proper pruning 75' tulip

Daniel

Carpal tunnel level member
proper pruning 75\' tulip

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ4Zr6WdjMo

Here's the latest effort at promoting proper pruning technique... It was originally intended to inform homeowners about good pruning and the harm that improper pruning can do.. A bit repetitive but overall a good low budget effort.

I have another one coming, which was shot right after an early snow storm did a lot of damage, as many trees were still in full leaf..
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

As soon as you said "4 to 5 inch cuts will never compartmentalize" I stopped watching. You are wrong, plain and simple. I realize that smaller cuts are better, it's how I usually prune, but, you should NOT be spreading misinformation.
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

Basic concepts are good, but it is clear you have to study more about tree biology, or at least stop pretending you know it all.

Overall, I would give this a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10, with ten being "bored me to an early grave".

SZ
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

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Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

[ QUOTE ]
As soon as you said "4 to 5 inch cuts will never compartmentalize" I stopped watching. You are wrong, plain and simple. I realize that smaller cuts are better, it's how I usually prune, but, you should NOT be spreading misinformation.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do your homework... 4" is the cut off for poorly compartmentalizing trees..
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

Hey Daniel, I appreciate most of what I see in most of your videos, and I thank you for sharing them on this forum. Please don't take this as me jumping on the criticism bandwagon. At 6:15, just above your right shoulder, isn't that a fully compartmentalized wound on the trunk measuring about 6 inches?
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

I've no argument with having a goal of avoiding large cuts, especially in poor compartmentalizers like tulip. However, I would have preferred to not see the several stubs that were left. Seems that most could have been properly target pruned, and still been under 2-2.5". A goal should be to limit the regrowth of sprouts.

Otherwise, good job, Daniel...but one that a good climber could have performed, sans lift assist. Any limbs tough to reach could have been properly pruned with a pole saw or pruner.
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

[ QUOTE ]
Hey Daniel, I appreciate most of what I see in most of your videos, and I thank you for sharing them on this forum. Please don't take this as me jumping on the criticism bandwagon. At 6:15, just above your right shoulder, isn't that a fully compartmentalized wound on the trunk measuring about 6 inches?

[/ QUOTE ]

My brother.. there is no way to tell if a wound is completely compartmentalized without dissecting the tree.. Calloused over does not indicate that decay is compartmentalized.. That tree is going to become hollow..
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

What is "target pruned"? never heard that term...

I agree with Roger - above, stubs bad. Regrowth in the area she wants clear did not seem like a goal.

Also, I gave up on the thought process that says "someone else will do it". That is a slippery slope - could lead to many bad jobs looking a little more tempting. I try to hover around the "my way" highway... untill we are really broke!
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

i usually avoid the Daniel threads on purpose...even if a lrge branch is cut of on a tree that is not a great compartmentalizer....like a silver maple, say you get some decay before the wound closes up. In most cases that decay is localized to the branch attatchment and does not always decay into the trunk wouund..in most cases if you make a good collar cut on a stem like that it does NOT spell doom for the tree,,,
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

[ QUOTE ]
Im confused?
http://www.youtube.com/user/murphy4trees#p/search/3/j36V8dchcqE

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes Mark,
You sure act confused... It took every bit of persuasion I could come up with to convince that homeowner not to remove the entire 35-40' limb on that tree.. That was done to protect the main trunk from decay.. Its the same principle, just a different application.. How is it that an arborist of your knowledge and experience doesn't see that.. Such stupidity never ceases to amaze me!
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

[ QUOTE ]
i usually avoid the Daniel threads on purpose...even if a lrge branch is cut of on a tree that is not a great compartmentalizer....like a silver maple, say you get some decay before the wound closes up. In most cases that decay is localized to the branch attatchment and does not always decay into the trunk wouund..in most cases if you make a good collar cut on a stem like that it does NOT spell doom for the tree,,,

[/ QUOTE ]

Shigo would roll over in his grave if he read that.. One of the main points he was making in arguing for target pruning is that wound closure or callousing over has nothing to do with the processes of internal decay... You're thinking in human time.. None of us have been in the tree business long enough to see the full effects of such cuts in tree time.. say 50-100 years..

