Lithium powered saws?

The power density of the batteries is not quite their yet, that said its not too far off for a top handle deal.
The new 12 AH 18 volt Milwaukee Fuel batteries will provide 2hp (which when you consider the torque of an electric should allow it to compete with most top handles) for 8 minutes.
That said you can't quite charge them off a cigarette lighter LOL. Even if you have the luxury of an outlet and a 250 dollar soon to be released superquick charger it will still take an hour to charge) so yeah realistically you would need to carry enough to get you through your day, which could get pretty expensive at 225 each.
That said if someone would come out with a battery pack (say 120v DC) that you wear like a harness with a short tether cord to the saw itself, you would have top handle saw that would be both more powerful, lighter, instant starting, quiet and safer (think instant blade brake)....and before someone brings up cutting the cord a simple GFI type breaker would instantly kill the power if needed.
 
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I think Lithium battery chemistry hasn't changed much.
I think many fields are seeing longer lasting charge and more power from more efficient motors mostly. If could get saw to run at pro levels will be cleaner, quieter and less vibrations.
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If could get away from convert electrical to chemical storage and back out again would be greatest thing to jump forward in many devices.
Like charge a capacitor, hold as electrical then feed out strategies, that can flash charge.
Like solar water heater collects and holds w/o the 50% or whatever conversion losses of converting solar to battery etc.
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Graphene as possibly parent form of carbon: coal and diamond family I think is going to change things . Diamond as strongest is also unique in is thermal conductor BUT electrical insulator. Graphene is now held as strongest substance and like all else as thermal conductor is also electrical conductor. It can make a1 atom thick strong lattice layer, enough stacked as thick as saran wrap can hold elephant!
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Solar, greater efficiencies, grapheme and figure out better electrical storage are to make big changes in everything I think.
 
Just did crane day this last Monday. Two 20" laurel oaks and a 32" pine. The m18 fuel milwaukee was right in there with the ms3whatever on the ground. No battery change the whole day. I sat out this climb to monitor traffic and run my mini skid. Couldn't be more pleased to be able to talk between cuts and not pull start a single time. The ms661 with 36" bar sat this one out. Every saw has its place.
 
I think it's time to wait for a mainstream tool line to make a brushless tophandle. The Makita looks great, but it's got a brush motor, and possibly a little heavy with the two batteries... I'll buy a milwaukee tophandle if they make it and it's decent. They just made a ground saw, then a pole saw. It's all about the balance between the versatility of batteries for several tools, and the quality of the tool. Chainsaws aren't new, so it is possible to make a decent one as a new market entry, in 2019. I'm not pushing for Milwaukee products, but rather for the versatility of buying into a tool system and using those batteries for lots of tools. I use the portable band saw for bracing, the angle grinder for metal cabling and welding prep, the hammer drill for metal cabling and general use, the blower for small cleanups, and the weedwhacker around the house. I'm appreciating the efficiency of it all.
 
@colb - even though the M18 platform is very versatile, and you could do it, would you use the same battery in a chainsaw? Is the saw worthwhile with anything less than a 9Ah battery??? Any more than a 5Ah in most other applications is a lot of weight. I just got an XC3 and XC5 battery to replace the dying original batteries (1.5Ah) for my drill/driver set (7-8 years isn't so bad). They are quite a bit heavier... I wouldn't want the HD9 or HD12 on the bottom of my drill. And I'm thinking a CP3 isn't going to be great in a chainsaw??? Not saying it is not a good tool, just wondering how much the diversity of the platform really applies here...
 
ATH said:
@colb - even though the M18 platform is very versatile, and you could do it, would you use the same battery in a chainsaw? Is the saw worthwhile with anything less than a 9Ah battery??? Any more than a 5Ah in most other applications is a lot of weight. I just got an XC3 and XC5 battery to replace the dying original batteries (1.5Ah) for my drill/driver set (7-8 years isn't so bad). They are quite a bit heavier... I wouldn't want the HD9 or HD12 on the bottom of my drill. And I'm thinking a CP3 isn't going to be great in a chainsaw??? Not saying it is not a good tool, just wondering how much the diversity of the platform really applies here...
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Good point. I used the hd12 battery on the ground this past Monday. That is a 16" bar on limbing duty. My understanding is that the hd12 dissipates heat better than the hd9 (of which I have 1) and 5 amp batteries, which I have two of. I don't think heat dissipation is an issue in a climbing saw because it's not like you're cutting firewood continuously. I don't think a 5 amp is too small either, for a 14" bar tophandle. I think it can take on a full tree crown in many circumstances, and possibly a spar as well. Obviously, one can theoretically rack an extra battery (or two batteries if you used 3amp), or have one sent up. I just don't think there is a substantial difference in weight as compared to a full gas tank. I could be wrong, but I think it is a perception associated with the newness of battery saws. They only run for a small fraction of the time that gas saws run - I'm guessing 1/20th of the time. Lots of saved energy there...
 
