?Kevlar kite string for throw line?

[Marie Muma]

Basic idea in a picture.

https://www.treebuzz.com/forum/attachments/197725-throwlinewinders-earlydays-jpg.17853/

Thanks.

 

[southsoundtree]

We “invented” our chain Friction Saver using a thick rubber hose collar around a substantial chain with a stainless steel ring shackled (tied off with wire) to the chain.
This friction saver is installed about 70 feet up and stays put. Our climbing rope is stored at the base of the tree in a bin and is “permanently” attached to the retrieval line (presently just a throw line). We store it after our climb and raise it each time.
The throw line is very thin (Dyneema) and is a bit hard on my gloved hands while pulling on it to raise the climbing rope. That is why I was thinking of using a reel. Initially the amount of tug is not much but once the rope gets high enough and passes the ring, that is when it becomes more difficult.
The fishing reel is probably not going to work which we tried with the present throw line. I doubt that we will even use the stainless steel 1/16th inch cable unless we can find the sort of reel that can be attached on our decking surrounding our tree.
The back up plan is to purchase a “retrieval” line that is thicker and easier to just haul in hand over hand. This line stays up in the tree between climbs. I will probably use 1/4 inch polyester double braided line which will be so much easier on my hands while pulling on it to raise the climbing rope. View attachment 71819

If you wrap.the spine of a biner a handful of times with the throw line, you have a temporary handle. Use your leg muscles for pulling the rope, redirected at the base, if you have a walking path.


A Super-munter hitch on a stick works, too.



Is your throw line to climbing line connection passing through the ring easily, or snagging?

 

[Tom Dunlap]

I apologize if I missed your reply...question about the welded ring you have your rope doubled through. Who makes the ring? Is it rated? The weld doesn’t have the eye appeal I like with gear in this configuration. The diameter of the ring material is thinner than I would choose too. There are some really nice, wide, forged rings available.

 

[Rob Stafari]

Consider perhaps throwing a thicker pair of gloves in the kit just for pulling the lines up. I love the dexterity of my thin gloves but throwline does bite right through them. Something like a thicker leather glove or winter style glove with the coated palm so you have the better grip(I know it will be hot, but they won't be on your hands long) will still allow you to pull the line while protecting your hands. Once the line is up switch back to your climbing glove of preference.

 

[Marie Muma]

I apologize if I missed your reply...question about the welded ring you have your rope doubled through. Who makes the ring? Is it rated? The weld doesn’t have the eye appeal I like with gear in this configuration. The diameter of the ring material is thinner than I would choose too. There are some really nice, wide, forged rings available.

Consider perhaps throwing a thicker pair of gloves in the kit just for pulling the lines up. I love the dexterity of my thin gloves but throwline does bite right through them. Something like a thicker leather glove or winter style glove with the coated palm so you have the better grip(I know it will be hot, but they won't be on your hands long) will still allow you to pull the line while protecting your hands. Once the line is up switch back to your climbing glove of preference.

Thanks. I do use thicker gloves, but still not the best situation.

 

[Marie Muma]

As far as who makes the ring that we are using for our Chain Friction Saver, I do not know. We went to a Marine Supplier in our area to shop for the items. It is rated very highly, being used in the marine industry.

 

[Marie Muma]

I apologize if I missed your reply...question about the welded ring you have your rope doubled through. Who makes the ring? Is it rated? The weld doesn’t have the eye appeal I like with gear in this configuration. The diameter of the ring material is thinner than I would choose too. There are some really nice, wide, forged rings available.

The ring was purchased from a Marine Supply store. It is very highly rated as it is used in the marine industry.

 

[Jehinten]

I've not tried this, but it's cheap enough to experiment with, but using this cord storage may give you better leverage for pulling and providing a storage solution as well. https://www.lowes.com/pd/Utilitech-...j1Mxyo9ODxeotMPerJgaAhUDEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

I keep one of my throwlines in a large Dewalt chalkline reel. The gearing on the crank handle does not allow it to be thrown out of the reel or strong enough to pull the rope up the tree. But after pulling the rope up by hand its very fast and easy storage, and never tangles. If you wanted to throw or shoot the line, you just pull enough out by hand to make the distance that you need. I often do not throw this one, because it has to be pulled out first, and instead tie it to other throw lines to replace one that I just threw if I'm setting multiple or to double bag to isolate my line.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

As far as who makes the ring that we are using for our Chain Friction Saver, I do not know. We went to a Marine Supplier in our area to shop for the items. It is rated very highly, being used in the marine industry.

