Backing up SRT Ascenders

Tree Access

Tree Access

Location
Austria, Europe
Hi there !
I searched a bit but didnt find the right Thread for my Question (at least not out of the last 4 Years...).

What are the prefered Methods to backup a handeled ascender, preferably ones with Holes at the Top.

I used to do it with Frictio Hitches, but sometimes also with mechanical Devices like Kong Duck or Camp Lift. I dont use the Camp (wich works similar to a Rocker) anymore as I read (even somewhere here on the Buzz I think) about the Problem of the combination with the Foot Ascender (Rocker doesnt grab reliably on tensioned Rope). Thats not the case with the Duck.

What about a Tibloc for Back Up ? I wouldnt like to use because its not flexible (really moves just one way), and there ae some bad stories around of Tiblocs damaging Ropes...

Would you say its safe anyway ?
What do you use ?
What would work for Competition ?

Thanks, and please forgive me my spelling, this is defenitly not my Mother Tongue...

Greetings from Austria ! Where it starts getting cold right now...
 
Tibloc on SRT Ascenders

Hi Max. Your English is excellent. Thanks for your first post here at Treebuzz. Welcome!

In answering your question about using a tibloc to back up <u>single</u> ascenders SRT, I have a picture of that from about 4 years ago when I was trying out the Tibloc as a backup.

Here's the first picture:

200631-tibloc1.jpg
 

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Re: Tibloc on SRT Ascenders

Here is the second. As you can see in these two pictures, it is a Kong dual-handled dual ascender, but only one side is being used.

200634-tibloc2.jpg


Because the ascender top hole is twice as wide on the dual ascender, a caribiner won't fit through it, but a rated stainless steel slideline caribiner will fit through the secondary hole at the top of the ascender. The regular top hole accepts a captive pin (in the United States, called a power take-off (PTO) hitch pin ) for additional security; it prevents the rope from ever being able to escape the ascender shell.

On a single ascender, a caribiner through the top hole, connecting to the Tibloc is very direct, and the rope is blocked from any possibility of escape I probably have a picture of a single ascender linked to a Tibloc. I'll have to look.

What other questions do you have?
 

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Re: backup on SRT Ascenders

Actually, the non-locking stainless biner will fit through the top hole of a dual, but only through three of the four plates.

This picture is shown attached to a Tenex eye-eye tress cord with a VT as backup.

A setup in this fashion is shoddy. Shoddy means less than ideal. the caribiner should be a locking biner, but no locking biners I tried would fit through the top holes of a dual (too big a diameter or not quite the right shape).

200637-tibloc3.jpg
 

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Re: backup on SRT Ascenders

I like to use my foot lock prusic above my hand ascender as a back up. I know if my ascender were to fail my prusic would hold me for sure.
 
Re: backup on SRT Ascenders

Hey TreeMacine, thanks for the quick answer and the welcome.
It reads like you also just tried the Tibloc for Backup and dont use it for Work really. I also don't...
Its annoying that you cant move the Ascender down the Rope even just a bit without taking the Tibloc of the Rope (at least on thicker Ropes).

@ Chevy: Yeah, Hitch on Rope above the Ascender is another possibility, disadvantage for me is to have more stuff between me and the Rope as I always have a (adjustable) connection to the Ascender so i can hang in if I want to (what is the main advantage of Ascenders IMO).

In the moment I a using just a small klemmheist wich I clip (?) into the Biner on the Top Holes of the Ascender, but this isnt the Optimum also I think, because the Rope can get Stuck in the Cam of the Ascender (although it does not for a will now in my System). Maybe I should get some Pictures myself too...

What about all the other "SRT-Guys" round here, what do you use ?
Anyoe using a Ropeman, or Duck or Lift or any other mechanical Devices for backup ?

Or don't you backup at all 8-) ?

Save your answers all you "all-the-time-footlockers" please ;-)

Max
 
Re: backup on SRT Ascenders

Hello Max,

I am also wondering about a better solution for my srt backup. Now i use a croll that i have connected at waist height to get a better center of gravity. It's bulky and i dont really have a lot of advantage from it.

Would like to see what you came up with?
 
Re: backup on SRT Ascenders

Maarten,

What harness do you use? Do you have a picture of your setup?

**************


A chest ascender with a neck or shoulder loop is integral to SRT systems in other rope disciplines. But...trying to find a good way to attach a chest ascender to most arbo harnesses is a challenge.

A chest ascender is really a good way to have a second attachment point AND a backup too. Since the two attachments are so far apart it would be very unlikely to have some event cause both of them to fail at the same time. With almost all of the other setups some event, a branch or twig getting inside, bumping either of the pieces or the climber over-riding the lock-off on both is much more likely than with a chest or low attachment. I don't feel that these other systems are as safe either.
 
Re: backup on SRT Ascenders

Tom,

It is the Treemotion i use. I don't have a picture at this moment.

What i do is i loop a cord true the attachment points for the bridge, basically making a second bridge and clipping in to the bottom of a Croll. I have a loop connected to the top of the Croll that goes over one shoulder.

This is all fair enough. But now it gets messy. I have a hand ascender, where my climbing line goes true a biner clipped in the top hole. I use a spider jack on the climbing line.

The idea is that one can bail out of the ascent via the climbing line as soon as the croll is detached.

But in all fairness it is way to crowed with 2 bridges, croll, spiderjack and the connecting biners. On top of that there is the foot loop. So there is always friction going on.

i just finished a job where we did 60 plus 20 meter and up oaks. Going up and down all day. Today i tied a VT above the hand ascender and left the croll down below. It worked but i am keen on finding a better way of doeing it.
 
Re: backup on SRT Ascenders

That's the best attachment that can be made for the TM. Using a screwlink to attach the chest ascender to the bridge will keep the whole works lower and more streamlined.

In order to have an efficient SRT rig it requires lots of tweaking and fine tuning. Getting everything just right will pay off once it is dialed in. To me, it is well worth the effort.
 
Re: backup on SRT Ascenders

One of the setbacks in my system, something you might have overcome, is the way the climbing rope is connected to the hand ascender.

The problem is that the rope is connected to the opposite side of the handle of the ascender. When weight is put on it the handle turns 180° away from the climber.

Trying to hold the handle with the sideway pressure on it is unnecessarily tiring.
 
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