- Location
- Retired in Minneapolis
Great tips, Northwind.
Top Safety Tips
- Thread starter Katie
- Start date
- Location
- Retired in Minneapolis
Oh yeS!!!!
First Responder covers much more! The place where FR sits is between first aid and EMT arrival. Since many times we work in remote addresses where it is likely going to take EMTs precious time to arrive the care needs to be much higher than what is learned in FA classes. Then, in the tree??? We're in the 'wilderness' for EMT care...not minutes away...half/full hours could go by during a rescue. How to respond?
My suggestion to everyone who wants to make their safety program better is to have first aid kits built to OUR needs not ones for office workers. Next, save the money going to 'shake and bake'' FA classes and take First Responder. We don't buy our handsaws at Harbor Fright do we? If so, we can only expect low return on the money spent. See the metaphor?
First Responder covers much more! The place where FR sits is between first aid and EMT arrival. Since many times we work in remote addresses where it is likely going to take EMTs precious time to arrive the care needs to be much higher than what is learned in FA classes. Then, in the tree??? We're in the 'wilderness' for EMT care...not minutes away...half/full hours could go by during a rescue. How to respond?
My suggestion to everyone who wants to make their safety program better is to have first aid kits built to OUR needs not ones for office workers. Next, save the money going to 'shake and bake'' FA classes and take First Responder. We don't buy our handsaws at Harbor Fright do we? If so, we can only expect low return on the money spent. See the metaphor?
I thought you would agree. Our crew consists of three climbers. Two of which are First Responders and the third being an EMT. We practice EFRAS at least once a month, on the ground as well as aloft. We custom built our First Response Kit specific to our industry. Included is the ability to admin oxygen.
- Location
- BC, Canada
PrimeApe, TomD,
That is fantastic, Gold Standard. I took a course here in British Columbia called "Survival First Aid", developed specifically for the logging industry, it is based on the premise that the ER is 24 hours away, and the likelihood that our accident scenarios can be severe.
One of the prime concepts was the maintenance of emergency escape trails (or heli-pad clearance / construction) as job 1.
With that background, I recall that during my initial exposure to tree-climbing, I thought, "What's the escape trail here?"
A good aerial rescue program is definitely right up there, so to speak, and that you practice monthly, PrimeApe, is once again, Gold Standard.
Northwind
That is fantastic, Gold Standard. I took a course here in British Columbia called "Survival First Aid", developed specifically for the logging industry, it is based on the premise that the ER is 24 hours away, and the likelihood that our accident scenarios can be severe.
One of the prime concepts was the maintenance of emergency escape trails (or heli-pad clearance / construction) as job 1.
With that background, I recall that during my initial exposure to tree-climbing, I thought, "What's the escape trail here?"
A good aerial rescue program is definitely right up there, so to speak, and that you practice monthly, PrimeApe, is once again, Gold Standard.
Northwind
RopeShield
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Ontario, Canada
Knowing is the finality of thinking!
Thinking you know what is going to happen is alot different than knowing what is going to happen.
See what I mean.
No blood, no foul!
Thinking you know what is going to happen is alot different than knowing what is going to happen.
See what I mean.
No blood, no foul!
RopeShield
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Ontario, Canada
[ QUOTE ]
Katie,
When I started climbing in the early '70s safety was a pretty remote issue. Over time the profession, and myself. have both become safer but just as dangerous.
I found this pic on your site:
http://www.dyneema360.com/10/tree-climbing/
One handing a chainsaw? Whew...you HAVE to get that picture down. Your credibility will plummet! I'm not 100% sure but It looks like the climber doesn't have a lanyard on. Most country's safety regs require two means of attachment when using a chainsaw.
I've talked with some people who support the requirement that climbers wear chainsaw leg protection but do NOT want to have to give up one-handing or wearing a second attachment. That seems way out of balance to me?????
[/ QUOTE ]
Tom,I hear you loud and clear.