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TallTreeClimber said:
It's never "time to wait" for the consumer. Makita and Husky are the only option right now. Even Stihl is late to this game. I wish there was more quality top handles available, but there aren't. When will they come? I don't know. My battery systems didn't include Makita until this saw purchase. Now I have 4 batteries branded Makita. I like Milwaukee tools, I used to like dewalt and ridgid too, but they don't even have an offering.

One big plus to getting into the Makita was that it came with a free brushless grinder in the kit. I've always wanted a brushless grinder, and this one is top notch.
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I "waited" by buying an Echo 2511t, lol. I wish settling always felt this good...

I would really like to try your Makita, btw. I advised a friend to buy the 4" Makita because she's ready to take a chainsaw up in a tree. Can't wait to try that one out, but I don't know anyone local with the larger tophandle... While I feel like your saw must be awesome, they/every other manufacturer must be close to getting a brushless motor out the gate, and probably with a single battery. You'll get several years from yours before that happens, but someone buying now will not.

What do you use the grinder for?

How do you feel about having multiple battery systems? How many is too much, and what's it like to go from 1 to 2 systems?
 
colb said:
..... I just don't think there is a substantial difference in weight as compared to a full gas tank.......
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I agree that an HD12 battery in a (theoretical) top handled Milwaukee saw would probably not be to much or unbalanced weight...I was just thinking I wouldn't use the HD12 in most other tools (drill, impact driver, Sawzall, angle grinder. Possibly in a blower or weed wacker.... That doesn't make it a bad choice. If a couple of HD5 batteries would get me through a day (I could see that - I do a lot of handsaw pruning, and it is not uncommon that I don't need a gas refill for the saw during a climb), that would be great! Wonder if Milwaukee will see the market opportunity?

I've been eyeing the Husqvarna, but I'm trying to save my pennies to pay for a shop right now and I don't need a new top handled saw. If Milwaukee had a top handle tool only for $200-250, it would be hard to not buy! I see Home Depot has the Makita for $320 (with an angle grinder thrown in). Very tempting...but I'm saving pennies!
 
New2trees said:
The new 12 AH 18 volt Milwaukee Fuel batteries will provide 2hp (which when you consider the torque of an electric should allow it to compete with most top handles) for 8 minutes.
Even if you have the luxury of an outlet and a 250 dollar soon to be released superquick charger it will still take an hour to charge) so yeah realistically you would need to carry enough to get you through your day, which could get pretty expensive at 225 each.
Click to expand...

I just bought a new 12.0 Ah Milwaukee battery for $144.00 to run my new weedwacker. Never thought I'd be an electric power tool guy, but I'm already into the Milwaukee M18 line, so what the hell. My yard's not too big and my old weedwacker's carb is a pain. Shouldn't have any trouble starting the new one!

Point being, the 12.0 battery is getting cheaper all the time. Won't be long till there's a fantastic little electric top handle out there. Seems a no brainer.

Screen Shot 2019-03-16 at 11.54.36 PM.webp
 
Anyone buying a top handle now the Husky is fantastic. I also added the blower for my wife at home and the extendable pole saw for early/late work on trees. The pole saw has surprising torque. Ohh.....also the hedger. They are all nice to run without having to breath fumes etc.

Think I have the second size up batts 4Ah, run one out in a few hours of trimming - it charges while using a second.
 
BooRad said:
https://www.stihl.com/stihl-msa-160-t-arborist-saw.aspx

Supposed to hit the shelves "early" 2019.... anyone try the this out yet?

I have the pole pruner battery (A300) battery, so waiting for this sthil tophandle.
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Thst saw has been available for a while in Europe. I haven't used it, but I have used the MSA 120. They both suffer from some of the same issues, the one that bothered me most was it not clearing the sawdust well and getting bogged down. Also, the chain seemed to loosen quite quickly on the 120.I'm not a huge fan of how you can turn if off by taking the battery out partially. Stihl's battery saws would be great for small pruning, because of the small chain they use. On the apple trees I used it on, it was seriously underpowered on some 6" live limbs, I had to rev it up and dig in again seberal times to make that cut. But of course apple is very hard.
August Hunicke did a video of the 160T, so did Baumpflege Mertens here in Germany, not sure if there are subtitles.
That stub right by my knee in the first picture is where Ithe saw had trouble. Went trough the dead stub in picture 2 like butter though.
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The 536 is an amazing little saw ! I use it on all removals until I’m into bigwood. It absolutely shines on pines, why pull start a saw 100 times when you can push a button? Less noise, less emissions it’s a win win! That 90’ pine I used a gas saw for 2 cuts only then flopped the last 30’ with a 562. I have a 14” tech lite bar and keep the chain sharp it cuts so nice


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