"Trimming" vs. Pruning Driving me NUTS!

Maybe suggest what your talking about once or twice..."Yes we will properly prune those old "trimming" stubs off where they got the "Civil War surgeon" treatment" and..."A maximum Pruning Dose generic guideline removes no more than 25% of the leaves, ideally keeping cuts smaller than around 4 inches. For this particular red oak, I suggest xxxxxxx, looking like yyyyyyyyyy, removing no more than 15%, keeping cuts less than zzzzz inches across at the Branch Collar, keeping the Branch Protection Zone intact and functioning"
 
X4 - on the word snobbery warning.

In this forum, yes, use the correct word and correct others at will. With customers, only do the first part.

Language is a fluid thing, it is constantly shifting and the message it conveys is completely dependant on the context held by the listener, not the speaker. Using industry specific words correctly, and providing a little context can help convey your knowledge on the subject, but you have to be careful to not lecture or correct someone for misuse of industry context they probably don't have.

To illustrate the downside of word snobbery - A few months ago my daughter let a vacuum salesman in to get a "free gift" for listening to him. I joined in to listen as well. He was knowledgeable but he corrected me every time I used the word "vacuum". Apparently he did not sell "vacuums", he sold "suction based surface cleaning machines". He did not sell either of those things to me. :vomito:
 
Depends on who your target client is. Personally, mine is the client who wants to learn and develop their knowledge. It is a fine line to walk between being seen as rude or offensive and sharing your knowledge to educate them for their benefit. When I share my knowledge I make sure to position it in terms of their value proposition. i.e., how it benefits them.

It works as a means of qualifying the clients. Does it eliminate potential work, sure. However, that pushes us to better market our service to those willing to pay for what we offer.
 
This works for me ....
Ok so we'll trim these branches here away from your house. While I'm in your tree I'd like to thin the rest of it out of any future hazard limbs and let some light through. We can do this for x amount more which is cheap insurance for the health of your tree. Sometimes it works and sometimes they just want the fending branch removed. Sometimes A whole hazardous leader is removed to protect the clients home. That puts us back to trimming again. Trimming and thinning are two words the average joe are comfortable with.
 
I've had customers who ignorantly refuse to listen to pruning or crown reductions. But start talking to them about thinning and they listen.
 
I think the most important thing is to communicate to the language of the person hiring. If their language is "pruning" then pruning, if it's "cutting" then cutting, if it's "pruning" then pruning.

If we can speak 3 or 5 languages and still know the native tongue, we will sound smarter, whereas the more limited "tongue" may sound the most ignorant if that's the only language they know.
 
Nice replies everyone and good points from both sides, although I am a bit surprised to see so many who are pro trimming.
I understand how if you come at it wrong then we could offend a customer by correcting them. That is why we need to "educate" them and not just "correct" them. And as far as advertising and the point about the common person knowing what we do as trimming, then do you advertise topping as well? Probably not right? And do you find a way to educate the customer about how topping is not a proper practice? I REALLY HOPE SO! If you can justify not advertising topping then you should be able to justify not advertising trimming. EDUCATE, EDUCATE, EDUCATE!
 
TreeVB said:
And do you find a way to educate the customer about how topping is not a proper practice?
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Yes. I do explain that a "real" arborist would advise against such a practice because it disrupts and weakens the grain/fiber structure, but I'm not an arborist, and if topping is what someone wants from me, that is what they will get. Heck, I top my own trees every 6 years or so. Feel free to consider me uneducated, under-educated, ill-informed, a part-time hack or whatever. I will trim my own trees any way I please.

PS - I'll understand if those who wish to remain anonymous do not bother to "Like" this post.
 
Hoowasat said:
Yes. I do explain that a "real" arborist would advise against such a practice because it disrupts and weakens the grain/fiber structure, but I'm not an arborist, and if topping is what someone wants from me, that is what they will get. Heck, I top my own trees every 6 years or so. Feel free to consider me uneducated, under-educated, ill-informed, a part-time hack or whatever. I will trim my own trees any way I please.

PS - I'll understand if those who wish to remain anonymous do not bother to "Like" this post.
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I think I will take a moment and speak for the majority of people on this forum and just say that you sound like a 100% HACK. No part time about it and you have no right to be anywhere near trees, or on this forum as you come off to not want to learn anything proper. And yes, I would say you're a BIT under educated as topping does a hell of a lot more than disrupt the grain. I feel bad for any property that you ever touch and wish there was a way to inform your clients of the potential value you are stealing from them through tree misstreatment. ROOKIE!
 
Levi.CO said:
Damn... is it lonely up there? In your tower???

What's the big stink about, anyways? If you're secure in your knowledge and practices then why are you so worried about others? Besides, much of the "proper" way to care for trees is speculative and relative. I like the quote from my friend Mick "often the tree had failed to attend the seminar about how it should grow or be cared for..." or something like that:)
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Hmmm....lonely? Na man. I've got a beautiful wife and a pretty sweet job. How about you? You lonely? You have posted twice in this thread with zero helpful/thoughtful input. Sorry if this topic offends you but you don't have to pay attention to it.
I guess I could have worded it differently but I was really just looking for a "fit" for the word trimming in our industry as previously stated. I have a passion for what I do and can't stand when hacks take away from our industry.
 
TreeVB said:
... you sound like a 100% HACK.
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Ouch. That hurt a little. I don't think I'm a 100% hack. I'm more like 99% hack. Why? Because when I'm not doing a removal, and I'm only trimming a tree, I ascend by rope and don't wear my climbers (AKA: spikes, spurs, gaffs ... you know ... for those hell-bent on specific terminology).
 
@TreeVB I think I am starting to see a pattern here that might be the source of your problem. You started out saying you wanted to improve the vocabulary and professionalism of the industry, however when someone from the industry disagrees with you, you stomp on their marbles and tell them they aren't allowed on the playground.

The good news is your quest for industry improvement can start with A LOT fewer people than you originally targeted, really just one.

Oh I'm not an arborist either, but @Hoowasat no offense but you do kinda sound like a hack :risas2:
 
Yeah you guys are probably right. Sorry for potentially upsetting you regulars. And Howie, I was a wee bit out of line there so I'm sorry for that. I have no right to to judge your work as we've never met and besides, you were most likely partially messin with me anyways. I'll be done with this thread as it is turning out to be fairly petty. Climb on fellas!
 
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