deadwooding excurrents

L

lumberjackson

Participating member
Location
Portland, OR
Some people I know are building a house in a dense stand of trees. They recently logged most of it to make room for their house. They want all the remaining trees deadwooded. I dont have a picture of this site (most of the trees are giant sequoias), but the trees look kinda like this:

loggingnb0003_2.jpg


How would you guys do this? There are no limbs I would trust to put my rope over, so I was thinking I could use an AFC? How do you install them around the tree when you are not in it? There is one big fir tree in the middle with some good size limbs I could use to get up in the canopy, but the AFC would still be a challenge to install (right?). Most of the trees are between 80 and 120 feet tall, and no more than 15-20 feet apart with the dead limbs in the lower 2/3 of the tree. suggestions? tips? thanks
 
We use a False Crotch on a static like for situations like that. Start by climbing the easy central tree out of the bunch that you can easily work with. Toss your bag in to the next tree.

With using a false crotch we set a single line over a group of limbs next to the trunk. Then we use the single line with 2 opposite and apposed locking biners with our normal ddrt system though the biners. Then we just pull up our ddrt system to the limbs it's slung over and tie off the the single line to the base of the tree or another close by.

Using this system it's important to test your line before you climb since your static line may be over a lateral small enough to break and send you for a little ride. Also we don't prune on the way up since the static line is often on the back side out of sight. We climb to a suitable place, lanyard in, and set our friction saver with the ddrt system. Then we take a through line and toss it into the next tree, drop the static line and work our way down. It works well on bluffs too..

maybe one of the srt guys will chime in.

Good luck.
 
I just re-read your post that the trees are 15-20' apart. Once your in the canopy get a really nice good high tie in and just swing over to the next one.
 
Perhaps more importantly, what is the likelihood of these remnant trees withstanding the wind in the area, especially if there is snow or ice-loading?

From a strictly technical perspective, as Evo said, start as high as possible in the one that you can access, and swing over. You can use a grappling hook, or have someone with a pull rope to pull you over the adjacent tree. The pull rope, perhaps two pull ropes tied together for a better horizontal pull means less risk of damage to the tree and a big swing if your grappling hook comes loose.

Another factor will be pre-construction planning for tree protection, and assessment of root damage for utilities/ heavy equipment.

Are the trees exposed on the outside of the stand, as in the example picture?
 
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Perhaps more importantly, what is the likelihood of these remnant trees withstanding the wind in the area, especially if there is snow or ice-loading?

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the trees were removed from the stand a while ago, and there have already been some brutal storms, with no failures so far.

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Another factor will be pre-construction planning for tree protection, and assessment of root damage for utilities/ heavy equipment.

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the heavy construction (excavation, foundation, etc.) has already been done, and the remaining trees are a good distance from where the house is being built.I'm not too worried about root damage.

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Are the trees exposed on the outside of the stand, as in the example picture?

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I dont completly understand
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So you can't trust the branches above for a good spurless rope access, and you should never spike a tree you're pruning, but it would make things safer . . .

This will take the wisdom of Solomon to decide.

How about a climbing spur on just one leg?
 
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Are the trees exposed on the outside of the stand, as in the example picture?

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I dont completly understand
confused.gif


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In your example picture, there seems to have been a clear cut on the outside of the stand, leaving the trees as remenant forest. If this at all like the scenario that you are asking about, or was this example picture only trying to illustrate that the trees were very tall without strong low canopy growth. If so, they would be more prone to failures.

If the trees are in an intact forest, and tall without low canopy, then the "logging" that took place sounds like it could have been a small operation that cleared around the house, and the timber was harvested.

Just trying to understand the whole situation more clearly.
 
the outside of the stand was left, and some trees in the middle were taken out. so the original trees on the outside are still there. but how would you get into the trees when they have no load bearing branches? I thought about going SRT, and choking the tree with my climbline, but all the dead limbs would get in the way...
 
Sounds like they did this in the wrong order. You could have spiked up the to-be-logged trees, and swung over. Thought you had a good one to climb in the middle, from which you could swing into the others. Perhaps have to combine with a trunk cinching system, as recommended. You can always use a long tied nylon sling choked around the tree to make steps and use a 180* or 540* lanyard wrap for advancing.
 
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it seems like you want us to tell you to spike em. thats not our decision to make. try reading the forum sometime there is a lot of good info in it. try this method http://www.treebuzz.com/forum/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=231315&an=0&page=0#231315 remember life before tree and you still have a job to do efficiently.

