RopeShield
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Ontario, Canada
Glazing is easily remedied with a garden fork and pry bar or sonic spade.
You dig man!
You dig man!
Biodegradable aluminum
- Thread starter doctor_L
- Start date
Leaving on burlap and basket is a NO NO.
slight exception, is if you plant late summer (instead of early) and the balled small tree or bush has grown new root tips; where taking off the burlap would rip them off.
On larger specie trees, that basket better be taken OFF!
I've saved plenty stunted trees, by taking off baskets, burlap and twine. sometimes if late in the game, airspade around and cut the basket where you can.
most landscapers just make a hole and put the tree in the hole, they SUCK.
slight exception, is if you plant late summer (instead of early) and the balled small tree or bush has grown new root tips; where taking off the burlap would rip them off.
On larger specie trees, that basket better be taken OFF!
I've saved plenty stunted trees, by taking off baskets, burlap and twine. sometimes if late in the game, airspade around and cut the basket where you can.
most landscapers just make a hole and put the tree in the hole, they SUCK.
I appreciate haveing TB there in times that are frustrating and it seems that the numbers are low of people tuned in to at least a reality were science is better truth than what some guy showed them 20 years ago or yesterday for that matter.
forgive me if I rant a little but I've been loosing sleep over some "reputable" organization and likely or realistically a majority of an industry including lawn "care" and the likes. Any professional that's steps in the Drip line of a tree claiming to be there to help it. It's one thing to hat rack a Bradford pear when they won't let you cut it down and all the fancy talking in the world will ever change there mind and you can tell its been done two three times before. they know what they are in for they are familiar with looking at ugly all winter. it's another thing to conduct buisiness as a practice below a standard that you know is unacceptable to trade organizations one voluntarilly pledges to withhold standards of. holding credidentials or seals of approval or stars or acredidations or whatever else they can be called.
To the point Just out of curiosity douse the ISA or some other organizations you may know of actually go on random quality checks, respond if there is a customer complaint only , or other hypotheticals too numerouse to mention typing on an iPhone? (Is an iPad much better and is it worth the money?)
Now that is just a hypothetical I'm not looking for a fight just venting and trying to clear my head of this and get on the work I do have.
One more thing I'm thinking of proposing what I call the polished turd proposal and putting money into new stock and see what grows a kind of impromptu study. Especially if the nurserie stock is as bad as the installation made up of culled trees that was thought to be going to some city slicker that douse not know clay from loam. Honestly I saw enough from looking at two trees and new before asking one question From the contractor what I was dealing with. He opened his mouth and described in detail a method of planting completely contradictory to BMP's ISA any forestry or AG dept. on the planet. I did not look at the other trees I did not whant to see them I just drove around looking a big oaks on the property with soil compaction and just a little dead those are the trees I feal need some attention in the root zone.
I'm going to stop there go clean the saw dust off and try and not wake up before my alarm shaking land scrapers in my sleep and asking them "what the hell are you Doing and why do you keep doing it"
forgive me if I rant a little but I've been loosing sleep over some "reputable" organization and likely or realistically a majority of an industry including lawn "care" and the likes. Any professional that's steps in the Drip line of a tree claiming to be there to help it. It's one thing to hat rack a Bradford pear when they won't let you cut it down and all the fancy talking in the world will ever change there mind and you can tell its been done two three times before. they know what they are in for they are familiar with looking at ugly all winter. it's another thing to conduct buisiness as a practice below a standard that you know is unacceptable to trade organizations one voluntarilly pledges to withhold standards of. holding credidentials or seals of approval or stars or acredidations or whatever else they can be called.
To the point Just out of curiosity douse the ISA or some other organizations you may know of actually go on random quality checks, respond if there is a customer complaint only , or other hypotheticals too numerouse to mention typing on an iPhone? (Is an iPad much better and is it worth the money?)
Now that is just a hypothetical I'm not looking for a fight just venting and trying to clear my head of this and get on the work I do have.
One more thing I'm thinking of proposing what I call the polished turd proposal and putting money into new stock and see what grows a kind of impromptu study. Especially if the nurserie stock is as bad as the installation made up of culled trees that was thought to be going to some city slicker that douse not know clay from loam. Honestly I saw enough from looking at two trees and new before asking one question From the contractor what I was dealing with. He opened his mouth and described in detail a method of planting completely contradictory to BMP's ISA any forestry or AG dept. on the planet. I did not look at the other trees I did not whant to see them I just drove around looking a big oaks on the property with soil compaction and just a little dead those are the trees I feal need some attention in the root zone.
I'm going to stop there go clean the saw dust off and try and not wake up before my alarm shaking land scrapers in my sleep and asking them "what the hell are you Doing and why do you keep doing it"
I edited last post to get rid of some run on sentences and some of the auto ferret nonsense I mean auto correct nonsense. How did It decide I wanted to use "ferret". I do like how it keeps changing landscaper to land scraper though. I left that. Maybe it is a smart phone after all.
The things that some others do to give me an upset stomach as well, I completely understand your anguish.
