Documenting my hand-sewn eye process

You can do whatever you want man. I'm just looking out for the greater good. Moss might be a heck of a craftsman but he is not a rope scientist or stitching expert. Following the advice of people on the Internet on how to make your own life-support equipment his folly.


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No ones life is worth $20-$30 for a spliced eye! This is a no brainer guys/gals. We spend this much taking a loved one out for lunch/dinner. Now, imagine what goes through there minds if you fall, even 25', you're crippled or dead! They're left feeding you or burying you. Does this thread need to be about who can piss further? Or who's going to live to climb another tree! Which is what WE are ALL about! Stop this...


Dave6390 in WI
 
Wait a minute... aren't the RR, RW, BDB, etc. all life support devices invented by "guys on the internet"... ? I think I've seen a number of others, as well, that said invented by so-and-so in the product description, and none of them turned out to be scientists or engineers, either. I think I may have spotted some of these products being sold by TreeStuff, too.

Come to think of it... Petzl and numerous other gear OEMs were founded by cavers, climbers, mountaineers... and almost none of them were actually engineers or scientists.

OMG!!! We're all gonna die!

Or maybe not. I'm a pretty firm believer in "make the shit, break the shit, work out the bugs, sell the shit" as a reasonable business model. It's called empirical knowledge, and although not perfect, it usually gets the job done. I'm not convinced that anyone on here is stitching eyes with mom's sewing kit and running outside to climb on them without some reasonable testing. I haven't seen anyone suggest doing this and then selling the end product, either. I climb on a saddle, sometimes, that I've heavily modified with a Quick Stitcher... but I didn't test it at 75 feet, either, on the first try.

bonner1040 said:
Following the advice of people on the Internet on how to make your own life-support equipment is folly.
Click to expand...

People handsplice ropes all the time this way. There's no way to control the quality of those splices, either.

Somehow, this seems to be getting blown out of proportion. Maybe we just need a warning, in the public interest:

Do not try this at home. If you do try this at home, be damn sure you test your home sewn splice in a manner that would indicate a high degree of safety. Whatever you do, never die or get injured by a commercially spliced product, because that would mean that... OMG!!! We're all gonna die!!!

:eek:
 
Very True, and articulate. I'm not saying,"Don't, or you'll Die", I'm saying "Do at your own risk, not others", unless tried & tested. Yes, I do believe everyone (almost) has the ability to better our industry/hobby, I try almost every device for climbing & working, but I know that they are tested to the limits that we set as standards for the industry! That's all I'm going to say about the matter, I just see way too much animosity and anguish between people that share a common interest, shouldn't we have a common goal? I'm done w/this thread. I've let others try my gear to see if it made climbing MORE fun, 100% said that it did. So long to the NaySayers!!!


Dave6390 in WI
 
bonner1040 said:
...stitching isnt like splicing.
Click to expand...

I'm not going to argue with that... it's a fairly new way of doing it, and certainly new for the DIY crowd. But, I think that it's like the other things in that this thread could likely do two things that are undesirable... encourage the wrong people to attempt silly/dangerous things, as you've brought up... or discourage the right people from experimenting with the idea to see if it is a viable option, which will only happen with experimentation and testing. That is really my only point. The ones trying it so far have more patience than I do, and I'm a patient guy. It's really not something I want to do because it looks time consuming and, as you've also pointed out, this is not something that is terribly expensive in the first place. I admire you guys for keeping the cost of your sewn eyes at a price point that makes them affordable for the climbers that aren't making the big money.

If I disagree with you, Nick, it's only in part... and only in principle. I actually suspect that you're right, that it will be difficult to come up with a formula (like hand splice directions) that will produce repeatable, predictable results all the time. I also suspect that these guys will have the sense to use two climb lines (one with traditional splice) if they get to the point of testing this idea on an actual climb, until the safety of the idea can be verified. I know that's the only way I'd be willing to test something like this.
 
We do not recommend using hand-sewn eyes for use on Sterling life safety or rigging rope in applications where failure may result in injury or damaged property. Unlike a hand-spliced eye, a hand-sewn eye is not easily repeatable and variations could lead to significant strength differences. Variables that will impact the strength and durability of the tack include thread type, size and twist, tension control of the tread, stitch pattern, stitch speed, foot pressure, clamp pressure, needle size, and needle type to name a few. Some of these variables can be controlled with hand stitching and others cannot.
 
All Gear, Inc. does not recommend hand sewn eyes. The stitching would be too inconsistent to be considered reliable. We would be glad to test for free if anyone wants to send product in for testing. We estimate the results would be surprisingly low.

All Gear, Inc.
www.allgearinc.com
 
JeffGu said:
...If I disagree with you, Nick, it's only in part... and only in principle. I actually suspect that you're right,....
Click to expand...

Yes, Nick is right. With all the other options we have, even ( gasp ) using a knot, I can see no logic in this pursuit.
 
I just straight up don't have the time to invest in doing the hand stitching right. I have thought about it for years, but to be honest it looks like a giant pain in the ass. And knots are not, for the most part.

Also, I do not doubt that Andrew is making some seriously crafted stitched eyes. That I would trust, especially if I weighed as little as he seems to. I might not hang my density on one... But I've done stupider shit.
 
It sure is easy to judge something youve never done yourself. Just watch out showing your diy projects. The hypocrites are everywhere
 
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