If your hands can handle the 11mm rope, sure. It is durable and not too much stretch. Can hand splice and knots well. Works better with 8mm HRC. Give it a go. If not get some hyperclimb or focus from Wesspur or Gap has some cool yale 11.7s in different color schemes.
Looking for the ideal rope.
- Thread starter Willber
- Start date
Yeah I was on a tight budget and really needed something new with a spliced eye and I just couldn't beat the price from wesspur...I def wanted to go thicker but the price was great....I had poison Ivy before and Samson velocity that I both liked... I just really needed something with a spliced eye bc I do a lot of crane work and I love hitch climbing but when we use the crane I usually use my zz and I just loved how velocity flowed through it so that's also why I went with the thin blaze.
I asked my boss today on his thoughts bc he's a well respected arb in our community here and he thought blaze was thicker and less static than velocity! Have u ever used Samson velocity?
Yes. But years ago. On DdRT. Blaze might have some stretch but in DdRT on the crane you should be fine.
Willber
New member
- Location
- Milford, NH
So, I found a manufacturer that will make this ideal rope. But, they want a minimum of 1,200 feet purchased.
Anyone want in on some of this new exciting rope? They said if it has a nylon cover they couldn't give it a nylon core, because nylon shrinks, and the core will shrink less and slower than the cover.
If it has some Dyneema making up the core, it will increase the cost. I was thinking a 2/3 polyester/ 1/3 Dyneema, so it'll be a lighter rope, than 100% poly core rope.
That way you could have an ideal 12mm rope, with the weight of say... an 11mm rope.
I'm thinking of having a cover very similar to the Beal Access 11mm Rope, though having the carrier strands with more rotational twists.
Anyone want in on some of this new exciting rope? They said if it has a nylon cover they couldn't give it a nylon core, because nylon shrinks, and the core will shrink less and slower than the cover.
If it has some Dyneema making up the core, it will increase the cost. I was thinking a 2/3 polyester/ 1/3 Dyneema, so it'll be a lighter rope, than 100% poly core rope.
That way you could have an ideal 12mm rope, with the weight of say... an 11mm rope.
I'm thinking of having a cover very similar to the Beal Access 11mm Rope, though having the carrier strands with more rotational twists.
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It's about the same diameter and construction but it's a poly poly and velocity had a nylon core.
I only used it a couple days last week with my zz and being so new it fly's through the zz. I think I'm gonna like it more when it breaks in. Again I'd rather have thicker especially in winter but for the price I love it so far and I'll def enjoy it more when the gloves come off.
Seems to me to be basically an 11mm version of ivy.
Today I plan to get outside and try it srt bc I haven't yet
Jehinten
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Evansville
If that's your ideal rope, then buy all 1200 feet. Then when one wears out or if it gets damaged you won't be looking for more buyers to make another order.
Heavy upfront cost but you should be set for ropes for the foreseeable future.
southsoundtree
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Olympia, WA
How much is 1200'?
Willber
New member
- Location
- Milford, NH
I don't know yet. If Dyneema (the only light yet, strong material I can think of) is used it'll be, maybe $1500
I'm sending them a sample of the Beal Access rope, to get an idea of the stiffness I'm looking for.
AdkEric
Branched out member
- Location
- Adirondacks
I have an older model ZZ (2016 I think) and purple scandere. Even when the rope was brand new I never experienced any creep in a MRS or SRS configuration. Very smooth combo IMO, and smooth as butter SRS with the rope wrench.
The biggest complaint I have is the bounce. More stretch than I like for a SRS ascent, but pleasant to work a tree on otherwise.
I don't find it flattens anymore than my blue moon in any device I've used them both with: BDB, ZZ, HH2, wrench.
Perhaps the best 24 strand I've used is "Ruby" from Elevation Canada. Stays round under load and despite being advertised as 3% elongation at 10% break strength, it feels to me more static than blue moon. https://elevationcanada.com/shop/ols/products/ruby-115mm-climbing-line-with-1-hand-splice-eye
Not sure if this helps you in your search for the unicorn rope or not. Having a rope custom made to your specs sounds cool, but expensive and impractical. As @Jehinten says, might as well buy the whole 1200' and cut it to lengths you'll use for climbing.
The biggest complaint I have is the bounce. More stretch than I like for a SRS ascent, but pleasant to work a tree on otherwise.
I don't find it flattens anymore than my blue moon in any device I've used them both with: BDB, ZZ, HH2, wrench.
Perhaps the best 24 strand I've used is "Ruby" from Elevation Canada. Stays round under load and despite being advertised as 3% elongation at 10% break strength, it feels to me more static than blue moon. https://elevationcanada.com/shop/ols/products/ruby-115mm-climbing-line-with-1-hand-splice-eye
Not sure if this helps you in your search for the unicorn rope or not. Having a rope custom made to your specs sounds cool, but expensive and impractical. As @Jehinten says, might as well buy the whole 1200' and cut it to lengths you'll use for climbing.
Willber
New member
- Location
- Milford, NH
Thanks for your reply. I’ll look into that
Ruby rope. Maybe the yellow Scandere I purchased is defective with cover issues or lacks enough core material. It’s still quite new, used it about 15 times.
