jc

J

jcclimber

What does it mean to believe in God is it just a mental thought of his nature?What if our idea or belief of who he is is just a product of our imagination,will that save us.Read james chapter 2
 
Who is James. And is Chapter two in the same book that some chaps started writing a couple of hundred years after Julius Ceasar died?
Read this http://www.carotta.de/eindex.html and the story of a guy called Darwin and you will know why we all should love nature.

By the way JC.
What is there to save if we end up in the beginning of the circle of life and new life starts growing out of our remains?
What is there to save if you can say to yourself "I've done my part in making this spot in the universe a better place for my little kid"?
 
</font><blockquote><font class="small">Als antwoord op:</font><hr />
and the story of a guy called Darwin and you will know why we all should love nature.
By the way JC.
What is there to save if we end up in the beginning of the circle of life and new life starts growing out of our remains?



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I dont want to go to religion talk i quess, i just believe that the 'inner' energy of a human beeing does survive after fysical deadth. How the hell i know? I havent been dead so far.

</font><blockquote><font class="small">Als antwoord op:</font><hr />

What is there to save if you can say to yourself "I've done my part in making this spot in the universe a better place for my little kid"?

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At the moment i made 'this spot in the universe a better place' for my kid inmy backyard. (have to finish it this weekend :) see pic attached
 

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hum im really confused now,o yeah saved from your sin and eternal judgement,for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of god-the wages of sin are death.regardless of what our inner reality tells us humans have a tendency to lie so we make up our on reality to suppress the truth.if we accept the truth about god than we have to except his perfection and our on inperfection and the judgement we face for that imperfection.this is the reasons people establish there on idea of who god is with out no basis or proof therefore hes dwindled down to a god of our imagination and becomes relative to each individual.that not a god or the true god for sure he describes himself in the bible but most are unwilling to truly submit to his true character.thus we change his character in our minds to suit our sin and unrighteousness.but regardless of who we make him to be it doesnt change who he really is.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems that you are saying that god (or however you wish to describe the ground of all being) is essentially unknowable. I would agree with this.
 
In the humanistic view of god hes is unknowable ,so then in mans imaginative mind they think they have and excuse for the wickedness they perform daily.God is knowable he clearly defines that in the bible,in fact he invites us to know him personally,but most refuse his calling.people have a tendency to create their own god (unknowable,unpersonal,a tree,a statue or whatever we imagine)to deny his being, to escape judgement,but its unavoidable to the unrepentant heart who denies him regardless of what we think.God has a true character and has given his word so we can truly know him thru his characteristics.just thank about this, someone says i know mark chisholm and begins to decribe some charateristics about him like hes 5" tall and never won the internationals,you would say thats a lie, thats not him at all,even though they may believe thats mark its not hes like 6" something and a 2 time champion.Its the same with God you can say hes unknowable nonexistent ,a rock, a statue, whatever,but just because youve convinced yourself of a lie doesnt make it true.the bible clearly defines his nature. try getting to know something about him that hes gave us instead of the god you fashioned.
Romans 1:18-20" the wrath of god is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness,since what may be known about god is plain to them,because god has made it plain to them.for since the creation of the world gods invisible qualities -his eternal power and devine nature-have been clearly seen,being understood from what has been made,so that men are without excuse."
remember there is hope in jesus christ believe and repent of your sin.
 
Isn't the bible (or at least the new testament) a book that's been written a couple of hundred years after the death of the man you call Jesus Crist. And was in your opinion the world "created" in 7 days. Did man really start out as Adam and Eve and didn't we evolve from 1 cell creatures that started life thru a mixture of substances, oxigen and sunlight? Is it tru that we didn't evolv from a line of very clever (not my opinion) monkeys??? Please enlighten me.
If you tell me there is more than just life, than I am not the one to to disagree, but don't tell me I am a sinner just becours I don't live in your reality.


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saved from your sin and eternal judgement,for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of god-the wages of sin are death.regardless of what our inner reality tells us humans have a tendency to lie so we make up our on reality to suppress the truth.

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Man, someone has made you really scared. Is that the way to rule the world?
 
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In the humanistic view of god hes is unknowable ,so then in mans imaginative mind they think they have and excuse for the wickedness they perform daily.

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This sort of attitude is precisely what turns non-christians away from your ideas. Just because I don't hang with the babtists doesn't mean I am living an immoral life.
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(snip)Its [sic] the same with God you can say hes unknowable nonexistent ,a rock, a statue, whatever,but just because youve convinced yourself of a lie doesnt make it true.the bible clearly defines his nature. try getting to know something about him that hes gave us instead of the god you fashioned.

