...concerning :Ocean's lowerable basal":

[matamorph]

Love the look of this setup:
, it's compact! but, I tried reproducing it with what I had at hand and:


And it would invariably 'flip' into this configuration!!

...Functions fine still, but the line running across the barrel like that can't be ideal right?!!..must be tying it wrong!

...and how do you lock it off?

A friction hitch over a hard locked figure-eight seems much better no?!

 

[matamorph]

Ah!.. Just saw what I did wrong!

...(figure eight still better I think)

 

[oceans]

The green ring on my anchor is spliced into the eyes of the Reep Schnur hitch. The same eyes are large enough to be captured by the carabiner on the anchor sling. The photo that Archie posted doesn't quite show enough of the hitch.

I'll get some pics today to help clarify things.

 

[ArchiePittsburgh]

Thanks for clarifying Whipple, shared the picture I took from when you were out with us in response to Tony's similar setup with the rigging plate.
Sorry for the confusion Matamorph, should have taken a better picture from the side as well

 

[matamorph]

I guess I didn't see!

Thanks for clearing that up (...looking forward to another pic though)

Id be interested to know if the same could be achieved with knots instead of splices? Would the bulk interfere with the functioning of the ring maybe? I don't have the right to work on my own splices so knots would make this 'neat' setup useable. Thanks.

 

[Brocky]

I've found that there needs to be some space between the stitch plate, or ring used as one, in order to descend or lower someone. If you tied longer eyes it would give the space needed, plus they would be up above, out of the way.

 

[oceans]

Here's the setup. I got into Go-Mode this morning and spaced the pics. I'll get some tomorrow morning on the tree and maybe a quick vid of the kit in action if there's time. Step by step:

You'll want all that's pictured here -


Ring Loop -


Install on Lowering Line (can be one climb line 3x tree height, or just a dedicated one like mine for rope to rope connection at base). -


Connect Ring Loop to Anchor Sling -


Create sticht plate in ring -


I pack my bag with the Lowering Line on bottom, but leaving the Ring Loop & Sticht Plate installed and left out of the bag. Next, I load in the Climb Line. Lastly, I lay the Ring Loop in, then the Anchor Sling.

When it's time to climb, I pull out the Anchor Sling & Ring Loop. Pull the climb line into the tree, and connect it to the Lowering Line. Then I install the Anchor Sling and connect the Ring Loop to it. Pull my Climb Line tight and off to the Canopy.

I hope that clears it all up. No fault of Archie, as it's a bit weird to see what's really going on despite how simple it actually is.

 

[matamorph]

Here's the setup. I got into Go-Mode this morning and spaced the pics. I'll get some tomorrow morning on the tree and maybe a quick vid of the kit in action if there's time. Step by step:

You'll want all that's pictured here -
View attachment 43313

Ring Loop -
View attachment 43314

Install on Lowering Line (can be one climb line 3x tree height, or just a dedicated one like mine for rope to rope connection at base). -
View attachment 43315

Connect Ring Loop to Anchor Sling -
View attachment 43316

Create sticht plate in ring -
View attachment 43317

I pack my bag with the Lowering Line on bottom, but leaving the Ring Loop & Sticht Plate installed and left out of the bag. Next, I load in the Climb Line. Lastly, I lay the Ring Loop in, then the Anchor Sling.

When it's time to climb, I pull out the Anchor Sling & Ring Loop. Pull the climb line into the tree, and connect it to the Lowering Line. Then I install the Anchor Sling and connect the Ring Loop to it. Pull my Climb Line tight and off to the Canopy.

I hope that clears it all up. No fault of Archie, as it's a bit weird to see what's really going on despite how simple it actually is.

AWSOME! Thanks for the step-by-step. Cleared up ALL confusion!

...wait a minute!... What's that?!!...

(rummage in the bag)...



...Turns out I have one of those!*

Trying this again!**
-----------------------------

* found on the 'business' end of a very under-used Teufelberger multi saver.

** once this howling wind & rain stops!

 

[Brocky]

Looks like larger eyes too. Excellent!

 

[matamorph]

Looks like larger eyes too. Excellent!

Stitched eyes only though, no splices. Should I be worried? Would these eyes still be rated for life support when stressed internally in directions unintended in its original function?

Maybe girth hitching a loop of OP over the hoop & biner would be more sure??

 

[matamorph]

...and again oceans? What would be the best way to lock this thing off so the metal takes the brunt of any stupidity??

 

[matamorph]

Stitched eyes only though, no splices. Should I be worried? Would these eyes still be rated for life support when stressed internally in directions unintended in its original function?

