Is it big enough?

NickfromWI

NickfromWI

Participating member
Location
Los Angeles, CA
Hello Folks-
Today was a bit rainy and boss didn't wanna work, so I was home needing to fill some time. "SPLICE SOMETHING" popped in my head. But what?

I decided I am going to run a little test. This weekend I made a short friction saver, about 2 feet long...my current one is about 4 feet long. I really liked the shorty, so I decided to make another one, a foot and a half long. I was looking at the rope I had and came upon some 3/16" New England Ropes Sta-Set (1,200lb MBS...around five or six kN)

So I was thinking "...Would that be strong enough to hold me safely? Could I get away with that???? I really think I could!"

However, with such a tiny MBS, I did not feel safe climbing on it just to see if it'd work...so I needed a back-up, in case this stuff did break (Which I don't think it will). So I decided to make another eye-and-eye sling out of some 5mm V-12 (vectran single braid) with a MBS of 4,750lbs (around 21 kN)...that's more like it, right?

So what I did was make the Sta-Set 17" long, then I made the V-12 19 inches long. The plan is to clip the big and little ring of the friction saver (a double-locking pear-shaped 'biner and a screw-locking quick-link) to BOTH of these eye-and-eye slings. The Sta-Set, being shorter of the two will be the one holding my weight. If it were to some how break, I'd have a 4,000lb sling to catch it!

So what do you think? Check out the picture...

love
nick
 

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Here is the picture of the finished product...

Both slings are protected in a piece of 1" tubular webbing.
 

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I just made a new one also, made it from 12" of chain to throw over a strand.
The rope runs through two clevis type shackles.
The standard fc had me suspended too far from my work.
 
Am I reading this right?

Did you say you made a friction saver made of chain? That's seems a bit harsh on the trees? Please explain in more detail.

love
nick
 
Your MBS for your 3/8" Sta-Set is wrong. I know that the 5/16" is 3000# and the 7/16" is rated at 6000#. I have two friction savers I spliced out of the 7/16" Sta-Set and I use them every day. They seem to be wearing very well for the 2+ months I've used them.

I just looked up the 3/8" over at SailNet and they list it with a 4400# MBS. (prices have gone up since I last looked)
http://www.sailnet.com/store/item.cfm?pid=12452
 
Look closely, Brian

TC165-
If you take a closer look, you will see that I said they were three-sixteenths of an inch in diameter. Check that size out and the strength I quoted should match up.
Sorry about the confusion.

love
nick

PS- Kevin, thanks for the clarification. I feel better now!! I was worried for the trees for a second there!
 
I was thinking that...

Treespyder-
That is a big part of the reason that I think it WILL work. I don't think it'll bust. I like to use a 10:1 safety factor. I am going beyond that here. I'm down to like....7:1. Many rope manufacturers are so bold as to reccomend a four or five to one. So I'm quite confident it'll hold.
I need to get my hands on some 1/8th yalex or something like that. Maybe I should try a shoelace!

love
nick
 
Re: I was thinking that...

Nick I like your inovations and wanting to try new things. I just have to ask why the need for such a small diameter friction saver? I see nothing wrong with it. I just think this is a part in the system we can bulk up on. We don't have to carry or bear the weight of it. The fist FS I splice I made from some 10mm T900. Its small but I like that the core is durable and carries a high breaking strength. I like the idea of light weight but only weight that I have to pull through or carry. Keep building and have fun.
 
good question

Good Question, BigJon. Honestly, I did not try this small size because I think it would be a better size to use. I just want to see how it holds up to the strain. I used it today in a norway maple. It worked just fine.

Regarding the one you said you made of T-900. Did you do a core-to-core splice on that, as reccomended by NER, or did you just do the standard double-braid splice? The core-to-core requires that you bury a LOT, meaning you musta made a heckuva FS!

