New Tribe knockoff saddles

Well, everything that I considered I guess that Japanese website harnesses are made in U.S. with ANSI ratings and it must be came from New tribe factory. So, it's not even should be called New tribe knockoffs.
It must be made from Newtribes just like that Monkey beaver back then but under John Garthlight design ? Or add on designs ? Who had became some what known in Japan around since 2000. I had some silly chat with some tree people in US around '95 or '96 so it does makes sense. With lucrative good sprits deals between him and New tribe I guess. I'd say whatever it is if there are some improvements in anything and people gets paid right without any silly rumors or dramas then I'm just fine with it. LoL
 
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Muggs said:
That's not how I remember it. Richard sold the saka for years before Weaver bought the rights to the haas and then decided to launch a frivolous lawsuit.

And for the record, yes, the chicane is a blatant ripoff of the wrench. It is literally Chicanery.
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For the record, the chicane is an improvement of the wrench. It is literally progress.

(At least for use with the zigzag)
 
Pinhead Squirrel said:
Foldable sling shot head throw weight launcher ...

You mean... like that Stein Tekichu Throw Weight Launcher ? LoL
I thought that was a great idea but how they build it with crudely and rubber bands that comes with are too weak to begin with. I can use strong fishing mono line as throw line with steel ball shoot it up there then connect with actual throw line to the rope might gonna work with that configuration. When I was kid that how I did it. With 25lb strength mono line with regular slingshot with steel ball tied up and cemented with Krazy glues. Then connect it to the rope. I didn't even know about existence of throw ball even at that time.
We are talking about when I was 6 years old so 44 , 43 years ago . LoL
Well, I'll say it was a mistake of choosing manufacturing country with bad quality control and it's design stage fault. I think the idea works tho.
When I saw that name of the sling " Tekichu " which is "bull's eyes" in Japanese but a kind outdated word to my ears so I was laughing when I hear it . And it's not even made in Japan . LoL Guess it was luck of integrity in product development stages and follow up overall . A Great idea but went down in flame.
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The one I’m speaking to is a little different. There was a ball that slid into the bitter end of the rubber, and each arm had a yoke that the ball and band snapped into.
 
Petzl is the Apple of the tree industry. They make a version of basically everything, and they want you to use their version of said thing. When they say that the wrench is not approved for use with the zigzag, it's not simply a straightforward safety thing. It's also a conflict of interest thing. They do not want people using the wrench because in the hands of a novice, especially with the wrong type of tether, the wrench can swing down far enough that it can contact the friction pins and release the zigzag. Also, they make zero money from the wrench. “A man always has two reasons for what he does—a good one, and the real one.” . Both are valid reasons for the same explanation. Two competing simultaneous parallel realities, like everything these days.

Why is the top hole on the zigzag made to only fit an H-frame carabiner that is also made by Petzl? According to their website it "has a flexible positioning ring that helps keep the connector oriented along its major axis". Could it also be that making it this way would ensure that they end up selling thousands of extra carabiners? Safety issue or just double dipping? Who is to say?

Is the chicane "literally progress"? I don't know. Maybe. Is it a ripoff of the wrench? Definitely. Both can be true at the same time. The wrench is an invention, it's a zero to one moment. The chicane is an innovation, it takes existing things and reimagines or recombines them in novel ways to make something new. We need both, invention and innovation, but they are not equal in their frequency or their impact. Innovation happens every single day. True invention is a rare thing.
 
Strong analysis Mr. Muggs! Proprietary systems are a win-win for manufacturers like Petzl. From a liability point of view designing, testing and integrating required components makes a lot of sense. From a business point of view proprietery systems also make a lot of sense, customer is stuck in a corner. Apple has mastered the art of shutting down third party add-ons and user modification with their products. In reality tree climbers like to mix and match smartly and carry multiple use gear. There will always be tension between what manufacturers want and climbers require.
-AJ
 
Muggs said:
That's not how I remember it. Richard sold the saka for years before Weaver bought the rights to the haas and then decided to launch a frivolous lawsuit.

And for the record, yes, the chicane is a blatant ripoff of the wrench. It is literally Chicanery.
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See, you are playing both sides of the fence. On one hand you back Richard, who basically copied the Haas knee ascender. Never mind that he tried to make improvements, the Haas was first. Then on the other hand you are backing Kevin and bashing Petzl for doing the same thing.
That is where loyalty overcomes logic.
 
Why would you knock a company that produces things that only their equipment works with? That is how they make money, and that is what they are in business for.
Your Protos helmet won't allow you to use a Kask face shield. Your Stihl saw won't allow you to use a Husqvarna bar.
People seem to have a hard on about Petzl and Apple for doing the same thing, only on a larger scale. It is like they are pissed that these companies have succeeded with their model and became giants in the industry.
 
All that said, I do not own any Apple product. And I do not own a Chicane but operate my Zigzag SRT with a Rope Wrench and tether. Had a Chicane and sold it to someone here because I like the Wrench and tether better. I have rounded out that hole in the Zigzags so all carabiners work. But I have no animosity towards Petzl or Apple. They are out to make money, just like us, only they are more successful at doing so than I am. But no sour grapes here.
And a side note: The Apex Rope Wrench is a rip off (in your words) of the Chicane. Took Petzl's swing open design to the "T" and STOLE IT. lol
 
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evo said:
The one I’m speaking to is a little different. There was a ball that slid into the bitter end of the rubber, and each arm had a yoke that the ball and band snapped into.
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Ah , stopper balls and those stopper balls inserted into end tubes slide into the slit to set the bands . Ok.

That's I've seen it in Slingshot catapult world. Which are also one of my hobbies. So Im always lookin into it to be keep updated .

The issues with that is slight frictions at the points. It's degrades bands and eventually causes band snaps .
As for the throw ball launcher the bands are fairly strong and it has a slight thick sheathing over the band so does not require frequent band replacements like catapult slingshots. However , the band itself are very strong and just one snap causes devastating damage to the shooter it might be so I think it's not good idea for safety.
 
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