Arborist Frustrated with Equipment Dealers &Junk!

Guys,
I am an 18 year veteran of the tree industry, and have bought, owned, ran, worked on many different pieces of equipment. Through the years I have bought from individuals, dealers, manufacturers, and other sources. It seems a common problem in the used equipment industry, that ofted the equipment is misrepresented, usually overpriced, and sometimes just plain worn out( although usually this wear is often hidden by a good steam cleaning and a cheap paint job). If you look at most of the dealers in the magazines most of their inventory comes from the major line clearance companies(who have never been known to have a stable concerned workforce or good equipment care and maintenance). If you could see most of the equipment these dealers buy before they "recondition" it you would be horrified. Junk is junk no matter how shiny the paint is. I have many friends who work in that industry and they all agree the equipment almost never gets greased or serviced. I recently learned of an Asplund crew with a chipper with over 600 hours on it and the original oil and fuel filters had never been changed. Do you want to be the one that ends up with that machine from one of these dealers? Here's the bottom line-for the last year I have been agressively investigating used equipment sources and have been looking at many dealers purchases. Frankly it about made my head explode to see how we(the working arborist-trying to make a living with this stuff) are getting "screwed" almost everytime we buy used from a dealer. I can site numerous situations where I have personally witnessed a dealer buy an item for resale and 3 weeks later see it in a magazine advertisement for 3X to 4X what he paid for it. I have witnessed this on anything from bucket trucks to grinders to you name it and it's nuts. Again, I am an arborist with a small tree company trying to make a living and raise a family. I, do though, see there is a great need for an honest equipment provider. If you need a piece of equipment, or would simply like some advice on buying a piece of equipment, Please email me or give me a call. Over the last year I have developed a number of sources for GOOD EQUIPMENT (I am a well seasoned mechanic and fabricator, and know what equipment ought to look, sound, and run like; and ex Asplund trucks just don't cut it! Before I sell anything it gets properly checked out and inspected(engine, coolant system, air or hydraulic brake system, wheels/hubs/bearings/seals, transmission, clutch, driveling (U-joints,etc.), fuel tank and lines, rear end, front end, EVERYTHING! The mounted equipment gets ispected by an actual certified aerial lift shop (not some mobile mechanic). I am just beginning this venture but it has been a while in the making. If you are in the market for something Call or Email Me and I'll let you know what ballpark cost you would/could expect and what is available or coming available, and I assure you it will be the best, most affordable equipment you ever buy! Thanks! Daniel Matthews (256)351-1299
 
You need to look up the Foxfire series of books. In one of the original books there is a story/interview with some old timey horse traders. They go on and on about all of the tricks that horse traders would go through to disguise worn out horses. ALL of those tricks have been updated to machinery!
 
Tom,
You are absolutely correct. My father has had that entire series of books in his office for years. And they have definately adopted the "tricks". It's quite sad actually.
 
My favorite is the guys that buy the used trucks and put a giant chip box on it even with a grapple loader and then claim its under cdl.So now you got this worn out truck with all this weight on it -probably cant even get up a hill with a load and chipper behind it good luck stoping down a hill.Hope they never actually get on a scale-gee i thought that 35 yard chip box with the grapple and 12000 lb chipper was under cdl.I see the big dealers at our local auctions then I see the truck they just paid 10k for going for over 30k in the tree trader its got a new paint job and some little shiney bells and whistles.Then some poor sap gets a loan for that thing.I say buy new or buy it yourself wholesale otherwise you might get hosed.
 
I can actually think of another time this bucket went for 2400 at a local auction.We all new it had a bent frame and drove sideways down the highway.Dude bought it put it on ebay and got 7500 maybe more for a total piece of junk.
 
I agree completely. I STAY AWAY from dealers as much as I can. With a dealer they are (hopefuly not all) professional cover up er's. They try to fix something easy and if it's going to be big try to pass it off a "a small fix they don't have time for" And just by being a dealer the don't know anything about it.
Every time I've dealt with a dealer I get pissed and pay more than I could have. Which I've only bought one car from a dealer in my life because I needed it then.
What I've done so far is try to buy from an individual (craigs list, a little on ebay) then you can get a feel for the person and ask the right questions to try to get a good idea on it. Of course this only works if you are a mechanic AND do your research.
Buying equipment is always a gamble but this way you don't have the cards stacked against you as much. This method does require patience however.

Good luck with this. When Jeremy Brown was telling me about you that is one thing he said that you are particular on the maintenance of your stuff. I'm the same way. My chipper and stump grinder gets greased at least every 4 hrs but realistically every couple hrs. At the end of each day and the beginning if it hasn't been run the day before. Each piece has it's dedicated grease gun that stays on it and doesn't go anywhere else. I've saw the effects of poor maintenance and it is NOT worth it.
 
One of my competitors here in town bought one similar to that. I think he got it from Sunrise Equip.. It was a 1995 Ford F800 with the 5.9L cummins and a standard 5 speed, but had been outfitted with a 16 foot box with 6 1/2 foot sides. Oh, it could haul a lot of chips, but after hooking up his Vermeer 1800- it was needless to say a "problem"
 
Crazy jimmy thats exactly how I got my chip truck. Bought it from a farmer with a shot bed for 2500 but overall pretty good put 1200 into steel and 500 for power steering pump and built the bed all myself and have a truck for a little under 5000 It's not perfect but It's what i could afford without getting a loan.
Looking back I would have built the bed a little smaller but I was going for the least cuts and was thinking of maybe hauling brush with it rather than just chips. I NEVER have had it more than 1/2 full. With my 1250.
 