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I could say the same of you--just because you've convinced yourself the bible is "truth" does not make it so.
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Romans 1:18-20"
remember there is hope in jesus christ believe and repent of your sin.

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I guess I'm best described as agnostic. I tend to believe in something like what you call God (I call it Tao) but I accept that I will not know anything for sure about the world beyond this one before I die. Believe what you want, but stay out of my business--thanks just the same.

I try to give prosyletizers the benefit of the doubt. You probably believe firmly in what you've said and want to help me get to heaven, so for that, thanks. But I'm pushing 40 years old now, and I've heard it all before. you are most definitely not going to convince me you're right with a couple of drive-by condemnations of my life, which you know nothing about.

K
 
keith i respect your opinion and believe youve heard the truth before maybe even grew up in the church and you are right i cannot convince you only god can.i have to obey gods calling in my life and show gratitude for saving me.i really want you guys to experience the love and joy i have found in christ.before christ saved me i had a horrible life drugs,violence,hatred but mainly the hidden sins of pride and selfishness.i had no peace about my life or my future or the destination of my soul and really didnt care.i shared the exact same views about christianity that u guys do and didnt want anyone telling me about how bad i was .one day a guy had the courage to share christ with me and as time past god changed my heart about everything and gave me a true hope and i finally repented and believed.i dont care how old you are or what youve done if your willing to turn from sim and believe in christ u can be saved.im liveing proof i was the worst of the worst the meanest person i knew,but you have to be willing to admit your sin and be honest about yourself and have faith in christ payment on the cross or youll will never be saved i got much love for yall and hope u seek jesus
 
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before christ saved me i had a horrible life drugs,violence,hatred but mainly the hidden sins of pride and selfishness.

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Are you telling me you where a pushover that went on drugs, hated everybody and had no pride in yourself?

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i had no peace about my life or my future or the destination of my soul and really didnt care.

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I am really sorry for you, but I have peace in my life and my future and I do care.

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i shared the exact same views about christianity that u guys do

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No you don't

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and didnt want anyone telling me about how bad i was

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Everyone can and I do take notice.

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one day a guy had the courage to share christ with me and as time past god changed my heart about everything and gave me a true hope and i finally repented and believed.

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Was this another pushover moment?

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i dont care how old you are or what youve done if your willing to turn from sim and believe in christ u can be saved.

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saved? what you tell me scares the crap outa me.

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im liveing proof i was the worst of the worst the meanest person i knew,but you have to be willing to admit your sin

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What sin, the one doing no drugs, not hating everybody, or the one that I have pride in what I do and stand up for.

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and be honest about yourself and have faith in christ payment on the cross

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Try again and don't dismiss something that is hard to believe (I know you can). http://www.carotta.de/eindex.html

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or youll will never be saved i got much love for yall and hope u seek jesus

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If you really love us stop harrassing us by telling us that we NEED to be saved.


Maybe you can answer my questions, i will copy them again below:


Isn't the bible (or at least the new testament) a book that's been written a couple of hundred years after the death of the man you call Jesus Crist. And was in your opinion the world "created" in 7 days. Did man really start out as Adam and Eve and didn't we evolve from 1 cell creatures that started life thru a mixture of substances, oxigen and sunlight? Is it tru that we didn't evolv from a line of very clever (not my opinion) monkeys??? Please enlighten me.
If you tell me there is more than just life, than I am not the one to to disagree, but don't tell me I am a sinner just becours I don't live in your reality.
 
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Isn't the bible (or at least the new testament) a book that's been written a couple of hundred years after the death of the man you call Jesus Crist. And was in your opinion the world "created" in 7 days. Did man really start out as Adam and Eve and didn't we evolve from 1 cell creatures that started life thru a mixture of substances, oxigen and sunlight? Is it tru that we didn't evolv from a line of very clever (not my opinion) monkeys??? Please enlighten me.

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to ur first question: No, it is a historical fact that most of the letters of the bible were being circulated the first hundred years after christ's death.

second question: actually the world was created in 6 days. god rested on the 7th day.

third question: yes, god created adam and eve. do u really believe that old one cell theory. if we really evolve from one cell shouldn't we still keep evolving. why are we still human? where did that single cell and that mixture of substances come from? modern science proves that theory wrong with the two major laws of thermodynamics. 1. matter cannot be created or destroyed, 2. we go from order to chaos; not chaos to order.

monkeys? come on, u actually believe that? then why are there still monkeys?
so u are trying to tell me that the millions of different species on this planet evolved from one single cell? that takes great faith. from a microscopic amoeba to a blue whale. and where are the missing links? see, this is just a theory to disprove god to escape judgement. but, even modern science disproves this theory already. do ur homework.

if i am harrassing u, don't read what i got to say.
 