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no, I do not want to spike them, as I am not comfortable on spikes, and I dont trust the giant sequoia bark. I saw Ron's thread, and I think that it would work well in some situations, but I think it would be inefficient in my scenario.

there are a few trees with good limbs scattered throughout the stand. I think I will just use those to swing over to adjacent trees.
 
If the problem is having branches to swing FROM, you can use something like the Buckingham ring and ring false crotch/ friction saver with accessory prussic loop/ ring to swing from one tree to the other. An alternate is to use a running bowline with a grigri or other rappel device with a back-up prussic or other way to securely lock off. One you are in the adjacent tree, you will need to use a (pre-installed) pull line that is attached to the bowline to pull it out of the other tree.

With the Ring and Ring choked around the spar, it can be potentially problematic to get the knotted rope through the big ring to release the cinch and retrieve. Don't let yourself get stuck up the tree with only one rope that may become lodged in the other tree at the end, and not enough rope to get down. For this reason and this scenario, the running bowline SRT would be preferable in my mind. If it snags up somehow, you can re-cinch it, lower back to the original tree, and reset it.

The R and R comes free better with a retrieval ball attached to the rope that the overhand knot, particularly from the ground. Retrieval from the angle you would have in the tree is usually better. Hanging it around many stout branches that point somewhat in different directions can be better for retrieval, while keeping the FC/FS near the trunk of the tree. If you had one big enough limb to attach the FC/FS around, make sure that your swing will not pull it away from the trunk. A limb perpendicular to your swing may be best. Two would be better, naturally.

These systems locations would not be dictated by available limbs' locations.


Does this make sense? Seem like it would work?
 
What's even better with Ring to Ring friction saver use is it get a welded ring. Like a through bag ring, or cut off the ring on those red rope bags. Take a small length of through line or bootlace ect, and tie a loop to the ring with it. Then if your rope is spliced girth it to the splice.
No bulky knots to get hung up, and no balls to get stuck going though the hole of the ring.

If you don't have a splice on the end of your rope, I've seen people use a end whipping with a small loop sewn in to it for the same thing.

I know there are photo's floating around for these.
 
The adjustable friction saver is a great tool for trees that you cannot trust one set of limbs. It isn't a tool that is easily installed from the ground though. Especially on tall tightly packed sequoias or firs. Setting a line and going up SRT is the way to go on these trees in my experience.

Every now and then I run into situations where I can't simply throw a line into the tree and ascend. One trick that I do when that happens is to throw a line on one side of the tree, pull my climbing line up, then throw a line on the other side of the tree and pull the end of that climbing line up so it is a half wrap around the tree. A lot of times that is enough security that you can ascend, or you can send a running bowline up to cinch around the truck which is totally bomber for ascending on.

If ascending something I don't know if it will hold my weight, I put my flipine around the tree snugly, and I will also have an adjustable friction saver around the tree with a second climbing line prethreaded. I move both up as I move up just like I would if I were spurring the tree.

Worst case scenario, is to just pick one tree that is the most likely to be a future removal or the furthest away from the house, and strap on the spurs. As soon as you hit a limb, take them off, and then from that tree you can prune all of the others without spurs.

My experience has been that with a bit of creativity and patience you almost never have to take that last option. A lot of other tree climbers in this area would disagree with me on that though. Lastly, if you need help on this job and you aren't too far from Portland give me a call (503) 819-1633. It would be fun to help out a fellow Buzzer.
 
I've done a few large Spruce/fir with the Wraptor this spring. I would set up on one, trimming my way up. transfer to an adjacent tree to work my way down.

If they are 80-100 ft, then the deadwood probably stops around 60 ft. I've rented SP lifts do do work like this in plantation stand that have been sold off for development.
 
ryan, I like your suggestion with throwing a line up twice, and then putting in a running bowline, but then the line is right next to the trunk. how hard is it to climb srt right up next to the tree?
 
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ryan, I like your suggestion with throwing a line up twice, and then putting in a running bowline, but then the line is right next to the trunk. how hard is it to climb srt right up next to the tree?

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When you are right next to the tree, you can climb the stubs, dead branches, etc, and use the SRT system for a belay system, more than an ascent system.

You can use a friction hitch that advances easily with a minder-pulley, and compatible with srt. If you have enough weight, say the rope bag ( tied up off the of the ground), you will automatically tend your slack while climbing the tree.

You can carry an accessory line to attach to the bowline part of the running bowline, descend on a SRT descent system (rappel device, F8 Revolver, Gri Gri, then pull the RB out with the accessory cord.
 
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