Show off them splices

Finished up a splice in a used piece of one of my oldest climb lines...had a few too many knicks and I really wanted to make a secondary Ddrt system for double crotching and trying some of the techniques in the Schultz effect. When I purchased the rope the vendor told me it was poison hy vee from Sherill, however when I extracted the core I discovered a third core. Turns out it was Lava and not Hy vee so I removed the 3rd core and continued with the Samson class 1 double braid instructuons. Spliced turned out nice...just wondering if anyone else has done this with Lava or Tachyon?
 
Finished up a splice in a used piece of one of my oldest climb lines...had a few too many knicks and I really wanted to make a secondary Ddrt system for double crotching and trying some of the techniques in the Schultz effect. When I purchased the rope the vendor told me it was poison hy vee from Sherill, however when I extracted the core I discovered a third core. Turns out it was Lava and not Hy vee so I removed the 3rd core and continued with the Samson class 1 double braid instructuons. Spliced turned out nice...just wondering if anyone else has done this with Lava or Tachyon?
Finished up a splice in a used piece of one of my oldest climb lines...had a few too many knicks and I really wanted to make a secondary Ddrt system for double crotching and trying some of the techniques in the Schultz effect. When I purchased the rope the vendor told me it was poison hy vee from Sherill, however when I extracted the core I discovered a third core. Turns out it was Lava and not Hy vee so I removed the 3rd core and continued with the Samson class 1 double braid instructuons. Spliced turned out nice...just wondering if anyone else has done this with Lava or Tachyon?
 
Finished up a splice in a used piece of one of my oldest climb lines...had a few too many knicks and I really wanted to make a secondary Ddrt system for double crotching and trying some of the techniques in the Schultz effect. When I purchased the rope the vendor told me it was poison hy vee from Sherill, however when I extracted the core I discovered a third core. Turns out it was Lava and not Hy vee so I removed the 3rd core and continued with the Samson class 1 double braid instructuons. Spliced turned out nice...just wondering if anyone else has done this with Lava or Tachyon?
I have done a couple of Tachyon splices and follow the Teufelberger instructions. Third core strands aren't entirely removed just tapered at a different spot. I have no idea how it would affect the splice to remove them but am curious to hear what more experienced splicers think about it!
I do know its one tight splice!!! :LOL:
 
I have done a couple of Tachyon splices and follow the Teufelberger instructions. Third core strands aren't entirely removed just tapered at a different spot. I have no idea how it would affect the splice to remove them but am curious to hear what more experienced splicers think about it!
I do know its one tight splice!!! :LOL:

Trying to post pic but will not load
 
Screw it.. im gunna ask here as opposed to starting a thread on it.. plus i know allot of you like having answers to these types of questions..

So, i bought an off cut if what i assumed was 11mm KMIII.. I received it but, it looks very small compared to other cordage i have kicking around.. I know KMIII comes in 9.5, 10, 10.5, 11, 13 & 14.5. I also know that even though cordage can get very specific in sizing like shown above, those measurements are considered to be "nominal".

So..... what's the fudge factor with these cordages? Half inch over? 1/4”? Are they ever under? Do i really have 11mm KMIII or is it 10.5 or even 10..? I've kinda been through this with the seller before, so contacting him & spelling this out is kinda pointless as he just puts a caliper to it & lists it as whatever it read it at, even if the color/pattern should dictate a different diameter & construction..

It's measuring in @11.4mm but it's significantly smaller than my 11mm tritech which, iirc reads closer to 12mm & then on the flip side it's bigger than my 10mm hitch cords.
I really wouldn't care that much except, i thought this was going to be a good solution for my Zillon but it's stretching those links like crazy & I'm not really comfortable running anything under the nominal 11mm through it.

It really seems more like a 10.5, yet it's measuring above 11mm....sooo....idk. I guess I'm just wondering if there is an official practice out there used to determine cordage diameter, especially when it goes up in half inch increments like that.. If no label exists & the nominal fudge factor is larger than the actual increments themselves & can swing larger or smaller, then what..? How do you know what u got in your hands.. there's gotta be a method that takes those variables into consideration.

Second question, i know technically speaking KMI is only sewable, however, have any of you hand spliced this cordage using a Kernmantle Splicing procedure? Like Fly's direction or any other direction like say, a, Stranded Fiber Parallel Core method? Twisted Fiber Parallel Core method?

Lastly, I've seen some instagram posts regarding hand splicing Drenaline. One method could pass though ZigZag & the other couldn't, but was significantly stronger than a "Slaice". Is there anyone here making progress with this cordage?

Thanks for any input on these cordage/splicing topics.
 