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if i am harrassing u, don't read what i got to say.

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After those answers? Yes I stop reading this thread.

Looking forward to discuss with you on other threads on treebuzz, but let's leave religion on this one.

Wolter /forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
In a small attempt to interject a bit of tree into this discussion, I'd like to get an answer to this question?

Where did angiosperms and gymnosperms come from?

Define theory, in your own words, not a cut/paste from a dictionary or some memorized line.

Define belief, same as above.
 
jc, you hold a very narrow view of things, which is of course your prerogative to do.

I'm quite familiar with the judeo-christian scriptures as a result of independent study. Admittedly I have not spent too much time in some of the pseudo-historical books of the old testament such as those which recount the genealogies of the patriarchs, etc. as I found them quite boring in such respects and could not figure out how it really would benefit me to become deeply acquainted with them.

The book of Genesis has two distinct accounts of the creation. Compare them carefully side by side and you'll see the stated order of events is not even the same. If a student of the writings wishes to honestly maintain a firm belief in their accuracy/validity, the student must accept that the accounts (one or both) cannot be expected to be taken literally, but instead in a symbolic way. You must remember that the people of the time did not approach such things with a scientific mindset such as a typical person would today. The book of Genesis, along with the other early-by-order-in-the-canon writings were most likely not preserved [i.e. written] until some time during the Babylonian captivity. Remember, this was a time when people generally still thought the sun and moon traveled from one end of the flat earth to the other and somehow magically crossed back to the starting point during their "off" time. The creation account does not attempt to explain how God created things, merely that he did.

The components which make up the earth and at least our solar system are quite accurately dated (via many different methods) at several billion earth-years of age. Even if the measurements were only at a 1% level of accuracy (they're not) the newest the earth could be would be a minimum of 40 million years old. A lot can happen in even that amount of time, as you'd have to concur.

I have to say that I believe in the one true God as depicted in the "bible", but I also have to leave room for the many millions of other people on the planet who follow even older writings. And I would have to say that my idea of him is likely quite different than yours, so don't immediately jump to the conclusion that we'd be buddies at church camp.

Humans are indeed evolving even within our relatively short recorded history. We see evidence of evolutionary adaptation all around us in many things and ways. Just yesterday I heard a news blip about some new strain of whatever that's adapted to be immune to antibiotics and has been found in the general populace here in this country.

Look at dogs, cats, and various plants as further examples of change over time.

Sure, you might argue that some of those changes were brought about by an outside influence; namely man; but nobody is saying that evolution is a spontaneous self-thought-out change from one life-form to another. I believe that God created us and that evolution was one of his tools. What do you say to that? The bible doesn't say so? Well, the bible doesn't say "not so" either. In fact, the bible is quite silent about just about any and all matters of science, isn't it? In fact, the bible doesn't even say this was the first configuration of the material which makes up this planet.

I'm not attempting to proselytize here, and I'd appreciate it (as well would most of the others, I'm sure) if you didn't preach here either. Though in a sense it's somewhat amusing to hear one speak "authoritatively" when they obviously are neophytes themselves.

Thanks for your consideration in this matter,
Glen
 
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Where did angiosperms and gymnosperms come from?

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Sorry Tom, I have no clue but that's a language problem I think (most of my early posts I used a dictionary, but I don't bother anymore)

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Define theory, in your own words, not a cut/paste from a dictionary or some memorized line.

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Ha, this time I am gonna quote someone else but it is too good not to mention:
Theory is knowing how it works, but it doesn't. Praxis is seeing it working but you don't know how :-)

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Define belief, same as above.

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Knowing that if there is no stress on your friend and brother in arms that he is gonna win the Dutch TCC. You don't have to know, to be sure that when you do it his way thing will work out aswell.
Belief is knowing that your 7 year old son is growing up in a great world. What more can you want for a boy to live his life with global warming and a massiv climat change ahead, is that exiting or what /forum/images/graemlins/smilie_schreck.gif

Wolter
 
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And I would have to say that my idea of him is likely quite different than yours, so don't immediately jump to the conclusion that we'd be buddies at church camp.


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Thanks Glen, that made my week /forum/images/graemlins/rotflmao.gif

Dave
 
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