One handing is an advanced and viable technique.
technique. I am sure for every point against there is a point for.
It is a good picture of what the industry is about.
Sometimes being a Gunslingin cowboy affords effeciencies and safety.
Our industry is what it is.
being off balance is one of many reasons I one hand the one hand chainamasaw.
See what I mean?
Hard to hold on to those reigns with two hands on the sabre.
Katie,
When I started climbing in the early '70s safety was a pretty remote issue. Over time the profession, and myself. have both become safer but just as dangerous.
I found this pic on your site:
http://www.dyneema360.com/10/tree-climbing/
One handing a chainsaw? Whew...you HAVE to get that picture down. Your credibility will plummet! I'm not 100% sure but It looks like the climber doesn't have a lanyard on. Most country's safety regs require two means of attachment when using a chainsaw.
I've talked with some people who support the requirement that climbers wear chainsaw leg protection but do NOT want to have to give up one-handing or wearing a second attachment. That seems way out of balance to me?????
[/ QUOTE ]
Tom,I hear you loud and clear.
One handing is an advanced and viable technique.
technique. I am sure for every point against there is a point for.
It is a good picture of what the industry is about.
Sometimes being a Gunslingin cowboy affords effeciencies and safety.
Our industry is what it is.
being off balance is one of many reasons I one hand the one hand chainamasaw.
See what I mean?
- Location
- Retired in Minneapolis
[ QUOTE ]
One handing is an advanced and viable technique.
[/ QUOTE ]
No way will I agree with that. Advanced, sure, but it requires the elimination of a LOT of options that would mitigate the exposure to risk. Since I was chided about one-handing by one of my mentors years ago I've been able to eliminate one-handing to maybe once a year. When I do that I've notified my groundies and gotten their 'permission' to follow through. They are on heightened awareness when I'd in the 'red zone'.
[ QUOTE ]
I am sure for every point against there is a point for.
[/ QUOTE ]
Opposite, for every point for there are MANY against.
It is a good picture of what the industry is about.
[ QUOTE ]
Sometimes being a Gunslingin' cowboy affords efficiencies and safety.
[/ QUOTE ]
Efficiencies...until something goes wrong, which it will when corners get cut and safety compromised. The those few seconds 'saved' over time will be gone when dealing with an accident.
[ QUOTE ]
Our industry is what it is.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yup...dangerous and deadly! Allowing an accepted, risky practice be showcased is not professional. This condones poor practices. On a personal website showing unsafe practices is one thing. To have them on a professional website condones the poor practice.
[ QUOTE ]
being off balance is one of many reasons I one hand the one hand chainamasaw.
[/ QUOTE ]
Being off-balance is the last stance where one-handing should be accepted.
[ QUOTE ]
Hard to hold on to those reigns with two hands on the sabre.
[/ QUOTE ]
Cowboys and Jedi knights...polar opposites. I worked for a guy who cowboyed in Wyoming for many years. More than once I saw him on the phone, taking notes about an intense conversation an pull out his works to role a one-handed cigarette...including lighting. I still wouldn't tolerate him one-handing a chainsaw.
One handing is an advanced and viable technique.
[/ QUOTE ]
No way will I agree with that. Advanced, sure, but it requires the elimination of a LOT of options that would mitigate the exposure to risk. Since I was chided about one-handing by one of my mentors years ago I've been able to eliminate one-handing to maybe once a year. When I do that I've notified my groundies and gotten their 'permission' to follow through. They are on heightened awareness when I'd in the 'red zone'.
[ QUOTE ]
I am sure for every point against there is a point for.
[/ QUOTE ]
Opposite, for every point for there are MANY against.
It is a good picture of what the industry is about.
[ QUOTE ]
Sometimes being a Gunslingin' cowboy affords efficiencies and safety.
[/ QUOTE ]
Efficiencies...until something goes wrong, which it will when corners get cut and safety compromised. The those few seconds 'saved' over time will be gone when dealing with an accident.
