estimating removals/pruning

Phil84

Phil84

Location
Stevens Point WI
So heres the deal... I've worked for one summer as an intern with a very reputable company as brush b#$ch (not that that bothers me) and when I came home for spring break, all my friend's parents found out what I do/want to do for a living. Suddenly everybody has these side jobs they want done. Everyones asking "how much will it cost to take this tree out" along with, can you do it? I took a look at a couple of the trees in question and I'm just looking to see if anybody has a rough estimator method. I know cost is based on hazards, size of tree, accessability, and man power/equipment required, but how do you place a dollar amount on that? So far I just went off of the past work orders i've helped complete. Also, I'm looking for information on performing side jobs. I'm only in college and I don't have business insurance. I would never do a job I didn't feel comfortable with right now, but they don't call em accidents cus people mean to do it. Any insight into small business practices (like 1 or 2 people small)and ways to get it started will help too. Thanks

-Phil
 
First...get liability insurance.

At the same time get a business set up properly. Talk with an accountant or the Small Business Administration. They have the SCORE team that will be very helpful.

Don't take on jobs that are too challenging. Remember that you're working as an apprentice without a master to guide you.

Good luck!
 
No business insurance, no experience!!!!
Job cost is a factor of overhead times man hours, equipment used, job hazard, time of year, the weather (weather or not you feel like working)
I wonder how the homeowner would feel after you or you buddy get hurt on that tree you felt so good about, and you decide to sue their homeowners because you weren't insured. Good luck to you and your clients! /forum/images/graemlins/bur2.gif
 
well phil, here's my 2 cents. i started moonlighting doing tree work almost as soon as i started working for a tree company. BUT.. i was very realistic about what i could handle and what i maybe couldn't handle, and stayed well away from anything remotely beyond my capability.i mean that in terms of risk but also in terms of knowing the right "treatment" for the "illness". my suggestion is to remember, as stated above, that you are a rookie and will be a rookie for quite some time. and don't try to pass yourself off as anything other than a rookie (in your own mind or to your "clients").
as for bidding, i worked strictly hourly and passed dump fees on to clients. some of my peers may have gotten annoyed with me for being the "lowball" (i had no overhead), but i was always sure no one was getting ripped off. that's just me - i was more concerned about not overselling myself than i was about the "value" of the job. i was sure i was worth my hourly rate, though as a legitimate business owner now i guess i would call myself back then a "yahoo"..

disclaimer: of course all of this is completely illegal and leaves you open to all kinds of liability including tax fraud if you don't have a license etc as tom suggested....
 
like its been said, dont do anything beyond your capabilities. I've worked for several small co. where we could do small side jobs and just pay the owner rental on his equipment. make sure that the client knows that your are not a business yet and that you have no ins. As far as bidding goes you typically want to get around $350-$400 an hour or at minimum $100 per tree. good luc and be carefull!!!
 
[ QUOTE ]
Cheap work is not good.
good work is not cheap.

[/ QUOTE ]
I like that saying, sometimes it hard to convince the homeowner of that. I did an estimate the other day and the homeowner said be reasonable and that he threw out a estimate the from another company because he said it was too much money. I explained to him that the company was a good company and was fully insured and did high quality work. I explained that the a person without insurance can do the job much cheaper. I also explain the cost to the homeowner if something went wrong when using someone without insurance. We got the job.
 
And ALWAYS REMEMBER the tree will be MUCH BIGGER when you go back to do the job. It's a scientific fact! The tree actually grows AFTER you put a price on it, and that's no poo-poo!
 
MAsterBlaster ....how true how true..and kick yourself in the ass because what you thought at the time would take you half the day turned into a all day affair.... /forum/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 
Mangoes, I have been throwing that in at the end of the estimate visit. " I assume you will be getting more than one estimate, make sure to check that the company carries WCB and liability insurance. Your home looks like it would be expensive to fix and, you wouldnt want to get sued by a contractor that hurt themself." if you say it with the right tone they wont think you are being pompous, just matter of fact.
 
[ QUOTE ]
As far as bidding goes you typically want to get around $350-$400 an hour or at minimum $100 per tree. good luc and be carefull!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow! Sergio, I am having a hard time figuring out your method for estimates.

What if you had 6 small fruit trees to trim and it took you one hour to finish the job? (at minimum $100/tree) According to your estimate logic the price would be either $350-400 or $600? Which would it be? Because if it were $600 for 6 small fruit trees, you are going home with no work.

--Seems shady or unclear in your method. /forum/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Can you explain more?
 
$350-$400 per hour? Is that per man or per 3 man crew?

I made a hundred bucks today in ten minutes, ssoooooooo, that equates to $600 per hour for me. I'm rich
 
Have any of you ever felt guilty for doing a job so quick that you may have "made out like a bandit"?

The most I made on one job was $166/hr. I didn't plan it that way though.

The job was two Hybrid Cottonwood removals. One in front and the other in back. Front yard tree I fell in the coul-de-sac. It was about 70' tall with a crown about 40' wide. 40" DBH.--No problem. The back yard tree was about the same size, but was technical with major overhang over the house and wood deck. All the brush was taken care of that day and all logs brought out to the street to load the next day.

Here is where I say I did not plan the outcome of this. A new neighbor of mine introduced himself to me a couple of days befor the job (who has a skid steer and dump truck) offered to pick up wood at a job site if he could have it for fire wood. I said, "DEAL!" /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

So, the next work day I didn't have to pay three other guys to help me with the logs. I thought it was going to be near 64 man hours. (4 guys two 8 hour days).

My neighbor and I got the logs taken care of in a couple of hours and that was history. So, I worked a total of 12 hours and I took home $2000 in those two days. $166/hr. BABY! I still took the guys out for some sweet Mexican food with anything they wanted! /forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif

That was a rare situation.

Anyway, back to the question. See above.
 
Yes and no. I've been sent to jobs that were "rigging" jobs that I decide to flop. 1/2 day job or more turns into 2 hours or so of clean up. I don't feel guilty about it. We were awarded the job for the price, not really the time. So, if we get done faster, why not call it good hard training or experience? /forum/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
Totally agree....plus, you don't ask for more $ when a job proves to be underpriced, so why rebate when things go extra good??

The guy that taught me alot of treework had a funny saying...."people hate it when you work fast."
 
And with a nod to what Mark said, this same guy always said, "price it to climb, then crash it."
 
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