Did you see the video I linked to early on in this post. The video shows it creeping significantly.
It’s funny though that my old Beal Access 11mm rope never creeps in the ZZ.
I think I might do this custom rope, because then I could have the ideal width of 12mm with the weight of an 11mm if they put Dyneema mixed in the core.
AdkEric
Branched out member
- Location
- Adirondacks
I did see those videos and was surprised about the creeping. It almost seems like yours is flattening out more than mine does, but pretty hard to tell via a phone screen. I've got about 30 lbs on you, not sure if that would make a difference.
Keep us posted about the custom rope progress.
I'll Just say, I have been disappointed the 2 times I have had boots custom made. Sometimes what one thinks would be ideal actually blows once One tries it for real. I spent so much time dissatisfied with normal boots i convinced myself custom would be just the thing. then I hated them and found those off the shelf to be more comfy.
Not exactly the same but Something to consider. I really hope the custom rope is just what you want it to be. It maybe worth looking at all potential Variables and running more ropes If you can borrow some Before a big outlay on something that might not be perfect.
Not exactly the same but Something to consider. I really hope the custom rope is just what you want it to be. It maybe worth looking at all potential Variables and running more ropes If you can borrow some Before a big outlay on something that might not be perfect.
To the OP- any consideration to changing your mechanical device? The Zig Zag is nice ( I'm on my 3rd or 4th one) but if you're having so many issues with your rope flattening etc maybe try a spider jack or lock jack? Or a tried and true hitch?
I switch back and forth between mechanicals and hitch based systems all the time, but I more or less run the same 2-3 ropes. Hell give me a chunk of safety blue and a taut line and I'll wreck any tree you throw at me- I'd rather not but the rope is only a tool that gives you access so you can perform the work.
After reading through this thread I really do think you are over thinking this but you seem determined to find a solution for yourself so good on you. I'll just keep climbing on whatever I can get on sale hahaha
Good luck!
I switch back and forth between mechanicals and hitch based systems all the time, but I more or less run the same 2-3 ropes. Hell give me a chunk of safety blue and a taut line and I'll wreck any tree you throw at me- I'd rather not but the rope is only a tool that gives you access so you can perform the work.
After reading through this thread I really do think you are over thinking this but you seem determined to find a solution for yourself so good on you. I'll just keep climbing on whatever I can get on sale hahaha
Good luck!
Dude go for it. Once you can afford it. let's see it and give feedback. You might hit the jackpot.
moss
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Carlisle, Massachusetts, U.S.
Comparing apples and oranges on Scandere line creep? Wilber, you're talking about a new hank of Scandere DdRT with the Zig-Zag, AdkEric is using SRT same device and line. With the super smooth 48-strand cover I suspect that if you break in your Scandere a bit more it will stop slipping DdRT with the Zag.
-AJ
Willber
New member
- Location
- Milford, NH
Hopefully, but it's just so different to my beloved experience with the Beal rope, which has the same: always "staying round" characteristic since new, and never creeping in the ZZ. Yes, the cover will tighten over the core, with more and more use, but don't anticipate it ever getting as "staying round" as the Beal, which has a pretty smooth cover similar to the platinum rope by Teufelberger.
I do think there is an apple and orange differential in that the Scandere is smooth and will get more surface area, as it becomes more abraded, giving more grip in the ZZ, to the point it may stop creeping in the ZZ. Even though it will never be as "staying round" as the Beal.
One thing also, ever since using the new Scandere I've always put the rope through a leather sleeve in DRT. Which would give it a different wear surface, than the Beal that which I never used a friction saver, abrading it against a multitude of diverse branches and trunks, that would give the Beal a more surface area advantage over the Scandere wear in the leather sleeve.
moss
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Carlisle, Massachusetts, U.S.
Yeah, rope break-in is just slightly if barely perceptively roughing up the cover and improving performance. This is for mechanicals and hitches. Every rope type I’ve owned including Scandere was very slippery out of the bag regardless of how well it held its round profile. Certainly running a line without cambium protection will speed up break-in but the effect on trees (for pruning as opposed to takedowns) and the lifespan of the rope is not good.
-AJ
Willber
New member
- Location
- Milford, NH
"...just slightly if barely perceptively roughing up the cover..." I thought the implication here, is nearly infinite changes will occur when the Scandere rope is "broken in". Which is what I've understood from ropes in general, that when some of the filaments break and the ends become like macroscopic "stubs", the grip in hands and devices is increased.
I noticed that back when I ran the bare Beal over the many "back branch to trunk" areas, and some crotches (I try to avoid crotches, because I like reduce obstruction in crotches, for they're vulnerable to rot of debree), and many branches. There was not much bark damage, sometimes almost none, except seeing that a rope had run there.
And, rope wear was not very noticeable to me.
I'm not trying to discredit what you're saying, only trying to understand.
Thanks, AJ
Willber
New member
- Location
- Milford, NH
I'll try to have a "decent" rope made. Thanks for the encouragement, IslandArb!
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