splicing Icetail

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... Very detailed splicing instructions with pictures (for those of us that can't follow written instructions; Nick)...

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Hey, what's that supposed to mean!!! I can follow written directions!

I can't wait to get my paws on a copy of the new manual!



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Just toyin with ya NICK. I know you are fluent in both english and spanish. I'm still waitin for my belt.
 
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Just toyin with ya NICK. I know you are fluent in both english and spanish. I'm still waitin for my belt.

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Oh, crap! I just ran across that thing in my sewing supplies! I wondered what it was doing there, why I made it. Out it goes...WHOOPS!

love
nick
 
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The key is to make the proper full volume bury along with a proper taper. NO SHORTCUTS. ALL SPLICES ARE STITCHED according to rope classification (Class I or II).

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If I did want to take a shortcut, and make my bury, say, 2" or 3" long, where should I start my taper?
 
I was kidding when I asked about a 1 or 2" bury, and your answer made me laugh. Then I realized that you, or perhaps some reader of this thread, might think we were serious.
In that new light, let me say, not following manufacturers recommendations is stupid. A Brummell does not excuse bury length reommendations.
 
I personally don't do it just cause it is more of a mental thing but if you do bury short wouldn't putting a really tight whip when whiplocking hold it in place as well? Only reason I am thing this is that I whipped the end of my prussik tail to itself and it caused my double fishermans to not clamp down on my krab.
 
Re: In support of the lock

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Let me ask you this, how strong is a locking brummell with an untucked tail, on 1/4 inch technora (is that bee lines core?)?

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Mike, I have break reports for 1/4" polyester. I thought I had some for 1/4" technora, too, but I guess not.

FWIW, I did a single pass through the rope...not even a lock....just one pass, then cut a 2" tail and whipped the end. Broke it and it came in at 1,978 lbs. This rope has an ABS of 2500lbs. So with NO tail buried and not even a full lock, I was able to get just shy of 80% of ABS. Not too shabby. I wonder how the same test would work with technora braid.

love
nick
 
Re: In support of the lock

just to add to the discussion ,how many breaks tests need to be carried out to provide an accurate figure? Obviously the more tests the more accurate but what number provides an adequate result?

Jamie
 
Re: In support of the lock

I spliced som ropelengths of 8mm Tech 12 to use as a snare when winching bundles of smaller trees with a 4t tractor winch. They were 3m long, one big eye for choking and one small eye where I had a steelkarabinar to connect it to the steel wire.
I made a short bury like I do in my split tail, wanted to see how it worked out.
By the time the rope failed the bury had come out but the locks were still good. Tech 12 have a breaking strength of 13000lbs so the winch couldnt have broken it. I guess it have been filed over a rock edge. Still I expect that the force on the splice must have been between 2,5 - 3t and even if the bury came out it didn´t fail.
Svein
 

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Re: In support of the lock

The lock held sure but I dont like the length of the tails. No matter what you say, i'd say longer tails.

Was there no whipping on the bury. If not that might have held the tails in place. If there was some whipping where is it now.

I dont want to make any critisisms (positive or negative) of your work without knowing all the facts

Jamie
 
Re: In support of the lock

Yep...sure looks like it needed a whipping.

The amazing thing is that the tail didn't continue unravelling to allow the locks to fail.

Still...add another inch or so and put a whipping on there, and it might be fine for what you're using it for.

love
nick
 
Re: In support of the lock

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The amazing thing is that the tail didn't continue unravelling to allow the locks to fail.

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That was my thought but i wasnt too sure if this would happen, hence the lack of a mention. I thought that as the braids were loaded it may have pulled itself tight.

Jamie
 
Re: In support of the lock

Thanks for the feedback. There was intentionally no whipping and a short tail just to see how the splice itself worked. There has been so many assumptions and few facts in this thread so I thought I´d try to put the splice I use for my split tail under serious abuse and see how it dealt with it. What I learned from this test is that even if the tail comes out nothing drastic is going to happen right away so in that way I consider locked brummel to be safe for my split tail even with a two inch tail. The other winch slings is spliced with 4 inch tail and function just great.
Still interested in controlled breaking tests though, keep searching Nick.
Svein
 
Re: In support of the lock

I still think I would rather have a longer bury where I know for sure that it's gonna be able to save my a$$. There's something about taking a risk of well it's held me so far it'll hold me again and then next thing you know your on the ground after a fall. I am kind of partial to knowing that unless something goes seriously wrong that it's gonna hold me.
 
Re: In support of the lock

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...What I learned from this test is that even if the tail comes out nothing drastic is going to happen right away so in that way I consider locked brummel to be safe for my split tail even with a two inch tail...

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Svein, that statement is very dangerous. If people follow your lines of thinking, something very drastic WILL happen. The way I look at it, once the tail comes out, it's game over Johnny. You lucked out this time, but these are not results that can/should be relied on.

love
nick
 
Re: In support of the lock

I appreciate your concern Nick, I´ve binned my split tails and will splice new ones with three inch bury, whipping and stitches. The point with a relatively short bury in split tail is that the thickened parts do not function well as crossovers and subsequently prolongs the distance from the biner to the first crossover. In my opinion this makes the VT less functional.
Cheers
Svein
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The key is to make the proper full volume bury along with a proper taper. NO SHORTCUTS. ALL SPLICES ARE STITCHED according to rope classification (Class I or II).

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Norm (or Nick or other splice-meister): just to clarify. On the straight tuck (no brummel), for eyesplice on one end of Class I hollowbraid: 2 fid lengths = 21 times diameter for the bury, then taper and stitch as shown on Sampson's site?
 
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