DMM Keanu Rigging Trolley - SOLD

evo said:
No just the clip.
Got a few different systems I use on occasion.
Really need to figure out a good way to add a swivel or some how reduce line twist.
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I've never used or even seen a reeve system in action, but would love to have the option for the same hillside situations you seem to be using it in. Haven't found a good video showing the full system either.

Are you setting it up with a tight static line the trolley runs on, anchored in a tree near where you grab the material, tied to a second tree uphill where you would drop the load, then a line for the lift, maybe tensioning/lifting the load with the GRCS, then your winch on the haul-line to pull the raised load uphill?
 
Here is the basic operation. The power sources vary as does the rigging. I’ll change it up depending on the situation and site.
Most of the time we just climb the tail tree and dead end the lines, but I’ve base tied them if the tail tree allows for it. Best spaced about 3’ apart.

For the landing spar I will either hang individual pulleys or a gang of CMI’s with a becket daisy chained with screw links.

Due to the line length involved I will typically use two lateral load lines, or just one and a tag line on the main block.
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Two winches are needed, but with creativity you can get by with one. Shown is how to just do a prussic for a progress capture so you can switch out lines on the GRCS.

Scott if I recall correctly you have a capstan gas winch. I’d use your chipper winch to lift the load to the head rig, and then use the capstan for the lateral. I’ve used my mini skid to lift the load and GRCS for lateral.
I’ll draw up a couple of different rigging setups after dinner.
 
Here is another much more simple system. Essentially a static high line where a block rides laterally suspending a second pulley.
The tail line is on the far side and just a porty to hold and let out as needed. The GRCS pulls the load all the way up to the static line, then starts pulling laterally when slack is introduced on the far side.
I doubt we set it up as a 2:1 to lift the load but that can be done. These were small turns, about arm loads if walking them up hill to a chipper.

You can get a glimpse of the mini skid before I owned it and before the grapple. I fabbed up a bollard on a short boom. Each turn was landed on a long deadeye sling and after a few they were yarded with the mini to the retaining wall and then reset and lifted over the wall.
 
evo said:
Really need to figure out a good way to add a swivel or some how reduce line twist
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If you add a swivel, try one with ball bearings. I found regular swivels, under load, don't rotate freely. I had to reverse the twist by hand. To much tension on 5:1 block and tackle.....
 
Cool, I appreciate the videos and drawings @evo and @Muggs , something to study and maybe setup and play with on my own time/property. As far as pulling/lifting devices I've got my GRCS (and could buy a battery drill for it), the gas Portable Winch and the Bandit chipper winch, so a few options to use, most of the time what I lack is skilled help on the ground, haha.
 
27RMT0N said:
Cool, I appreciate the videos and drawings @evo and @Muggs , something to study and maybe setup and play with on my own time/property. As far as pulling/lifting devices I've got my GRCS (and could buy a battery drill for it), the gas Portable Winch and the Bandit chipper winch, so a few options to use, most of the time what I lack is skilled help on the ground, haha.
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That is the challenge for sure. More so when experimenting with new techniques where you are learning as well. I'll post another system that's more simple, but better for rigging downhill than up.
 
Norwegian reeves are supposed to be simpler for hauling uphill, as long as the slope is steep enough. A single winch is used to lift the load up to the high line, and then move the load laterally. Reeve line terminates at the carriage on the downhill side, instead of running all the way between both anchors like an English Reeve. Simple example shown here:
 
evo said:
Two winches are needed, but with creativity you can get by with one. Shown is how to just do a prussic for a progress capture so you can switch out lines on the GRCS.
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Love this idea with the progress capture to run two lines off the Goods. Pulley at prussic doubles as fairlead. Brilliant.
 
Simple Norwegian reeve, uphill side is to the right. Shown with a haul back line on the left (downhill side) which would probably be unnecessary if the carriage assembly was heavier. Picture by John Lloyd.
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The Norwegian looks pretty simple and very functional in the right situation seeing that video, and I've got a few parts on the way to setup either system now. One of the few things I didn't already have... Certainly one of those situations where it's like "Yah, I can cut that tree down for $200, but it will be another $1,000 to move it uphill to cleanup."
 
27RMT0N said:
The Norwegian looks pretty simple and very functional in the right situation seeing that video, and I've got a few parts on the way to setup either system now. One of the few things I didn't already have... Certainly one of those situations where it's like "Yah, I can cut that tree down for $200, but it will be another $1,000 to move it uphill to cleanup."
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I’m not sure what it’s like on your rocky island, but round here the county requires all cut vegetation to be removed from steep slopes. The only way around that is to get a geotech or geologist to sign off on leaving it. Frequently just pulling it from the slope is the cheaper option.
 
One modification to the Norwegian system is to have the high line double back to the head rig through a block on the tail tree.
This makes the haul back accessible from the spar and the system bi-directional.
This can be setup using a mini skid or other equipment pulling in or out as one control, with a winch on the second.
Or two winches,
Or tightening by hand and slacking with a porty as the main winch pulls the load to the landing.