I tend to get on the phone and chat with folks that work for us in ___ association. One common recurring theme is that their mandate is not to enforce the rules, it is to educate about them. My response, why a "rule" then? There are answers to that of course. Make it a standard or rule so that we have something to point to when it goes south. The rules or BMP are really there only to give structure. Good in some ways, for they allow you to have an individual ideology.
Another response you will encounter is "We do not have the budget for that." Simple fix for my simple mind - Why not send a guy out to check on stuff? I would take the job that relies on commission only for pay to go out and ticket those that skirt or ignore the "rules". Fines are legal issues, lots of lawyers. You will eventually end in a free will discussion. Trying to convince others of the reason for the rule can often be time not well spent. Just work the ones that your discussion seems to be impacting and take comfort that you are correct in your thinkng.
So far murder of our fellow man is one of the worst crimes. Murder isn't even a phrase we think of when talking about trees (though hearing it more these days). Arboricultural malpractice is another real thing not thought of. I see way too much of that.
I tend to get on the phone and chat with folks that work for us in ___ association. One common recurring theme is that their mandate is not to enforce the rules, it is to educate about them. My response, why a "rule" then? There are answers to that of course. Make it a standard or rule so that we have something to point to when it goes south. The rules or BMP are really there only to give structure. Good in some ways, for they allow you to have an individual ideology.
Another response you will encounter is "We do not have the budget for that." Simple fix for my simple mind - Why not send a guy out to check on stuff? I would take the job that relies on commission only for pay to go out and ticket those that skirt or ignore the "rules". Fines are legal issues, lots of lawyers. You will eventually end in a free will discussion. Trying to convince others of the reason for the rule can often be time not well spent. Just work the ones that your discussion seems to be impacting and take comfort that you are correct in your thinkng.
So far murder of our fellow man is one of the worst crimes. Murder isn't even a phrase we think of when talking about trees (though hearing it more these days). Arboricultural malpractice is another real thing not thought of. I see way too much of that.
Well I did not get the job and have not been informed as to why. Only that they have it covered. I pray that the original company is fixing the issues in the instalation performed for their client. If so, i doubt that they are going to go try to make right decades of sub par work. Of course i am assuming that what i see is their average quality. They are a large outfit multiple nurseries, multiple retail nursery locations around our area. They have fingers reaching into more crevices than I can, by far.
I briefly entertained the idea of going to there office and asking for a job and one of those 350's, but seriously I used to go to some of their locations on ocasion to pick up plants tools and amendments out of convenience when time was more important than money. Now I worry they may make it a hobby to crush some "little guy" because they think we are costing them alot of money compleatly over looking ethics involved. As unfounded as my fears may be, what power would i ever have especially if we can't coun't on on our own communities organizations to inforce regulations their own dues paying members subscribe to.
Now, especially since I have nothing out of this but a little more experience in meeting with bigger clients. Maybe next time i get it right? This is not a big job just a bunch of little ones. And of course I wanted it bad, I want every job I look at including the ones I see someone else doing while I'm driving to and from mine.
Last "big job" I did not get I did not want to sound to eager so I did not try and sell my self just assured them I could handle it like I have many times before with practically no complaints and zero complaints since taking the step to have full controll over my work and labor force. This time being sure I was not the only one going to be biding I mostly focused on selling myself and counted on putting pencil to paper and crunching the real numbers when push came to shove.
I hope I will get some feedback as to why I did not get it. I presume I tried to hard to sell it over email correspondence rather than face to face sending emails from cab of truck on the way to dump or from the canopy of a tree while waiting for the ground to catch up. And in between making sandwiches for children and such like that. My wife is a BS holding horticulturist with a better head for grammer than I and latin names. From now on all correspondence will go through her. Maybe even some late night rantings after I've cracked a beer or three.
Perhaps they become unhappy with next crew and give us a chance. We are small but we have mind and muscle, experience, education, we are insured and not without friends in our local community. I work for a smile on a clients face when they see our work and then I know everything else will fall in place.
I briefly entertained the idea of going to there office and asking for a job and one of those 350's, but seriously I used to go to some of their locations on ocasion to pick up plants tools and amendments out of convenience when time was more important than money. Now I worry they may make it a hobby to crush some "little guy" because they think we are costing them alot of money compleatly over looking ethics involved. As unfounded as my fears may be, what power would i ever have especially if we can't coun't on on our own communities organizations to inforce regulations their own dues paying members subscribe to.
Now, especially since I have nothing out of this but a little more experience in meeting with bigger clients. Maybe next time i get it right? This is not a big job just a bunch of little ones. And of course I wanted it bad, I want every job I look at including the ones I see someone else doing while I'm driving to and from mine.
Last "big job" I did not get I did not want to sound to eager so I did not try and sell my self just assured them I could handle it like I have many times before with practically no complaints and zero complaints since taking the step to have full controll over my work and labor force. This time being sure I was not the only one going to be biding I mostly focused on selling myself and counted on putting pencil to paper and crunching the real numbers when push came to shove.
