Snakebite legal?

[ QUOTE ]
Why even worry about diameter as long as it meets the minimum strength requirements.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can more readily understand how diameter is important
than I can the particular (high) strength requirement:
diameter has some bearing on handling (grasping) the
line, and on its resistance to cutting, and on the
action of friction hitches to it (and their thickness);
but the 5,000+# strength comes into play when?

*kN*
 
I only use the small diameter ropes for access, with the use of ascenders. So as long a the diameter matches up with the ascender, than all I worry about is the strength.
 
What is the average age of the Z committee members? How many of them use the equipment they regulate on a regular basis? I am asking pointed questions, but they are directed at no member in particular. If strength ratings are being met it seems like a no brainer to me. Why is the revision process taking so long Tim, Tom? Can you tell us who the no votes were?
 
[ QUOTE ]
Can you tell us who the no votes were?

[/ QUOTE ]

good one Keith....
grin.gif
 
A name tally isn't taken during the votes. That isn't how these processes work. There was lots of discussion on this issue too.

The current Z133 went into effect in August [?] 2007 and will be in place for five years.

On October 30th the Z committee will meet in Providence, Rhode Island to work on the review. We've had meetings already to start the process.

This would be a great opportunity for anyone who is interested in seeing how the process work to attend the meeting. The meeting is open to the public and is very interesting.

Like most committees most of the members are 'older', say, above 40, but I could be wrong. There are many that are connected to the field still and everyone cares about the health and safety of treeworkers.
 
Can the public make comments and present research? In a professional and orderly fashion of course. I think it would be great if we showed up en masse to see the process.
 
The public has always had this option. Look at the last page of you Z133.1, there is a form that anyone can fill out.

Each one of these that is sent in is responded to by the Secretariat.
 
Pancake,
I would like to get involved, Maybe Andrew P, how about Kyle. I also have a few co-workers who would like to address a few concerns. I feel it's about time that some of the "Up and Coming Climbers" get their voice out. Kinda like the silent majority!!
 
Tim, what are the costs an interested person could expect to pay out of pocket for travel, lodging, etc. for the period of time that they are asked to serve. That may be one obstacle for an arborist who is starting out financially versus a professor with tenure at a major university or a Phd. Also, there may be a time constraint. If you could address that as well TMW. People who have the resources and work for lagre industry inteties (are high up in large utilities, own their own companies, are a voice for a large manufacturer) seem to be the vast majority of the representatives. Not too many individual members or people associated with small companies. Glad to see Steve Chisolm is the Coordinator for Committee Activities. Tom- didn't see your name on the list, have you served before? What about you Mark C? If we are going to act as one voice, let it be an educated and professional one.

I would not only like to see this particular line item changed (8.1.8), but like John said, send applications to Sharon Lilly and give the "silent majority" a voice. Who votes on the new members?

Tim, I never said the "public" or myself for that matter didn't have a voice. Forums like this along with conferences, continuing education, competitions, etc do give us limited face time with committee members. Who knows, there could be a huge beauracratic logjam within the committee slowing downthe processes of getting our message out.

Personally, filling out a form that will be responded to by the Secretariat will never give me the type of in depth answers I an looking for, a true understanding. There is something to be said about face time always winning out over concise, complete 6 line paragraphs. I mean really, how many forms does the Secretariat (is it Jim Skeira?) reply to in a week? Maybe we should recommend a better form- LOL

Maybe we should fire up another thread instead of pirating this one. I don't think it is a "legal" issue since ANSI dosen't levy fines- unlike OSHA. "Approved" may be a more suitable term.
 
I've been involved with the Z and A300 for many years. No one has reimbursed me a dime for my time or money...which isn't important.

Every comment that comes into the process is acted on in some way by the Committee not just one person like it is commonly believed. Lilly and Skiera don't act independently of the Committee.

You can write to ISA and get on the interested party email list so that you'll have an idea of what is going on at the Committee meeting.

For people in the NE US the meeting in Providence would be a great opportunity to see how things function. Make a reservation so that there are enough chairs setup in the meeting room.

There is so much more than just the rope issue going on. Even though there are limited voting seats the input and energy from other people is very important.
 
You are so very right Tom, we can not put a monetary value on the safety of arborists. How do we make reservations? Maybe you will answer this by starting another post that gives answers to FAQ's like what you have said above so we don't pirate this thread any longer. Possible address some of the other hot issues so we can begin focusin gour energy and researching. Thanks, sorry Dusty!
 
Keith,

There are two meetings a year, usually in the Baltimore area. This fall the meeting is in Rhode Island. All expenses are paid by the individual participant, or their company.

You are looking at two roundtrip flights a year, a couple nights at the hotel (+/- $175), parking fees, time away from home, etc. This only accounts for annual meetings. There is other time spent as well; conference calls, emails, research, meetings at other conferences, etc.

Tom and I, and others, have been individual members for some time; thus, spending our own money to participate in the process. This is why we sometimes get defense about other people's comments about the committee and procedures.

I feel the same way as many do. My first meeting, I attended as a guest. I looked around the room and saw a lot of grey hair and realized that many of them do not actually work in the field on a daily basis. This was the primary motivation for getting involved.

I have since gone back to school for my second master's and doctorate in ergonomics and safety and it made more sense for me to be there, but I wanted you all to know why I felt it was important enough to spend my own resources to be there.

"Get involved, the world is run by those who show up"
 
[ QUOTE ]
A name tally isn't taken during the votes. That isn't how these processes work.

[/ QUOTE ] C'mon Tom- we both know who a few of the no's were- you're right however, don't want to hurt the process.
 
[ QUOTE ]

Personally, filling out a form that will be responded to by the Secretariat will never give me the type of in depth answers I an looking for, a true understanding.

[/ QUOTE ]Keith it's not clear what you are looking for. Since the product is a written document, writing comments and thoughtfully writing to responses is the best way to understand the whys and hows.

Keith, as well as you write this should come natural. I don't know about safety (just see my scars
crazy.gif
)but this system worked pretty well with the last pruning revision. Research and document, or opinions will lack support.
 
Thanks Guy. Mainly I am bored out of my mind at home in a chair with no options but to make silly comments on TreeBuzz. I wish working stiffs had a better, or easier path, to get ideas from the field to the approval stage of the Z. I am ignorant mostly of the processes and would like to learn more about it. You are right, writing clear consise comments seems to be the best, albiet not the most personal, way to start.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

New threads New posts

Back
Top Bottom