Anyone using Phantom 11mm?

[Burrapeg]

I tried some Phantom that was a remnant on sale at WesSpur and had some occasional slippage issues with my ZigZag/RopeWrench combo. Also slipped on my adjustable BDB until I ran the adjustment all the way in. It is surprisingly soft for a static rope, knots well so far. Seems to flatten out quite a bit more than I am used to with my other ropes. Anyone else on here using this rope? Any thoughts on it? I have not tried it yet with hitches.

 

[Crazy_Jimmy]

I think its way to small for a zig zag , its 11 mm but flattens out like the size of a pencil. Also doesn't do well with little nicks and frays

 

[Muggs]

Yeah, slips right through my Bulldog Bone. I like it with a hitch though. Nice for a hook line.

 

[Matias]

It's just a color variant of kernmaster poly core. I have used the Bifrost version in my Zillon without noticing any slippage, but I've only run it once. It's surprisingly supple; agree with you there. I only weigh 170, so I feel like that helps when it comes to running 11mm in the zigzag/zillon.

Edit to add: I will soon be experimenting again with tethering my wrench to the zigzag. When I tried it before it was soooooooo much smoother than the chicane- it was already obvious to me as a new climber years ago. My tether was awkward and I sucked at working that slick pin with gloves, which I can now do. I'm praying that I don't start seeing creep, because I do love how quick and easy it is to get the 11mm in the zigzag.

 

[Matias]

Yeah, slips right through my Bulldog Bone. I like it with a hitch though. Nice for a hook line.

I have 45' that I was gonna use for my hook which is arriving Monday!

 

[Shadowscape]

Zigzags are not rated to operate on 11mm. 11.5-13mm only.

Phantom/Bifrost/variants run fine for me with the Apex wrench and VT.

Still have not found a rope I like better with the Zigzag than Yale's Scandere, whether it is SRT or DRT. Run the Apex wrench on a tether with the Zigzag when SRT most of the time. Sometimes just use the Zigzag SRT by itself if I am not going to be using it all day SRT. Works fine if you grab the links in your fist so they don't collapse and just operate the top flipper.

 

[Matias]

Zigzags are not rated to operate on 11mm. 11.5-12.5 only.

Phantom/Bifrost/variants run fine for me with the Apex wrench and VT.

I feel like that's in the realm of the discussion of the 'spirit of the law' vs the 'letter of the law'. And it's also up to 13mm. I have literally never once had an issue with 11mm in ZZ and I'm not the only one. It's grown on me, and unless I am impressed 6 mo the from now with some 11.5 I am about to get, I will be running 11mm moving forward. I bet you anything that you can't install a zigzag on a well broken in 12.7mm rope. You can definitely get it on when new, and it works as long as you leave it on, but it gets clunky once past the initial break in. The stock zillon lanyard suffers the same problem: it stops running smoothly before the end of its service life. It seems to be petzls business model- make the expensive part awesome and affordable, and get you on the repeat purchases with expensive ropes and high wear elements.

 

[Crazy_Jimmy]

I feel like that's in the realm of the discussion of the 'spirit of the law' vs the 'letter of the law'. And it's also up to 13mm. I have literally never once had an issue with 11mm in ZZ and I'm not the only one. It's grown on me, and unless I am impressed 6 mo the from now with some 11.5 I am about to get, I will be running 11mm moving forward. I bet you anything that you can't install a zigzag on a well broken in 12.7mm rope. You can definitely get it on when new, and it works as long as you leave it on, but it gets clunky once past the initial break in. The stock zillon lanyard suffers the same problem: it stops running smoothly before the end of its service life. It seems to be petzls business model- make the expensive part awesome and affordable, and get you on the repeat purchases with expensive ropes and high wear elements.

I no think those thinner ropes may show signs of creeping quicker , so I guess you could just keep moving to a larger diameter as it wear. I have few zig zags and I’m thinking I should probably inspect them more thoroughly but I don’t really climb on them much anymore . I really dig the rope runner pro these days.

 

[Shadowscape]

I feel like that's in the realm of the discussion of the 'spirit of the law' vs the 'letter of the law'. And it's also up to 13mm. I have literally never once had an issue with 11mm in ZZ and I'm not the only one. It's grown on me, and unless I am impressed 6 mo the from now with some 11.5 I am about to get, I will be running 11mm moving forward. I bet you anything that you can't install a zigzag on a well broken in 12.7mm rope. You can definitely get it on when new, and it works as long as you leave it on, but it gets clunky once past the initial break in. The stock zillon lanyard suffers the same problem: it stops running smoothly before the end of its service life. It seems to be petzls business model- make the expensive part awesome and affordable, and get you on the repeat purchases with expensive ropes and high wear elements.

Won't argue with you on 11mm in the Zigzag. I have run it as well. Just pointing out it is not rated for it, so if you find it slips on you, you have no complaints to make.
I will argue on wear vs size however. I have found that when a Zigzag begins to slip on a 11.5 rope, moving up to a 11.8 will make it work like new again. And when it wears to the point it begins slipping there you can go up to the 12.5 group and start again. That said, I have tried Vortex 12.7 in a new Zigzag and found it to be horrible. Whereas a very worn one runs it just fine. But, we weigh differently, and that makes a difference. We each have to find what works best for ourselves and the gear we carry with us, the hitch system we use, and how we use it. No one things fits all in this business.
You are correct, 13mm. I will edit my post.

 

[Matias]

I have some years of moderate use on my ZZ, but it sounds like I will get to run all my fatter ropes in there eventually. That makes me pretty happy to hear. So to continue to derail the conversation, I don't have a newer ZZ to compare with, but how much side load wiggle is there supposed to be. Mine's operating smoothly as ever, but I worry about the chain feeling a bit floppy across the wrong axis. I feel like I might need to make a quick video to show what I mean.

 

[Judson]

I love Phantom. My favorite rope. I also had a little bit of slippage when using my ZZ with it, but only when the rope was BRAND new. After a handful of climbs on the rope (I had moved back to a hitch at this point), I noticed that it never slipped again with the ZZ. I was aware that 11.0 Phantom is smaller than the stated 11.5, and up, rating for the ZZ, but I have to say it performs beautifully now. Maybe even better than fatter ropes I've used with the ZZ. I'll keep an eye on the ZZ for any premature wearing as a result of the 'thinner' rope being used.