I hope I will get some feedback as to why I did not get it. I presume I tried to hard to sell it over email correspondence rather than face to face sending emails from cab of truck on the way to dump or from the canopy of a tree while waiting for the ground to catch up. And in between making sandwiches for children and such like that. My wife is a BS holding horticulturist with a better head for grammer than I and latin names. From now on all correspondence will go through her. Maybe even some late night rantings after I've cracked a beer or three.
Perhaps they become unhappy with next crew and give us a chance. We are small but we have mind and muscle, experience, education, we are insured and not without friends in our local community. I work for a smile on a clients face when they see our work and then I know everything else will fall in place.
treehumper
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Ridgefield, NJ
Welcome to the corporate world. Let's see, you have an owner whose initial success is due to the quality and care of his work. They grow and now have location managers and sales people and crews far removed from the top. Like the game of broken telephone the original direction and attitude gets water down and interpreted to the point where it now only matters to get the job done with a good margin. Short cuts are taken to get there and since the person whose name is actually on the line isn't on the frontline nobody cares.
They'll deal with it when they get caught, as you're seeing now.
As for policing rules, this is why the code of ethics was supposed to be self-enforced. Would you not feel that you should be able to file a complaint to the ISA for an ethics violation against their CA? In many self-regulated industries this is exactly how it works and nobody seems to get bent out of shape over it.
They'll deal with it when they get caught, as you're seeing now.
As for policing rules, this is why the code of ethics was supposed to be self-enforced. Would you not feel that you should be able to file a complaint to the ISA for an ethics violation against their CA? In many self-regulated industries this is exactly how it works and nobody seems to get bent out of shape over it.
Well said as usuall Mr. Gillies.
Just to answer the question about feeling comfortable filing complaint. My emotions were riled for sure but I question the potential vindictiveness of all these bipeds walking among us. Most of us work and live in communities of some limited size and my gut tells me there is likely more harm to my family than the good feeling of making waves for noble reasons in such a limited environment. Especially if a voluntary self slap on the wrist can recoil to send a shock wave through my livelihood. Of course in hindsight there are many things I wish I would have said or said differently. As I said with the first vibe of defensiveness and covering tracks I only said "I'm not looking for an argument" I just let him talk and made him feel like the expert and I was just some saw jockey. I was not there to educate him he's had twenty plus years to do that himself. I find it hard to beilive what he said is what he believes to be true just that it's what he's used to doing. And anyone who can look you in the eyes an attempt to grossly misinform you... I have reel concerns of what else they are capable of justifying.
Though if this client became my client I would not hesitate to lodge complaints with any organization or just move on and fix what I can or focus on new plantings it would be their choice, they got ripped off not me.
Looking out for the interests of a client is looking out for the interests of my family.
Just to answer the question about feeling comfortable filing complaint. My emotions were riled for sure but I question the potential vindictiveness of all these bipeds walking among us. Most of us work and live in communities of some limited size and my gut tells me there is likely more harm to my family than the good feeling of making waves for noble reasons in such a limited environment. Especially if a voluntary self slap on the wrist can recoil to send a shock wave through my livelihood. Of course in hindsight there are many things I wish I would have said or said differently. As I said with the first vibe of defensiveness and covering tracks I only said "I'm not looking for an argument" I just let him talk and made him feel like the expert and I was just some saw jockey. I was not there to educate him he's had twenty plus years to do that himself. I find it hard to beilive what he said is what he believes to be true just that it's what he's used to doing. And anyone who can look you in the eyes an attempt to grossly misinform you... I have reel concerns of what else they are capable of justifying.
Though if this client became my client I would not hesitate to lodge complaints with any organization or just move on and fix what I can or focus on new plantings it would be their choice, they got ripped off not me.
Looking out for the interests of a client is looking out for the interests of my family.
Buried aluminum lasts a lot longer; less oxygen exposure to convert the alumina to aluminum oxide. The guy is full of it.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
Aluminum 'scales', that is, the surface molecules oxidize and that happens immediately on contact with air. It doesn't really continue break down from corrosion because the surface scale is protective. It take a strong acid to cut through it.
I'm sure there is long term.... very long term, chemical break down but it will be far in excess of the life of an urban tree.
Strengths of Materials 101.
I'm sure there is long term.... very long term, chemical break down but it will be far in excess of the life of an urban tree.
Strengths of Materials 101.
In metallurgy, we call that a passivisation process; it's what happens to the surface of stainless steels that prevents further corrosion.
In exposed aluminum, the weathering environment removes the oxide continually (albeit very slowly), exposing fresh aluminum to oxidize.
So yes, that is basically correct.
So why anyone would leave those materials on for planting is beyond me.
In exposed aluminum, the weathering environment removes the oxide continually (albeit very slowly), exposing fresh aluminum to oxidize.
So yes, that is basically correct.
So why anyone would leave those materials on for planting is beyond me.
- Location
- urbana, il.
Some of the things large landscape and lawn care co's say to make a buck or save a buck, makes me want to laugh......but makes me annoyed at the same time 
thanks folks for the info on aluminum too.
thanks folks for the info on aluminum too.