So, basically, it was because I was bored. Even if I use this thing for a year with no signs of it going to fail, there's no reason for me to switch to something of that strength. But if I had to.....

love
nick
 
Re: good question

Nick, I did do a core to core splice with crazy loops and all the measureing and marking as per Toss video. The FS is 45 inches from end of eye to end of eye. Not quite as long as a standard FS by Buckingham. I have made quite few since that are much shorter from 16 strand. It isn't quite the tuck you have with a climbing line but it works. I just stitch the hell out it with spectra to ensure it stays together. I believe the brummel would be good one to stick in there first on such a short tuck. Kinda hard to splice a ring into a brummel or impossible. Figure that puzzle out.
 
Re: good question

Thin round easier to place and remove than wide/flat rope-webbing?

Is a D's Tail some kind of adjust-meant for D-ring? What, you didn't think i'd follow you h'ear to pester you? <font color="blue"> </font color> ?
 
Re: good question

BigJon, I believe there is a way to get a ring into the
brummel splice. I've never spliced it myself but I believe
it's the way many do it. Take a look at this AS thread:
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?s=&amp;threadid=5014

Nick, and others who splice their prussik cords, the only
splices as I see it that are short enough is the brummel
and the 3-strand splice ?
Eye-n-eye double braid splices for instance can't really be
shorter than 60-70 cm, if both splices should fit, too long
for most friction hitches, am I missing something ?
I can do double braid, 3-strand and marlow braid, but need
something for the hitch on my FS. Tenex and Ultra-tech
are not sold over here :(
 
Re: good question

An eye splice in 1/2" rope requires a 12" bury.
2 x 12" =24" + eye length.
A standard eye to eye tenex is about 31 or 32 inches oal.
3/8" requires a 9" bury.
Shouldn't be a problem with 3/8 or 1/2".
 
I love splice-talk!

"I believe the brummel would be good one to stick in there first on such a short tuck. Kinda hard to splice a ring into a brummel or impossible. Figure that puzzle out." ...Bigjon

Bigjon- It's not hard to splice a ring onto a Brummel. If you are talking about Mobius Brummel, where you send one end through itself all the way, then send the whole eye through, etc, yes, that is impossible, unless the ring fits through the rope! However, with what JPS refers to the through, through, bury Brummel, the ring is a snap to put on. Getting one on each side shouldn't be much tougher, if you know the trick ;)

"...Eye-n-eye double braid splices for instance can't really beshorter than 60-70 cm, if both splices should fit, too longfor most friction hitches, am I missing something ?" ....Hillbilly

HB- Yeah, in a 3/8th's diameter double-braid, the smallest eye-and-eye sling I've made is 22inches, about 55cm. However, you say 60cm is too long for most friction hitches. It seems to me that a lot of people around here are using somewhere around 24inches/61cm. This would be for a 3 over 1 distel or Sway-bitch. Which knot are you using, and would a distel be adequate for what you're doing? And remember, you don't necessarily need Tenex. You are just in need (maybe) of a good polyester single braid. Maybe someone there sells Yalex. Does Marlow make a singlebraid? They might not.

my two pennies.

love
nick
 
Re: I love splice-talk!

My friction hitch is 22 inches eye-to-eye. I use
the 4 over 1 distel.
I'll have to try again, but the shortest splice I managed
to do was a bit more than 70 cm or 27 inches on marlow braid, which calls for 2*35 cm bury.
Don't one need some rope between the two splices
to keep some slack in when doing the second eye ?
Can the two tapers of the splices be so close as to touch
each other ?

Marlow, Roblon and Poly-ropes are what is available
over here. No New England, Yale or Samson.
The shops around here has mainly tightly woven 32-strand
dyneema cords or poyester/nylon 3-strand.

Always fun to talk about splicing.
Here are some alternative splicing instructions I found,
got some nice photo-illustrations:
http://www.englishbraids.com/products/marine/howtosplice.html
 
Re: I love splice-talk!

I've never tried splicing a short eye to eye into anything other than tenex.
I can't say with any certainty how the second bury would react.
 
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