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Some guys buy them and get a plasma cutter and put like 2 feet on the top of these things and the crazy part is they were towing the cdl line prior.then they turn around and sale it under cdl cause thats what the title says.I wonder if one of those flipped could the dealer be charged with negligence if someone got really hurt.I guess it just frustrates me with the lack of honesty
 
As a person looking for my first chipper this is a depressing post. Can't trust a dealer and I can't trust a private party to tell the truth, I am not a mechanic and do not play one on TV. How does someone like me buy a used chipper?

Chris
 
Well your first chipper is always going to be your hardest one to buy. In my opinion private party's actually tell the truth more often than the dealers do. Even if they don't know as much as a dealer might. I understand your predicament. Even being a mechanic I wasn't familiar with chipper mechanics. What brand are you looking for?
What I did for my first one was got to be friends with the local vermeer shop mechanics (not the sales guys) and said hey I'm thinking about buying XYZ model is there anything to look for in particular. That was very helpful for me. Don't just look like your trying to get free help it's a fine line but if your honest It never hurts. Remember even if you don't buy from them you will at some point need parts and service.

Later they put me on a good deal for my stump grinder and I wasn't even looking for one. They had one in to fix up that was in real good shape that the guy was wanting to sell and just had a few minor things. I bought at the vermeer shop after they put new bearings in it from the owner. I've had it 8 months so far and the only thing I've done is put teeth in it. They can be your friends and look out for you.

In addition to that. I'd say call daniel, a friend of mine used to work for him and he had nothing bad to say about him. I haven't met him in person but we've talked on the phone and he seems like he would try to help you. Even if you don't buy with him I'm sure you could learn a thing or two.
 
I just PM's the gentleman looking for a chipper. As I mentioned to him, profit is not my primary concern. I truly would like to help as many of you as I can get the right equipment, and avoid making often very long lasting financial mistakes buying the wrong thing, either because it is simply a bad machine, or maybe just a bad fit for your operation!
 
The guy I used to work for in Logging a couple bad equipment purchases actually bankrupted him. The were newer machines but total pieces of junk. In the shop with things that we couln't fix in the field once a month on $150,000 machines (logskidders) The final straw was a feller buncher that blew a motor a week after he bought it. Makes me sad to see.
 
What wheeloader is saying is right on. These companies will rip you a new if given the chance, but how do we know he is not like them? Just because he says so? He is prob a super good and honest dude, I am just saying.

D.W.H
beer.gif
 
hi i was wondering where everyone buys there air-knife---air spade i know there are alot of companies out there but i prefer the air knife. i remember i meant a person in rhode island ilder man and his wife selling them but i lost his card and now i am ready to buy one. any ideas guys? or does anyone know who i am talking about? i think they were farmers but i want to say from the midwest. any ideas?
 
buy new. This is the same with every industry...buy used equipment, fix it, sell it for a mark up...standard business procedure..if you have to hire someone to tell you if the piece of equipment you are looking at is junk or not, you should probably not be buying that piece of equipment...

and so what if it is from a dealer...better than buying from joe down the road, he isnt going give you support when you need parts, or have service questions..so if your gonna buy junk instead of a real machine anyways, why not buy it form someone who will support the product.
 
i want to buy new but i can not remember the name of the company that was selling the air-knife. it was a reasonable price. i thought if anyone could remember who the company was at the last conference. they were there. really nice people. anyway any name i guess will do, i google it but all i get is airspade.
 
Most of us are in this industry to provide for our families and make a living(i.e. profit) with the tree work we perform. Profit becomes much more difficult to produce with a "brand new" $128,000 bucket truck, than with,say a very good, used $25,0000-$30,000 bucket truck. Here is where the rubber really meets the road-the truth is until your equipment is paid for(debt free) you aren't really making money. I have yet to meet an arborist with a paid for bucket truck, or grapple truck, or chipper, or you name it who is facing repossesion because he "got behind". I can honestly say I have been at both extremes in business, 6 figures in debt for equipment and debt free(where I am now). I definately prefer the latter. Truly, how many stumps must one grind to not only pay for, but produce a profit on a $50,000 grinder, how much brush must one chip to do the same on a $60,000 chipper. The ANSWER-"A LOT". Oh, I understand there are certain contracts that warrant purchasing new, but for most of us it just doesn't make sense once you "do the math". Unfortunately, in our industry, we a constantly bombarded with: "latest and greatest", "30% more productive", "higher and better", "more powerful"-all fueling a continual discontentment toward our current equipment. I remember years ago when I had only been in business a couple of years. I had an old Chevy C-30 1ton and an Asplund "Chipmunk" drum chipper. Yeah, it beat us half to death when we ran it, but it always ran and I always seemed to have money in my pocket-Hmmmm. No, I'm not saying we should return to those days but I think you understand the point. Let's remember why we do this, anyway.

Daniel Matthews
 
Re: Arborist Frustrated with Equipment Dealers &Ju

Starlet,

You are looking for these guys. I bought mine from them a couple years back. Direct from the factory, but still the same price as dealers. Great customer service.
 

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