French prussic for DdRT hitch anyone?

southsoundtree

southsoundtree

Been here much more than a while
Location
Olympia, WA
Anybody use a french prussic?

I usually use it with a eye and eye beeline with good success. Its only problem is that it maybe doesn't set easily 100% of the time, but seems to work well and is responsive for descents without locking up, and tends well with a hitch minding pulley.
 
I often use the Val and sometimes the val-tress. I like it because it breaks easy, doesn't creep to lock but if there is too much tail, you are right, it doesn't always bite as fast as I would like.

All I use are tenex eye & eye's so it may be I don't have the right stiffness for the V & VT. By and large though, I go with the V if I have to add a second tip or my LJ is not doing what I want it to.
 
I have been using it with the local swat team for tactical rope work. They have been using a Eight descender with a french prussik on there leg. Works great and they dont have to worry about locking off the eight when faced with having to stop and unload Gods will on someone. Ya I know a little of topic but hey just another way to use it.
 
i could be wrong, but i think the french prusik is for ascent ONLY. i believe most, if not all, prusik knots are ascent only because they have little control on descent. like i said, im not 100% on this and dont have "On Rope" in front of me. a figure 8 should be used on descent if you are gonna do this, or something of that nature
 
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i could be wrong, but i think the french prusik is for ascent ONLY. i believe most, if not all, prusik knots are ascent only because they have little control on descent. like i said, im not 100% on this and dont have "On Rope" in front of me. a figure 8 should be used on descent if you are gonna do this, or something of that nature

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Huuuuh??? Guess I have been using the wrong hitch for the past 15 years, cuz my version goes up and down.
 
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i could be wrong, but i think the french prusik is for ascent ONLY. i believe most, if not all, prusik knots are ascent only because they have little control on descent. like i said, im not 100% on this and dont have "On Rope" in front of me. a figure 8 should be used on descent if you are gonna do this, or something of that nature

[/ QUOTE ] Couple of clarifications here, Just so everyone knows the french prussic is the same as a kleimheist and alot of guys use the knot, including myself, also "on rope" does discourage the use of prussics in srt for descent for obvious reasons but we are talking about Ddrt. The devil is in the details.
 
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Just so everyone knows the french prussic is the same as a kleimheist

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What the foot knid of weed are you guys in NH allowed to smoke. Me thinks you need to read that on rope book and not just use it a a coffee table book.


Klemheist
The Klemheist is an upside-down Hedden Knot. Since the Hedden Knot's holding power is directional, one usually needs more turns to make a Klemheist grip. I find that three or four turns may be needed, as opposed to the two that normally suffice with the Hedden. Despite this, the Klemheist has considerable popularity in climbing circles, particularly in various rescue situations (escaping a belay, for example).
Klemheist
PIC00373a.JPG

Hedden Knot
(a.k.a. Kreutzklem)
The Hedden Knot works nearly as well as Prusik Knot, but requires only one tuck. It is important to pass the sling through as shown by the arrows, since the opposite configuration (passing over at the top arrow and under at the bottom) will cause the knot to bind. It is also important not to tie the knot upside down, since its holding power is directional, but climbers often do so (adding turns to make up for the lost performance). The resulting knot is the Klemheist.
Hedden
PIC00373.JPG
 
Yeah, I'm not sure we have an agreed upon definition for 'French Prusik' yet. I've got the first edition of On Rope and it doesn't mention a 'French' Prusik specifically. I thought the French Prusik was just 5 to seven wraps with both ends tied off to the attachment... but I've never really looked into it, just heard about it so that doesn't qualify either. Anybody have an authoritative reference?

The 'prusiks only go up' thing I do know about though, it has to do with laid rope and which direction you wrap the coils... it's possible to tie it upside down. It doesn't apply to braided rope.

Of course, Brion Toss just handed me my a$$ in another thread so, what do I know?
 
I have an authoritative reference. A french tree climber told me a french prussic is a valdotain tress. VT for short. It's what I climb on and it seems to go up and down just fine.
 
I've heard that too but I just call a VT a VT. My regular hitch is the XT variation.

It's bloody hard to use that as authoritative though... seeing as how it's second hand and all. I was thinking more like a reference somewhere that most of us OCD types can trust.
 
I stand by what I previously said. After researching it the klemheist is a french prussic. Maybe we are getting a little confused here. I use the hitch regularly when footlocking a static line.Alot of guys do the same. Now when it comes to Ddrt in the tree I am not aware of anyone who uses the hitch as part of their system in the tree a more common hitch is the VT. It is quite possible that nomenclature is the problem in this thread I would like to see an actual pic of southsoundtree's climbing setup.
 
Sorry I was being sarcastic. I thought it was common knowledge. What makes an XT?
And as I posted the answer came back that I was wrong. Should of done the research.
 
After a little more research my head is spinning. I have found evidence of the french prusik being:
1.a VT which is what rick wood was talking about and I believe Sean Kroll
2. a kleimheist which was my understanding
and 3. an autoblock knot which is what fairfield was talking about.
so although I can now picture what everyone was talking about better I am now totally confused as to the actual definition of a french prusik!!!
 
XT is a VT with a full twist in one of the braids. It allows the braids to compress without loosening the coils as much. At least I THINK that's what it is... I'm not feeling too sure of myself at the moment.

XT_1.jpg


XT_2.jpg
 
I was talking about 5-7 turns around the rope with both eyes clipped, using a hitch-minding pulley.

I thought that a VT was a fancier version that had a bit of under/ over braiding.

From memory, it seems that a couple of turns could be rolled down from the top of the turns toward the H-M Pulley, but doesn't for the same hitch as a VT.


I ask because I've been experimenting with some different climbing systems.
 
Yep Sean, that's the one I was talking about. Lately I've heard it called a 7-up for 7 rounds turns above the tie-in.

I HAVE used it with core-less 16 strand as the prusik, but only to tie in on a big rope swing, not for working.
 
i thought that a vt and a french prussic where very different. i climb on the vt when ddrt, but use a Klemheist for footlocking only.
 
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