Maybe girth hitching a loop of OP over the hoop & biner would be more sure??

(Not everything that looks the same, IS the same!..)

 

[Brocky]

There wouldn't be much force on the stitching as the ring mostly floats while in use for descending or lowering. There is only force if the brake part of the rope is pulled down to add friction and then the ring slides down towards the carabiner. The hitch holds the climber so there is no stress on the lowering system unless it is needed.

 

[matamorph]

(.....Just a thought:- )

Could there be possible SRT applications for something resembling this? I'm sure I've seen a figure8/...Munter under a hitch climber system, presented as a cheap 'everyman's' SRT option somewhere??

... (on here probably!!)

...If the stitch-plate/ring/...fig8 could somehow be placed above the hitch would be best I'm guessing...

 

[oceans]

(.....Just a thought:- )

Could there be possible SRT applications for something resembling this? I'm sure I've seen a figure8/...Munter under a hitch climber system, presented as a cheap 'everyman's' SRT option somewhere??

... (on here probably!!)

...If the stitch-plate/ring/...fig8 could somehow be placed above the hitch would be best I'm guessing...

Look up Bingham's old videos of the F8 Revolver. That's how his SRT journey into the Rope Wrench all began.

 

[ghostice]

My comment is that this may pass the whistle test but, neither a sewn eye (or a spliced eye) on the prissik is meant to be loaded (upwards) towards stitching. So if you completely release the prussik, and lower on the ring (like a munter), does the ring load the stitching (or splice) in an upwards direction? If yes, maybe caution/ rethink is needed?
Second comment is that maybe the ring would be more comfy with a round cross section biner rather than an "H" cross section biner. That way, no matter what way the bottom biner is flopped or is loading it, it will always see a nice round profile at point of contact there (just like using another ring). My 2 cents . . .

 

[matamorph]

Look up Bingham's old videos of the F8 Revolver. That's how his SRT journey into the Rope Wrench all began.

Look up Bingham's old videos of the F8 Revolver. That's how his SRT journey into the Rope Wrench all began.

Yes! that's what I was imagining!

...might even be the video that I saw!

But seeing it in action I see it's very de-connection/connection intensive. Fine if you're 75-100% srt, and you can dial it in nice. However, I can see why it led to greater things! (...I had no idea that was the genus of the WR.) That man is a genius!

As a side note:

In my spare time, while canyoning/cragging n such, I have OFTEN slipped down a single line on just a figure 8, sometimes a friction hitch backing up a fig8, and sometimes just a prussic and never had an issue, but...

The rope was always at least soaking wet, it not, squarely under a waterfall, so heat buildup was 0% a problem.

...I've done worse...

...but not recently!

 

[oceans]

My comment is that this may pass the whistle test but, neither a sewn eye (or a spliced eye) on the prissik is meant to be loaded (upwards) towards stitching. So if you completely release the prussik, and lower on the ring (like a munter), does the ring load the stitching (or splice) in an upwards direction? If yes, maybe caution/ rethink is needed?
Second comment is that maybe the ring would be more comfy with a round cross section biner rather than an "H" cross section biner. That way, no matter what way the bottom biner is flopped or is loading it, it will always see a nice round profile at point of contact there (just like using another ring). My 2 cents . . .

@Brocky was correct in that the Ring shouldn't be loaded upwards. That would be mis-use.

It should be loaded downwards, by pulling the Sticht Plate Carabiner downward and away from the Ring as the hitch is released. Setting the Anchor Sling at a proper height for the user is another part of this equation.

 

[SomethingWitty]

@Brocky was correct in that the Ring shouldn't be loaded upwards. That would be mis-use.

It should be loaded downwards, by pulling the Sticht Plate Carabiner downward and away from the Ring as the hitch is released. Setting the Anchor Sling at a proper height for the user is another part of this equation.

I think that after someone learns how those belay devices work, the understanding that the ring is only being tethered to the work area rather than loading the eyes will develop.
Using a sticht plate is usually not considered in our industry. I know several good climbers who would belay with a figure 8 the same way that they rappel just because they are unaware of the appropriate way to do it.

That storrick site is golden.

 

[oceans]

I think that after someone learns how those belay devices work, the understanding that the ring is only being tethered to the work area rather than loading the eyes will develop.
Using a sticht plate is usually not considered in our industry. I know several good climbers who would belay with a figure 8 the same way that they rappel just because they are unaware of the appropriate way to do it.

That storrick site is golden.

Exactly. Raise your hands if you like hockles...nobody?