Not all the cuts on that tulip were shown on the video... BUT even the ones that were will surely, over time, cause the complete decay of the live wood at the time the wounds were made... The only chance the tree stands is to put on enough new wood in future years to keep itself structurally sound, before the decay is complete..
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

[ QUOTE ]
I've no argument with having a goal of avoiding large cuts, especially in poor compartmentalizers like tulip. However, I would have preferred to not see the several stubs that were left. Seems that most could have been properly target pruned, and still been under 2-2.5". A goal should be to limit the regrowth of sprouts.

Otherwise, good job, Daniel...but one that a good climber could have performed, sans lift assist. Any limbs tough to reach could have been properly pruned with a pole saw or pruner.

[/ QUOTE ]

yes, this type of work can be done well by a good climber, BUT in my territory, those types of climbers are few and far in between.. Most companies are hacks, I've seen horrible pruning done by even some of the bigger names..

As far as the stubs. I do not expect the small stubs on branch tips to re-sprout, especially on tulip.And I have transcended the knee jerk reaction to target prune every cut. I AM diligent when the cut is important.. But in many cases, such as making small cuts on branch tips, it makes NO difference to the long term health of the tree, when those stubs are left.. It is far worse to cut in to the live tissue of the remaining wood, which is often the case when target pruning is attempted..

I know you guys are going to jump all over that thinking.. BUT.. tell me where you get your knowledge about how bad leaving stubs are... (when left on branch tips) . Is it only because if your training?.. Its the way you were taught and you have yet to question why... You have no empirical evidence to argue against the practice, nor is there any science... You are simply mindlessly doing as you were told.. I don't have that problem. Other than aesthetics, I have no problem leaving small stubs.. This is one area where the tree care industry needs to get "past" Shigo..

Before you go crazy with your mudslining.. just come up with the science... where is the paper that shows the harm done by leaving stubs on branch tips?

Also.. here's a PM I got on another site and my reply.. For your consideration..

Quote:
so murph, what's your opinion on raising up the lower portion of deciduous trees when main limbs are concerned? just curious. I've removed several low limbs on maples, oaks ect... Not so much tulip, around here they are strait and tall and the lowest limbs are usually around 50 ft. But to open up views, clear houses and a basic raising. on other trees we often take large limbs back to the trunk (with proper cuts).

my reply:
I try to avoid that practice, though I used to do it all the time. I do not suggest it.. if the client asks for it, I explain that is is harmful for the tree and better to leave the lower limbs so as not to make wounds on the trunk, and keep the shade on the trunk and root zone, keep away soil compacting traffic etc.. if they still insist, I suggest heavy reduction cuts on these limbs rather than removal, as it is better to allow the tree to keep the limb(s), or even if the limb dies, better to let the stub die, then cut off the dead portion after it is clear exactly where the collar is etc.. They usually listen

Good luck with everything..
D
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This is one area where the tree care industry needs to get "past" Shigo..

D

[/ QUOTE ]

So you reference shigo to back up what you say about codit then say we need to get past him...How are we to know what we should believe from him and what not to.
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

Guys guys guys. Just start by thinking you know nothing and start from there.

Whenever it looks like Daniel is a lazy bucketeer who leaves stubs, remember that you are the imbecile for even questioning his pruning method.

Also, he is allowed to cherry pick (get it?) Shigo's work if it suits his particular style of pruning. You are not. Cause you are a boy scout.

Daniel, I thank you for the many times you have made me LOL. Seriously, you are hilarious.

SZ
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

Leaving branch stubs while pruning is the same as not wearing a hard hat when climbing. Most of the time it might be okay but it makes you look like you don't know what you are doing.

Leaving stubs makes your work look sloppy. That tulip pruning looked sloppy IMO. Maybe the homeowner will never notice but any decent pro certainly will.

v
 
Re: proper pruning 75\' tulip

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hey Daniel, I appreciate most of what I see in most of your videos, and I thank you for sharing them on this forum. Please don't take this as me jumping on the criticism bandwagon. At 6:15, just above your right shoulder, isn't that a fully compartmentalized wound on the trunk measuring about 6 inches?

[/ QUOTE ]

My brother.. there is no way to tell if a wound is completely compartmentalized without dissecting the tree.. Calloused over does not indicate that decay is compartmentalized.. That tree is going to become hollow..

[/ QUOTE ]

I suppose I always thought about compartmentalization as if the exterior wall (the callousing over) was the last wall of compartmentalization to be completed since it would seem to need the most tree resources to grow the new tissue. Perhaps I'm wrong. Perhaps it's species dependant. Anyone know which walls are sealed first? I suppose this would differ with internal and external defects as well.
 

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