Anything with some height to it does require a tagline to retrieve the load block, I’ve it’s just as easy to use this tag as a haul back.

This is essentially the other system I was going to draw out.
 
evo said:
I’m not sure what it’s like on your rocky island, but round here the county requires all cut vegetation to be removed from steep slopes. The only way around that is to get a geotech or geologist to sign off on leaving it. Frequently just pulling it from the slope is the cheaper option.
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Why is that?
 
Serf Life said:
Why is that?
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Like most things there is some truth to it, yet it’s interpreted by folks that sit at a desk and just read codes.
Really comes down to if the tree goes on its own its nature and you cannot touch it, but if it is touched it must be removed.
The actual logic is many folks just dump their yard waist over the edge. Piling it up where native understory vegetation is suffocated and damaged. Too much organic matter tends to collect and hold water. Too much material contributes or causes small debris slides or sluffing.
Some areas trees are religiously topped, and retopped. Material is stashed in piles and over the decades it builds up. IMO not speaking to the topping this can be a good soil builder and have a net gain but cannot be abused. Even though it’s written in the codes where topping is illegal within the critical areas, anyone can hire a crooked geologist willing to dumb it down. ‘Trees on bluffs must be topped, when the wind blows it tugs on the roots and causes landslides’ has been written on many reports I’ve reviewed.

Oddly wetlands is hit or miss, sometimes requiring all material must be left in place.

Slightly different but points to how fucken bad it is here. A combination of crooked, lazy and just plain stupid. I applied for a removal permit, the HO wanted to leave a ‘snag’ to carve. After pointing out the tree only had two limbs which were not broken and hanging, the city shot back. “A permit is not required, leaving a tall stump or snag does not constitute a removal”.

Essentially the environmental laws are subjectively enforced and really boils down to popularity contests. The city tops their trees all the time, and wrote out the bluff off 1st street where all the post and pier tourist traps are. They get to top the city’s trees overlapping two critical areas..
 
evo said:
I’m not sure what it’s like on your rocky island, but round here the county requires all cut vegetation to be removed from steep slopes. The only way around that is to get a geotech or geologist to sign off on leaving it. Frequently just pulling it from the slope is the cheaper option.
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Ah, with rules like that I see how you'd be well versed in hauling material uphill like this. We have no rules on slopes specifically, for now at least. Our rules are only in wetlands, or within the 200' shoreline protection zone, though that often has steep slopes in it. The county person doing the shoreline permit may take the slope into account with how they require the work to be done, but that's a judgement call on their part. Sometimes they say 'leave material on the hillside' to emulate a tree naturally falling over or whatever, sometimes they say 'clean the brush but leave a snag', or any other variation. Like your experience, sometimes it makes sense, often times it doesn't.

These days, they can't seem to get their act together to do anything at all. I've got a wealthy customer and work with the property manager (you know the kind of people/properties I'm talking about) who's been trying to get a simple and reasonable shoreline removal permit for like 3 months now, and the county is basically just blowing him off. It's literally this guys job, calling, writing emails, trying to get the county to do their job, and nothing. Hell, it's so bad up here the county fired the entire community development department (construction permits) and has outsourced all permit review to some company.
 
27RMT0N said:
Ah, with rules like that I see how you'd be well versed in hauling material uphill like this. We have no rules on slopes specifically, for now at least. Our rules are only in wetlands, or within the 200' shoreline protection zone, though that often has steep slopes in it. The county person doing the shoreline permit may take the slope into account with how they require the work to be done, but that's a judgement call on their part. Sometimes they say 'leave material on the hillside' to emulate a tree naturally falling over or whatever, sometimes they say 'clean the brush but leave a snag', or any other variation. Like your experience, sometimes it makes sense, often times it doesn't.

These days, they can't seem to get their act together to do anything at all. I've got a wealthy customer and work with the property manager (you know the kind of people/properties I'm talking about) who's been trying to get a simple and reasonable shoreline removal permit for like 3 months now, and the county is basically just blowing him off. It's literally this guys job, calling, writing emails, trying to get the county to do their job, and nothing. Hell, it's so bad up here the county fired the entire community development department (construction permits) and has outsourced all permit review to some company.
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Yeah it’s bad. Like really bad. For better or worse the county just points their finger at the arborist to determine the tree risk. The issue is the arborists are frequently sell outs and will make statements like ‘this tree is hazardous, if it uprooted it will move soil.’ I’ve even seen ‘permitted’ removals due to a dead limb on a bluff without any targets!
Or
All these alders must be cut in half! They might wiggle, and never mind the view of Mt Baker. Whatever you do don’t look at the co/dom with the active crack on the property line near the neighbors, they have insurance….

Now the city (on my island) wrote themselves out of any and all critical area restrictions. Yet enforce steep slopes and wetlands. Yet they don’t give a flying F about shorelines?! Just asks for a ‘notice of work’.
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