Climbing in open air /dead space

T

TimberNinja

Location
Maryland
How long did it take you to be comfortable climbing in dead space? have SRT'd up to 50' multiple times with no issue. In those cases , I wasn't far from the trunk

I had to prune a poplar the other day and had to ascend on a large union that put me probably 4' from the trunk. I'm sure it's just a mental thing, but not being able to have the ability to touch any part of the tree was a little unnerving.

Hoping this gets better in time ? Any tips? I just mentally coached myself and said "keep climbing , keep climbing"
 
Stay calm, stay focused, look at where you are going not where you’ve been The only difference is your feet aren’t touching anything. Play around a swing for a bit try and have fun. If your gear and TIP is solid you are just as secure as you were in the canopy.
 
Rec climb some big air. Just keep doing it until you develop that trust in the gear. What was going through your mind as you climbed? Visualizing something bad? See if you can confront the fear in your mind, and ask yourself what you think might happen. "What would actually go wrong in that scenario?" Is what I have asked myself. When you can't come up with a reasonable answer, it feels harder to keep panicking.
 
Matias said:
Rec climb some big air. Just keep doing it until you develop that trust in the gear. What was going through your mind as you climbed? Visualizing something bad? See if you can confront the fear in your mind, and ask yourself what you think might happen. "What would actually go wrong in that scenario?" Is what I have asked myself. When you can't come up with a reasonable answer, it feels harder to keep panicking.
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Great strategy. In my mind, I think I was mostly worried about getting stuck up there. Easily negated by deploying a second line I suppose
 
Do some big open air descents, it's easier to deal with as opposed to going up all air, gets you used to it.

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-AJ
 
TimberNinja said:
Great strategy. In my mind, I think I was mostly worried about getting stuck up there. Easily negated by deploying a second line I suppose
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As a newer climber, there is no harm in taking a second to undo your ascenders and let yourself down a foot. Just to check that you can get down. Just call out that fear and talk with it. Your rational brain can find the fallacies in your thinking.

Moss' idea is awesome too. Climb up the trunk and come down off a limb walk. Stop halfway down and see if you can get back up on the branch too! Exposing yourself to the scary thing will send that fear running.
 
TimberNinja said:
Hoping this gets better in time ? Any tips? I just mentally coached myself and said "keep climbing , keep climbing"
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Sorry I differ maybe in approach(s) mentioned above - rappel/ descent, esp. with free fall potential, is the most dangerous thing we do when working/ playing at height - period, I think - have a look at Accidents in N American Mountaineering over the years at the number of fatals when descending/ rappeling. A lot of treework folks up/ down on one device only, like a hitch or mechanical. However, now a second climb line is mandated in places, or a safety line with a lock off descender thingy, or a rap ring/ munter and biner or a shunt, in various locations as a backup for the down. Overkill maybe? I would start the free hanging practice sessions low and slow and work up from there - ascent and descent. If a tiny voice is telling you it's nervous - are you dead sure of your climbing system? And your descent system? And in all weather conditions - wet, icy ropes, glop/ slush covered ropes, etc. Stay safe out there. A climbing system must be bombproof - or once you get above 25 feet or so the rest of the height doesn't really matter anyway. Just my two cents tho.

Addenda: And in some regards, maybe a climber never wants to get into a place of absolute comfort anyway. I remember a rap off a climb down about a 60 degree slab, off of it into overhanging space. Scared the heebeegeebees out of all of us, and the first guy down (me) did call up for some extra rope padding for the edge of the slab - a tight rope over that edge just wasn't something I wanted to see (woulda even jury rigged a shoe or something if it came to it). Point is, there's always something. If you trust your system as bombproof you're then dealing with the changing circumstance, not that AND the climbing system.
 
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I would do like Moss suggests - ascend however you are comfortable, work your way out to an opening, then descend in open space. Stop part way then climb back up. Do it several times from varying heights. Then do it over a paved surface.
 
I've had this problem at times, it still gets me sometimes. My rock climbing/mountaineer friend calls it "exposure."

There's a lot of great comments hear, imo.

Something that I've noticed with myself, fitness and technique matter a lot. I learned from tom dunlap, don't work with your hands above your head. That simple change has really helped me to not get burned out on ascent, it makes such a difference. For me, the more tired out I get the more susceptible I am to irrational fear. The better shape that I am in mentally and physically the better time I have in the saddle, even having fun again for the first time in years!

Some stuff I read on here from rico too, coffee can really get your nerves up. Seems obvious but I never thought of it much in relation to fear while climbing. Being mindful of your bean juice consumption before climbing can really make or break the day, I've found. I've been doing a short tai chi routine before climbing, that also makes a huge difference for me!
 
Thanks so much guys. Nice to know many of you have felt something similar at one time

I did a rec climb today and did exactly what many of you suggested. Went up and down to about 35' several times in open space

I hadn't thought of doing it over pavement, that's a good idea
 
I’ve had the same issue with a 120ft cottonwood in my yard. It doesn’t have any close branches so, hanging in the breeze is nerve racking. Someone here @Treeaddict said if it hold at 3ft it will at 300. As, others said trust your gear (I say after through inspection) and I’m getting better at that. I recently cut a 150ft Samson rope because I didn’t trust it. I recently TIP into said cottonwood and climbed in open space. I then proceeded to swing like I was a kid again. It was awesome! Enjoy the journey, be safe and keep climbing higher. My 2 cents. Craig
 
rico said:
Trust your system.
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To modify this, since the OP appears to be a new climber: Understand your system.

If you've got a rope with a bunch if nicks, an 8 year old hand me down harness with the original bridge, and you're only kind of sure that you tied a bowline, maybe don't climb in free air?

If you understand the constraints of your gear, inspect it regularly, and have developed confidence in how the different parts of your system react to change, the trust comes naturally.
 
Flying~Squirrel said:
If you've got a rope with a bunch if nicks, an 8 year old hand me down harness with the original bridge, and you're only kind of sure that you tied a bowline, maybe don't climb in free air?
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All good points. It brings up the idea that a climber with compromised gear is somehow safer climbing on the tree vs. open air. Of course we know the danger is the same, being on the tree feels better but is no safer if gear is not safe.
-AJ
 
Cudos for asking this question. I don't have any answers any better than all the others. I just wanted to say there's no ego in learning,. Always be willing to ask the uncomfortable questions. The true professionals will never treat you poorly for doing so. Many years ago I was asking very similar questions on here and we given the same welcoming comments you're being given. Just from different professionals. You'll get there. It doesn't happen overnight. Trust the process and trust that inner voice at the same time.
 
levi r said:
I've had this problem at times, it still gets me sometimes. My rock climbing/mountaineer friend calls it "exposure."

There's a lot of great comments hear, imo.

Something that I've noticed with myself, fitness and technique matter a lot. I learned from tom dunlap, don't work with your hands above your head. That simple change has really helped me to not get burned out on ascent, it makes such a difference. For me, the more tired out I get the more susceptible I am to irrational fear. The better shape that I am in mentally and physically the better time I have in the saddle, even having fun again for the first time in years!

Some stuff I read on here from rico too, coffee can really get your nerves up. Seems obvious but I never thought of it much in relation to fear while climbing. Being mindful of your bean juice consumption before climbing can really make or break the day, I've found. I've been doing a short tai chi routine before climbing, that also makes a huge difference for me!
Click to expand...
Love this. Breath work has changed my life for the better, and I spend at least a half hour every morning practicing before I do anything. I have also found that a moment or 2 of breath work after I have reach my TIP and set any necessary rigging really helps me lock in my nervous system for a calm and cool day working aloft. My groundies fucking love this newer version of me!
 
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