[ QUOTE ]
Our industry is what it is.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yup...dangerous and deadly! Allowing an accepted, risky practice be showcased is not professional. This condones poor practices. On a personal website showing unsafe practices is one thing. To have them on a professional website condones the poor practice.
[ QUOTE ]
being off balance is one of many reasons I one hand the one hand chainamasaw.
[/ QUOTE ]
Being off-balance is the last stance where one-handing should be accepted.
[ QUOTE ]
Hard to hold on to those reigns with two hands on the sabre.
[/ QUOTE ]
Cowboys and Jedi knights...polar opposites. I worked for a guy who cowboyed in Wyoming for many years. More than once I saw him on the phone, taking notes about an intense conversation an pull out his works to role a one-handed cigarette...including lighting. I still wouldn't tolerate him one-handing a chainsaw.
BigWood
Participating member
- Location
- Toronto, Canada
[ QUOTE ]
Hard to hold on to those reigns with two hands on the sabre.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hahahahahaha
This message is Zorro approved.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hahahahahaha
RopeShield
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Ontario, Canada
We will have to agree to disagree.
If you get a chance read Arbclimber Issue 1
Here's the link for a subscription or order from https://www.treestuff.com/store/catalog.asp?category_id=196&item=1904
http://www.arbclimber.com/
An article about One vs two hand chainsaw use.
You and I have admitted to doing it with one hand and many other well respected arbclimbers who frequent here have also.
The terrible mistake we are making is not educating and demonstrating the how, when, where and why of it.
We are all failing in protecting future arbclimbers.
Top handles are designed to be used with one hand for our benefit.
Integrative thinking! It is possible for something that is dangerous to also be safe.
Yes and No!
If you get a chance read Arbclimber Issue 1
Here's the link for a subscription or order from https://www.treestuff.com/store/catalog.asp?category_id=196&item=1904
http://www.arbclimber.com/
An article about One vs two hand chainsaw use.
You and I have admitted to doing it with one hand and many other well respected arbclimbers who frequent here have also.
The terrible mistake we are making is not educating and demonstrating the how, when, where and why of it.
We are all failing in protecting future arbclimbers.
Top handles are designed to be used with one hand for our benefit.
Integrative thinking! It is possible for something that is dangerous to also be safe.
Yes and No!
RopeShield
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Ontario, Canada
Climbing is the easy part.
How often do you use one hand with a hand saw. Probabley not as much as you would with two. But when you need to one hand with the handsaw you are sure to be in a good position to make the cut safely and less tiring.
Chainsawing is no different than handsawing.
You should consider what is best for you in a given situation.
Here is another analogy. Driving with one or two hands and looking over you shoulder to your blind spot.
If you have two hands on the wheel or one hand.
What works best for you, what level are you at, confidence, experience etc. Take you eyes of the road, take a hand off the wheel, fail to look properly over your shoulder etc etc.
I am for tools, techniques and information.
Don't drink or sword fight and drive
How often do you use one hand with a hand saw. Probabley not as much as you would with two. But when you need to one hand with the handsaw you are sure to be in a good position to make the cut safely and less tiring.
Chainsawing is no different than handsawing.
You should consider what is best for you in a given situation.
Here is another analogy. Driving with one or two hands and looking over you shoulder to your blind spot.
If you have two hands on the wheel or one hand.
What works best for you, what level are you at, confidence, experience etc. Take you eyes of the road, take a hand off the wheel, fail to look properly over your shoulder etc etc.
I am for tools, techniques and information.
Don't drink or sword fight and drive
- Location
- Retired in Minneapolis
If there was a magic 'One Handed Chainsaw' wand that could be waved which would cast a spell onto all chainsaw users and infuse them with the skills and knowledge about when and how to one-hand...I'd be tickled!