Most of the rope OEMs measure the rope (for QC purposes) at around 50 lbs. of tension. As you said, they are nominal values and will usually be within a few tenths of the advertised diameter.

They also do lots of custom color/size ropes for distributors that want a specific color scheme. Some of these ropes are also marketed for other at height industries and sailing use, so it's not unusual to find variations that don't line up with the arborist listings. My 11mm KM3 Max comes in at around 11.2mm at 50 lbs. and is the black version with yellow or gold tracers.
 
I was able to put a Marlowbraid type splice on 10mm HTP. The limiting factor is the tightness of the cover, letting it expand as the diameter increases. Was there any details on the smaller diameter splice of Drenaline?
 
Most of the rope OEMs measure the rope (for QC purposes) at around 50 lbs. of tension. As you said, they are nominal values and will usually be within a few tenths of the advertised diameter.

They also do lots of custom color/size ropes for distributors that want a specific color scheme. Some of these ropes are also marketed for other at height industries and sailing use, so it's not unusual to find variations that don't line up with the arborist listings. My 11mm KM3 Max comes in at around 11.2mm at 50 lbs. and is the black version with yellow or gold tracers.
Son of a gun Jeff! That's right! I recall that 50lb technique. Thanks for reminding me my friend! I have a feeling if i load what i have it will end up measuring similar to yours..

Have you run this KM-Max thigh a ZZ or Zillon?

I was able to put a Marlowbraid type splice on 10mm HTP. The limiting factor is the tightness of the cover, letting it expand as the diameter increases. Was there any details on the smaller diameter splice of Drenaline?

Right, i would imagine so.. one set of overseas instructions I've seen instructs you to bunch the cover up during a certain step to allow for expansion later on. However, with this KMIII i would imagine that process being rather hard or not bunching up much.

Unfortunately, i was not able to get any deets on the actual process of the Drenaline Splice. However! I was also not able to create an account & read the comments within the instagram account... Sooo... There may be some more info out there.

I also have contacted both people splicing this cordage, i haven't heard anything back regarding the process. One offered to splice it for me while kinda keeping details to himself. The other may or may not have emailed back yet, i have to check that account..

I don't like all the secrecy regarding splicing this cordage... Eventually someone outside that loop will post the process & their break results, so in the meantime, wtf.. just let it be known & move the innovation along.
 
Have you run this KM-Max thigh a ZZ or Zillon?

I've used it on both. To be honest, it's a little slick and small for both of them... links are stretched out pretty far. Those devices both are made for ropes at least 11.5mm and perform better on them, especially ropes with more cover friction. The Zillon works very well on TriTech, which is fatter than the advertised 11mm. For the ZigZag, which works well on every rope I've tried between 11.5mm and about 12mm, I have personally liked the Yale 11.7mm ropes (Aztec is the one I have the most of) and my new favorite is DrenaLINE, which is 11.8mm kernmantle.
 
I've used it on both. To be honest, it's a little slick and small for both of them... links are stretched out pretty far. Those devices both are made for ropes at least 11.5mm and perform better on them, especially ropes with more cover friction. The Zillon works very well on TriTech, which is fatter than the advertised 11mm. For the ZigZag, which works well on every rope I've tried between 11.5mm and about 12mm, I have personally liked the Yale 11.7mm ropes (Aztec is the one I have the most of) and my new favorite is DrenaLINE, which is 11.8mm kernmantle.

Yes, my thoughts exactly!! It's like you read my mind..lol. "Slippery", it felt like it was greased, part of me just thought "new cord", however i know it's just the size/construction. I better stick to my fake 11mil... tritech.. lol. Not for nothing but i absolutely love Tritech... just wish i had a longer hank of it. What's awesome is, every rope related issue I've had regarding lanyards doesn't exist with Tritech... I've had 0 hitch cords that bind, refuse to grab or have trouble self advancing & i can also completely regulate the zillion smoothly in a Srt configuration.. almost as if it was meant to be used in that configuration without additional friction needed.. its deff hard on the cord, but even with my fat ass, i had control... all 15ft or so anyways..lol

I do like Drenaline in my ZZ... just wish i never got that damn sewn eye on there... Also, i wish that the actual hand splice for it wasn't top secret.. The splicing community interested is so small in relation to the Arb industry that i can't see them losing business by spilling the secret sauce.

I've also been meaning to try the Aztec you mentioned, just for the fact I've heard it's one of the best 11.8 ZZ cordages out there, & you can splice it no problem. I should have some by now, but i made the mistake of trying Cousin's 12.5 Lignum with a "passable splice". I should have known i wasn't going to like the amount of stretch in it & that 12.5 was probably pushing it in terms of their design being passable through a ZZ.. But the ANZI "compliance" on that particular cordage was reassuring, so i jumped on it instead of their smaller options..
 
