Cabling tree near power line

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Not so much that they install them wrong, but that they don't know J lags are only effective in hardwood trees.

Amateurs miss that important distinction here in SoCal all the time left and right.

jomoco

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????? Why aren't lags effective in softwoods?
 
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????? Why aren't lags effective in softwoods?

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wood tissue is too soft on most conifers. the lags will likely pull out. through bolts should be used on conifers or other trees with relatively soft wood.

J-lags use the lag thread to hold them in the wood.
 
Yeah that doesn't sound quite right. Does anyone else use Rigguy wire stops? I have on a few jobs and i think they are great. They install so fast,and it simplifies the whole system. Less components to fail = better system, right?
 
I like to see thimble movement in a J-lag or an eye myself. but that's all i care to say about that. I've discussed this plenty in the past.
 
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wood tissue is too soft on most conifers. the lags will likely pull out. through bolts should be used on conifers or other trees with relatively soft wood.

J-lags use the lag thread to hold them in the wood.

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We install probably 100-200 J lag systems a year. I've never seen a J lag pull out of a softwood or a "soft" wood. The ones that have pulled out were the result of decay (typically on weak compartmentalizers) or heavy wind/ice loads on an American elm (Due to the natural decurrence, it is next to impossible to install a cable system at the correct height. We only due through-stem systems in elms now.)
 
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[ QUOTE ]
Not so much that they install them wrong, but that they don't know J lags are only effective in hardwood trees.

Amateurs miss that important distinction here in SoCal all the time left and right.

jomoco

[/ QUOTE ]

????? Why aren't lags effective in softwoods?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because they pull out under load more often than not, the wood is too soft for the threads to hold long enough for the lag to be engulfed by new wood.

jomoco
 
One of the hundreds of J lag failures I've replaced with proper throughbolts over the years,

DSCI0006.jpg


jomoco
 
Rigguys rock! They are exspensive but make up for the time involved for the installation. No hauling all that weight and tools to do mitigation. I go back and forth between rigguy and cobra.depending on the application. softwoods? I still wonder about the application at hand, cobra is the least invasive....
 
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wood tissue is too soft on most conifers. the lags will likely pull out. through bolts should be used on conifers or other trees with relatively soft wood.

J-lags use the lag thread to hold them in the wood.

[/ QUOTE ]

We install probably 100-200 J lag systems a year. I've never seen a J lag pull out of a softwood or a "soft" wood. The ones that have pulled out were the result of decay (typically on weak compartmentalizers) or heavy wind/ice loads on an American elm (Due to the natural decurrence, it is next to impossible to install a cable system at the correct height. We only due through-stem systems in elms now.)

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that's odd.

i don't know how you are not having them pull out in softwoods.

My first year in business, I did install a 1/2" j-lag in a leaning norway spruce tree to a ground anchor. (it leaned out over a pool, slightly uprooting) This was the first time and last time i ever installed a j-lag in a softwood in an important situation. Two months after I installed it, the customer called and said the cable was on the ground. Luckily the tree did not go over, so no true "failure" here. The lag had pulled out in a moderate wind storm. I drilled all the way through, and put in an eye bolt; all the way through. Everything was fine after that. To be honest, the j-lag wasn't totally in-line with the cable either. I was young and not so knowledgable.

like around 1995.

It's hard to understand that you aren't getting failure.

Maybe, are you using the largest J-lags, 5/8" and are you drilling the hole even smaller than recommended? this helps them hold better in softwoods.
 
It would seem there are a few folks here that need to brush up on the ansi300 cabling guidelines a bit.

That much is very evident.

jomoco
 
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wood tissue is too soft on most conifers. the lags will likely pull out. through bolts should be used on conifers or other trees with relatively soft wood.

J-lags use the lag thread to hold them in the wood.

[/ QUOTE ]

We install probably 100-200 J lag systems a year. I've never seen a J lag pull out of a softwood or a "soft" wood. The ones that have pulled out were the result of decay (typically on weak compartmentalizers) or heavy wind/ice loads on an American elm (Due to the natural decurrence, it is next to impossible to install a cable system at the correct height. We only due through-stem systems in elms now.)

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Each J lag you've installed in softwood trees is a direct liability to your company, and a violation of the ansi300 cabling guideline.

You will lose in court if person or property is damaged from your improper cabling of hundreds of trees my friend.

This thread should act as an eye opener for you, and that's a good thing.

jomoco
 
I believe these Rigguy newfangled wirestop systems have a fatal engineering flaw that will result in a recall and replacement of their ill thoughtout venture into the realm of professional cabling.

But I intend to start a new thread on the matter in courtesy to the original poster of this interesting thread.

jomoco
 
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It's hard to understand that you aren't getting failure.

Maybe, are you using the largest J-lags, 5/8" and are you drilling the hole even smaller than recommended? this helps them hold better in softwoods.

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We do use the 5/8 for most applications. I suppose we do cable mostly hardwoods, but I'll take your caution to heart on my next white pine cable (the most common, large softwood around these parts).
 
With all due respect Kev, without knowing the J lag's angle of path into the wood, your graph makes no sense.

The closer to exact alignment you can get between the cable lay and hardware terminations in a straight linear line, the stronger your installed cable will be.

jomoco
 
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Each J lag you've installed in softwood trees is a direct liability to your company, and a violation of the ansi300 cabling guideline.

[/ QUOTE ]Which standard are you talking about? I see no such language in ansi.
 
sorry Kevin, but that drawing isn't showing me anything either.

It's like, what is different here? aaaah, one has j-lags and one has dots.....

i thought i knew what you were saying from the beginning, now the diagram shows me i have no idea what you are talking about.
 
The term perpindicular was improper in terms of load.

Perpindicular lines meet at a 90 degree angle, therefore they would only apply to cabling other than triangular reinforcement of a weak or flawed wood union point.

jomoco
 
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