There isn't so it remains a taboo skill
I've never denied that I didn't nor don't one hand. What I maintain, like PrimeApe is saying. I've become a better climber so I don't even need to do that unless it is a super rare occasion. Oh, and still bring the job in with money on it.
There isn't so it remains a taboo skill
I've never denied that I didn't nor don't one hand. What I maintain, like PrimeApe is saying. I've become a better climber so I don't even need to do that unless it is a super rare occasion. Oh, and still bring the job in with money on it.
RopeShield
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Ontario, Canada
I have put my money where my mouth is and put together as much info as possible. Information gleened from Forums, news articles, books, manauals(Stihl and Husky), personal experiences etc.
Being a better climber is the easy part.
Using a chainsaw with one hand with training, knowledge and practice is as safe and at times safer in a given situation.
And that is what will make you a better chainsaw weilding arbclimber.
Did you read the article? Yes or No? Care to open your mind to a not so new idea?
Srt without a backup?
Handling Lead?
Cultural practices with negative effects?
Our industry is full of inconsistencies because minds are closed.
Being a better climber is the easy part.
Using a chainsaw with one hand with training, knowledge and practice is as safe and at times safer in a given situation.
And that is what will make you a better chainsaw weilding arbclimber.
Did you read the article? Yes or No? Care to open your mind to a not so new idea?
Srt without a backup?
Handling Lead?
Cultural practices with negative effects?
Our industry is full of inconsistencies because minds are closed.
I didn't read the article. Mostly because I was laughing hysterically at the description. I'm not sure I can agree that there are any "Legends" in our proffession. Certainly plenty of "Legends in their own minds" types. I don't know that I've ever seen a modern day chainsaw designed for one handed use. When I began my career there were a few on the market, but that was light years ago.
Mind closed about the one handing absolutely! Not closed on most things. But on this matter, its totally closed.
I understand the argument i must stabilize with one hand to not lose my balance...
Go ahead, as an employer, and take that stance. See you in court perhaps one day. Good luck bypassing all of the information that the manufacturers put out, the injury stats blah, blah, blah...
What is the horsepower of a climbing saw? What kind of force can be generated with the momentum of that little tiny chain? Ever notice the chain on a climbing saw is a smaller guage? Why? How much force can you comfortably control with one hand? Why?
Good climbers NEVER lose their balance because their positioning is always good, comfy and stable. It is just that some peeps get completely comfy upsidedown or standing on a 2" branch
.
I understand the argument i must stabilize with one hand to not lose my balance...
Go ahead, as an employer, and take that stance. See you in court perhaps one day. Good luck bypassing all of the information that the manufacturers put out, the injury stats blah, blah, blah...
What is the horsepower of a climbing saw? What kind of force can be generated with the momentum of that little tiny chain? Ever notice the chain on a climbing saw is a smaller guage? Why? How much force can you comfortably control with one hand? Why?
Good climbers NEVER lose their balance because their positioning is always good, comfy and stable. It is just that some peeps get completely comfy upsidedown or standing on a 2" branch
.I hate to say it Ropeshield but you are putting yourself to get bombed with the one hand comment. It's been hashed out numerous times and this thread is about safety tips started by a new buzzer. I am not for or against your view. I am 45 and know what I can do with a chainsaw but one handing comes in at a losing battle on the buzz. I am not a hypocrite I one hand when I have to but I don't advocate it. And I can get out on limbs with ease and don't have a problem with positioning. Some things are best kept to oneself believe me I know.
One handing a chainsaw?
What type?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mx-OgsJKTc4&feature=youtube_gdata_player
The hole in my gloves is from one handing my MS200's as I brace myself with the other,
That's why I never recommend anyone whatsoever emulate me,...see?
jomoco
What type?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mx-OgsJKTc4&feature=youtube_gdata_player
The hole in my gloves is from one handing my MS200's as I brace myself with the other,
That's why I never recommend anyone whatsoever emulate me,...see?
jomoco
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