...you can splice it no problem.

It was the first doublebraid I tried to splice... it was a mess. I then practiced on some rigging doublebraid ropes because they're much easier to get right, since the braid is pretty loose. I then spliced some AllGear Cherrybomb with good luck, before trying the Aztec, again. I've spliced it many times, since.

I have a sewn eye on one end of my DrenaLINE... and on all of my kernmantle ropes... what is it that bothers you about them?
 
It was the first doublebraid I tried to splice... it was a mess. I then practiced on some rigging doublebraid ropes because they're much easier to get right, since the braid is pretty loose. I then spliced some AllGear Cherrybomb with good luck, before trying the Aztec, again. I've spliced it many times, since.

I have a sewn eye on one end of my DrenaLINE... and on all of my kernmantle ropes... what is it that bothers you about them?

Yeah, you know i heard that once about the Aztec & it made me wonder because i had thought its part of the Yale 11.7 -11.8 family, you know, Blue Moon, Poison ivy etc? Correct? Which lead me to my next impression, which was that Blue Moon was a pretty friendly splice. Looking back, do you think it was just your method you may have stumbled with at first, or would you still consider it a pita?

As far as the Sewn eye.. yeah.. idk Jeff.. it's always just been.... idk.. a thorn in my side compared to the slaice that should have been suggested at the time.. It is just a constant struggle whenever i want to include hardware somewhere.. won't fit through, gets stuck on, won't thread a pinto with a biner, won't fit my snake tail, no small xrings, no rook pulley, no cocoon, no pulley saver, always gotta plan ahead with larger rings. Then if i use larger rings too easily pass the eye, idk if i can have that same ring block a knot for something like a Srt to Drt changeover.

It's actually the main reason i learned how to splice, the sewn eye either wouldn't easily thread certain ringed savers i had at the time or was always jamming on something i wanted to leave in place...
Right.. yes, i know there's work arounds for some of what i just mentioned, but it's just a basic un-capatability with alot of the gear i have.

Speaking of which.. & again sorry, this question is not splice related, but more so SRT.... Does anyone know if a Ring 34 will knot block safley, as in a Srt Canopy Tie? I know Richard has done some break testing with these scenarios, but it was all in a 28mm ring.
 
...or would you still consider it a pita?

It's just a tight weave and I had trouble with it. Others with splicing experience told me it probably wasn't a good choice to start out with, and it gave me a lot of trouble. Once I practiced with looser ropes, it was much easier... I think I just needed to get some easier ones done correctly to get a feel for how it is supposed to go together.
 
Right right.. like trying your first with Tachyon.. I personally think the best advice for a first time splicer is a soft fid or anything tube like that is thin, slick, flexible & will finger trap around a core when pulled.
I had the hardest time with splicing until i used one, after that, 90% of cordage we climb on is a peice of cake & most troubles I've read about here could be solved with one vs hogging out more material/strands..
 
Hey, @Joeybagodonuts! Thanks for your previous post! I was wondering if you would not mind providing a link to the type of tool you are referring to in your post above. I'm having a hard time picturing it in my mind. Thanks in advance for any help you provide with this request.

Tim
 
Whats that, the soft fid?
I've never bought one & usually make my own, but i think D-Splicer offers one..
Yeah here's a product page with some pretty clear info on instruction way better than I could explain for you.

Also, it's pretty much same principal as wesspurs basket fid..

The cheapest thingv Ive seen people use is expandable sleeving. Same stuff you use to protect electrical wiring. Expands in & out like finger trap accordian.
 
Hey, @Joeybagodonuts! Thanks a lot for the link, and for your additional commentary about it. I really appreciate you taking the time and trouble to do so.

Tim
No prob bud.. you can find that expandable sleeving for dirt cheap on Amazon. It's slick & slides real nice through buries/etc.. of course you have to thread it through before hand with a fid of sorts, but it just slides right through with no trouble.. & in the end makes the real bury a piece of cake.
 
Hey, @Joeybagodonuts! Thanks for foot stomping the expandable sleeving by mentioning it a second time. I think I failed to take proper notice of your comment the first time through. I'm going to leave a link below to a results page for the stuff on Amazon, in case anyone else reading this thread would like to be able to easily obtain some.

I was wondering about what you said earlier about "making your own", whether or not you use the expandable sleeving to do so, or if you use something else? If you do use the expandable sleeving, I was also wondering if you keep an assortment of sizes on hand, or if there is one particular size that seems to work pretty well for most of what you do? Apologies if I'm being a pest with this stuff, but you seem to have found the "Holy Grail" with regard to easing the troubles of most beginning splicers, and I appreciate being able to learn from you. Thanks again.

Tim

 

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