Subbing equipment

AW4130 said:
You know... I was kind of wondering if that seemed a little low. A friend of mine told me that it was as well. It just seems like where I am it's really hard to price things as they should be. We have so much competition within our small area it's seriously ridiculous. If you have any advice I welcome it friend. And I guess I should add, I'm friends with most of the guys I sub with at the moment. They all have their own small company's as well. So I try to be very considerate of their needs as well. I don't have as much overhead and as many life responsibilities as some of my buds. (Kids, big mortgage, new car payments) So, I try to be fair. Meaning, they need more income, so I try and make sure they get it.
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There's nothing wrong with helping out your friends as long as you still get your fair share of the pie as well. If you're making it so affordable for them by providing your assistance and equipment at a below norm rate-why would they want to purchase their own equipment? It's kinda like a parent with a deadbeat kid -ya know? Why would a deadbeat kid want to get a job and earn their keep if it's all handed to them? I'm not saying not to help them out-Hell I do the same thing, but I can't say that there isn't times I leave feeling shorted. As long as you keep yourself in mind when you bid the rate, you should be ok with sticking with that rate. If your friends don't understand that then let them do a few jobs without your help. When they are spending more time and money to complete the work, they will realize why you quote what you do.
 
96coal449 said:
A good days pay takes care of the bills and puts food on the table .... better than nothing. But, it doesn't service the chipper and truck or pay for break downs. The lower figure you charge kinda locks you in that pay scale. A higher rate will give you the option of a new truck payment if you want or need one. I hear what your saying about the cut throat competition. If you have insurance that should put you above their rates regardless.
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Should. Thats the key word. But for some odd reason alot people in this area just don't care. As long as it's cheaper. Strangely enough too, we have competitors in the area that are insured just as we are, do good work with good technique and up to standard, and are still somehow bidding and getting jobs for far lower bids than some of us. Tis an odd area.
 
AW4130 said:
Should. Thats the key word. But for some odd reason alot people in this area just don't care. As long as it's cheaper. Strangely enough too, we have competitors in the area that are insured just as we are, do good work with good technique and up to standard, and are still somehow bidding and getting jobs for far lower bids than some of us. Tis an odd area.
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Sometimes that's just a combination of an unskilled salesman and deep pockets. If you're in the black, don't worry about their prices. If you're not, I'd talk to their production staff on the low, because it could just be a matter of time until they implode.

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AW4130 said:
Should. Thats the key word. But for some odd reason alot people in this area just don't care. As long as it's cheaper. Strangely enough too, we have competitors in the area that are insured just as we are, do good work with good technique and up to standard, and are still somehow bidding and getting jobs for far lower bids than some of us. Tis an odd area.
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It's the same in this area. I see it this way. I'd rather do two jobs at my price than three or four at a lower charge. I don't feel rushed and I have more time to take care of other things.
 
Let me ask you this @Levi.CO and @LimbLoppa, how do you guys personally go about actually being friends with people, doing business with them, and keeping it all separate? This topic interests me very much. (Sorry to derail the thread.) I just personally have a very difficult time working with... Actually anyone... that I don't like on a personal level. If I can't call you a friend and have a feeling of actual human connection and common ground, typically, I don't want anything to do with you. Does that make sense at all? So the business and friendship thing I feel like I have trouble with. Be awesome to get some more thoughts for me to consider from you guys maybe. If you guys are willing to share insight that is. :)
 
You can have friends in business. Just keep the business separate. It is cool though to help out a friend in business to an extent.
 
It's impossible to keep it totally separate, I mean there's a few people who are"acquaintances" that I know -and can be civil with, but I just won't do business with them. This is due to past conduct or run ins we've had. If you are in business, are you in the business of sharing the fruits of your labor, or furthering your business toward success? There are times when you cut certain people a better deal because of the end benefit to you. IE, someone who gives you jobs often or someone who works on equipment you have etc. You can't give everyone the same rate, however you do have to have a minimum rate acceptable to you -any good businessman knows that -friend or not. I also can't work with people I don't trust/like. Has it cost me work ? Yes Do I care? No That's a loss I'm willing to take. If you connect yourself to a job with people that don't have the same mindset as you and they f*ck up, then you f*cked up too. I'm not telling you not to work with friends -everyone I work with is a friend. I'm just saying -Don't put your friend's well-being before yours.
 
I agree Loppa. Most are acquaintances like you said. There is a fine line in this area of business and friends, but I do have a couple of close friends in business that I help out from time to time, and usually at a profit loss. But they return the favor down the road. These are true friends.
 
96coal449 said:
I agree Loppa. Most are acquaintances like you said. But I do have a couple of close friends in business that I help out from time to time, and usually at a profit loss. But they return the favor down the road. These are true friends.
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Exactly - those are true friends. I have a few of those-Hell there's even a few that I'll help for free just because I enjoy their company. That's why I said it's impossible to keep it totally separate, but you gotta be able to tell the difference between acquaintances and TRUE FRIENDS!
 
LimbLoppa said:
Exactly - those are true friends. I have a few of those-Hell there's even a few that I'll help for free just because I enjoy their company. That's why I said it's impossible to keep it totally separate, but you gotta be able to tell the difference between acquaintances and TRUE FRIENDS!
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Amen!
 
AW4130 said:
Let me ask you this @Levi.CO and @LimbLoppa, how do you guys personally go about actually being friends with people, doing business with them, and keeping it all separate? This topic interests me very much. (Sorry to derail the thread.) I just personally have a very difficult time working with... Actually anyone... that I don't like on a personal level. If I can't call you a friend and have a feeling of actual human connection and common ground, typically, I don't want anything to do with you. Does that make sense at all? So the business and friendship thing I feel like I have trouble with. Be awesome to get some more thoughts for me to consider from you guys maybe. If you guys are willing to share insight that is. :)
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It's simple, really, for me. Treat everyone with respect and ask for the same. I recently had a pretty good climber offer to sub for $200 a day, if I took his offer that would not have been very friendly of me...
 
Thanks you guys. Really appreciate that input because I tend to desire to be too nice/be known as a likable person. It's mainly due to the fact that I don't like assholes. But I see that is also a weakness when it comes to business.
 
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