilaki
Don't get sciencey with me, @JustinK.
It's about modulation techniques, you wouldn't understand...
Reed Wortley
CA# SO-6953A
CTSP# 01739
Magnum783
Participating member
- Location
- Cheyenne WY
Vortex sucks way to fat
JeffGu
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Osceola, Nebraska
I have no idea why it works with the same settings... it just does. I think once you get them right for a rope, it doesn't care if there's 50 lbs. or 250 lbs. hanging on it. I think that's why I can set it up on a rope at home, without putting my full weight into it, and it works when I go to the shop and throw the line up into a tree. So far, the only one that I really had to change the settings with, was the KM3 Max. It would creep with my full weight, so I had to readjust it. Didn't try that one DdRT, though. The Cherry Bomb, I did. I didn't need to touch the settings.
Tomorrow... going to try the 11.7mm Yale Aztec... another one that feels great here at the house, with the same settings as the All Gear rope. Apparently, it doesn't much care about a couple of millimeters with ropes right around 11.5mm to 12mm range... it's either side of that range where it gets a little finicky.
Tomorrow... going to try the 11.7mm Yale Aztec... another one that feels great here at the house, with the same settings as the All Gear rope. Apparently, it doesn't much care about a couple of millimeters with ropes right around 11.5mm to 12mm range... it's either side of that range where it gets a little finicky.
JeffGu
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Osceola, Nebraska
Now that I think about it, that's what I like about the Rope Wrench and hitchclimber setups... I could always tell, setting one up at home, when I had the hitch right. As long as I could get half my weight or more onto it, I could get it right. Thing is, after the Akimbo, those setups feel very large, bulky and complicated. Reliable as hell, and not very expensive... but a lot longer to get on and off the rope, and a tad bit cumbersome.
Crimsonking
Been here a while
I had the same experience when switching between srt and ddrt- seamless. I wonder if the secret is the cam that you clip into. Your full weight is on it in srt, but not in ddrt, decreasing friction. A guess.
JeffGu
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Osceola, Nebraska
It's magical. I like to think that Jaime tapped into secret Mechanical Device Fairy technology on this one.
treebilly
Branched out member
- Location
- N. Lawrence
I could see changing between SRT and ddrt having a bit of response issues but they would be acceptable in my mind. Heck I'm still on a HH ( love it btw) and I find everything acceptable.
Raven
Branched out member
- Location
- Northwoods
I think it has to do with the whether the rope is bent or allowed to run straight through.
Same phenomenon with the HitchHiker and Unicender. When the device only sees half the weight it doesn't necessarily make it MORE grabby as would be expected. But when you try to use a RopeWrench in a DdRT system it is way too grabby and the wrench must be fully disengaged to descend.
Have not tried DdRT with a RopeRunner but I'm guessing similar to the wrench, probably because these cause the rope to bend at the bird/wrench while the others really allow the rope to pass straight through on descent without the bend.
And have you ever tried DdRT with a Petzl Rig or similar device? Absolutely no good.
Or I could be completely wrong
Same phenomenon with the HitchHiker and Unicender. When the device only sees half the weight it doesn't necessarily make it MORE grabby as would be expected. But when you try to use a RopeWrench in a DdRT system it is way too grabby and the wrench must be fully disengaged to descend.
Have not tried DdRT with a RopeRunner but I'm guessing similar to the wrench, probably because these cause the rope to bend at the bird/wrench while the others really allow the rope to pass straight through on descent without the bend.
And have you ever tried DdRT with a Petzl Rig or similar device? Absolutely no good.
Or I could be completely wrong
JeffGu
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Osceola, Nebraska
I'll probably not spend much time playing with the Akimbo in a DdRT configuration, because I have enough ZigZag and Hitchclimber setups to making a killing when Trump builds his wall... but I do have a couple more ropes I want to try with it in SRT mode. So far, my impressions are that the sweet spot for rope diameter is in that 11.5mm to 12mm range, and a firm rope. That leaves a huge amount of climbing ropes out there that it should work very well on. When you go smaller, you have to spend more time getting it adjusted just right to stop it from creeping (especially on tightly braided, slick ropes) and if you go larger, there's too much friction to get it dialed in to work right.
Nothing surprising about any of that. The Rope Wrench with an HC setup works great down to 11mm, but has the same problem with fat ropes. ZigZag works fine with the fat ropes, but creeps and slips on anything under 11.5mm and I've seen similar issues mentioned about devices that I don't have. I think that expecting any one device to cover them all perfectly might be asking too much. One thing is obvious about the Akimbo, though... it would be very easy to produce specialized cams/parts that would make it work better at the extreme ends of the range. I think someone with good CNC skills could corner a little niche for parts to make it work on unusual rope types. Just a thought. The most popular ropes seem to be covered pretty well by the thing, and it has qualities that make it well worth buying a rope just for it.
Nothing surprising about any of that. The Rope Wrench with an HC setup works great down to 11mm, but has the same problem with fat ropes. ZigZag works fine with the fat ropes, but creeps and slips on anything under 11.5mm and I've seen similar issues mentioned about devices that I don't have. I think that expecting any one device to cover them all perfectly might be asking too much. One thing is obvious about the Akimbo, though... it would be very easy to produce specialized cams/parts that would make it work better at the extreme ends of the range. I think someone with good CNC skills could corner a little niche for parts to make it work on unusual rope types. Just a thought. The most popular ropes seem to be covered pretty well by the thing, and it has qualities that make it well worth buying a rope just for it.
FreeFallin
Branched out member
- Location
- Wisconsin
YESSS! My primary line is Sterling Scion 11.5, I took a chance when I got it thinking it might work well with the Akimbo.
treebing
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Detroit, Mi.
the runner works ddrt and also works on a completely taught line. multiple climbers cam climb the same line with a runner.
JeffGu
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Osceola, Nebraska
I think it will work fine! Almost bought a hank of that rope when it came out, but decided to wait and see what people thought of it. Haven't seen much about it, though.
FreeFallin
Branched out member
- Location
- Wisconsin
Since it's my first specifically arborist rope I really have no frame of reference, its more pliable than I expected but still seems to hold it's shape well, I have one hand ascender that seems to catch a little on the sheath, but my other devices do not, so I suspect the tool has a wonky tooth. So far I love it, but I'm easy to please.
Flex Abednego
Branched out member
- Location
- N Ca
Is that what I'm going to have to do? I'm disappointed I never saw the Gofundme, I've developed a twitch reading how awesome the Akimbo is. I keep checking Rock Exotica's website and have started to hate them for not having any info. It's dumb really. I've been on the ocean basically since November but I'm still obsessing
Merle Nelson
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- SF Bay Area, CA
You're too funny Nick. I can imagine you obsessing. If I was out on the ocean working like you I would be obsessing too....and sick enough to wish I was dead.
Flex Abednego
Branched out member
- Location
- N Ca
Just a few more weeks & I imagine we will be stacking out. I'm back up in crescent city on the Spirit of America. Mdvaden took a brilliant photo of this boat Fourth of July last or maybe the yr before. The owners son had it enlarged and framed for Christmas this year. Might have to find a boat headed down the hill and come check out your Akimbo Merle!
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