I used those welded rings in the past. After a while I quit using them. The main reason is that there are no markings on them to show their rating.

They are meant to be used in between two links not to have moving rope rigged through them. The lumpy weld concerns me.

There is a strength loss when bending a rope over a radius. The ratio compares the diameter of the rope to the diameter of the edge. A common bend ration is four to one. Our climbing ropes are roughly half inch so a four inch bend is a good ratio. Less than that changes the efficiency. Eventually working down to a knife edge. Do some reading on 'bend ratios'

 

[Marie Muma]

I used those welded rings in the past. After a while I quit using them. The main reason is that there are no markings on them to show their rating.

They are meant to be used in between two links not to have moving rope rigged through them. The lumpy weld concerns me.

There is a strength loss when bending a rope over a radius. The ratio compares the diameter of the rope to the diameter of the edge. A common bend ration is four to one. Our climbing ropes are roughly half inch so a four inch bend is a good ratio. Less than that changes the efficiency. Eventually working down to a knife edge. Do some reading on 'bend ratios'

Thanks, will do. I do believe we are 100% safe when it comes to this stainless steel ring failing.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Thanks, will do. I do believe we are 100% safe when it comes to this stainless steel ring failing.

My concern isn't about failure.

doubling a rope over a small diameter is a concern
Not having specs marked on the ring is a concern
Globby weld is a concern

Forged rings solve all of the concerns.

My concerns aren't always others.

 

[ATH]

My concern isn't about failure.

doubling a rope over a small diameter is a concern
Not having specs marked on the ring is a concern
Globby weld is a concern

Forged rings solve all of the concerns.

My concerns aren't always others.

I'd at least use 2 rings to double the bend radius...(like a ring and ring)

The weld is certainly ugly. Makes me wonder about overall quality.

The rating...if I am buying it for myself to be installed in a location like that, I don't care if it is stamped on the ring, but I would want to know it is rated for at least 5400 lbs before using it.

 

[Winchman]

The smallest corner determines the minimum bend radius, so using two rings of the same or similar size doesn't help. What you really need is something shaped like this in a suitable size and material, preferably with a rating stamped on it.

Good luck with that, though.

I've never used a ring or a limb for a moving rope subjected to climbing loads other than the little movement that takes place as the anchor rope holding up my Petzl rescue pulley stretches. The ball-bearing rescue pulley was the largest rated pulley I could find to use in my 3:1 and now 2:1 climbing rigs. It only takes a few minutes to pull it up with an anchor rope over a limb or over a friction saver. I can't find a pulley that I would leave permanently in a tree that I wanted to climb repeatedly.

 

[Benjo75]

I know rigging rings aren't "rated" for life support but they would handle a great deal more than probably any of our climbing gear would. An X large rigging ring would be nice in that position. If it were rated for life support. Which they aren't.

 

[melv@ftc]

To prevent rodent chewing handle your cordage with gloves on. Rodents are not interested in chewing syntheic fibers, they are interested in the salts transmitted from sweat on your hands to the cordage. They are very practical and efficient and do things for a reason ;-)
-AJ

Thats very interesting.

 

[Jehinten]

I know rigging rings aren't "rated" for life support but they would handle a great deal more than probably any of our climbing gear would. An X large rigging ring would be nice in that position. If it were rated for life support. Which they aren't.

Agreed. A while back treestuff made a climbing ring and ring with a rigging thimble. I know that x-rings were said not suitable for climbing, maybe other rings are rated/suitable for it?

 

[Rob Stafari]

I can't see why a rigging ring would not be suitable for life support, beyond not being tested/rated in that configuration? In reality it is merely serving as a spacer/friction saver between the two ropes that are actually holding the weight. Is it the concern of the possibility of the ring coming unplaced and having rope on rope which would be very bad? Have there been any cases of this happening in a rigging scenerio that anyone knows of?

 

[Jehinten]

Is it the concern of the possibility of the ring coming unplaced and having rope on rope which would be very bad?

I believe that was the concern of David Driver when the x rings first came out and why he would only send them out professionally spliced.

 

[Benjo75]

A Safebloc would be nice. A dedicated hole to hang it from and two other holes that with a nice bend radius.

 

[Benjo75]

I left carpeners twine in a tree for 3 months this past summer. It totally rotted away. There were little pink pieces about 6 inches long everywhere. It was as brittle as a cracker.