Tried DSRT yesterday. I'm a fan.

[TimBr]

@oceans; There's a lot going on in that video, so I'll need to watch it a few times, probably, to pick up on some of it. I have a few "new guy" questions for you.

First, what is the name of the rope you are using in the video? Also, is it your favorite for use with the Compact Bulldog Bone, or is there some other rope that has that place of honor?

Lastly, as I said I'll need to watch the video again, but it seemed like you edited out the parts that show how you manage to recover your rope when you make a long toss for a redirect. Leaving that part in is something I would find very instructive. It is a skill I still need to work on.

Thanks for posting the video, and for your explanations of your setup and technique.

Tim

 

[oceans]

@oceans; There's a lot going on in that video, so I'll need to watch it a few times, probably, to pick up on some of it. I have a few "new guy" questions for you.

First, what is the name of the rope you are using in the video? Also, is it your favorite for use with the Compact Bulldog Bone, or is there some other rope that has that place of honor?

Lastly, as I said I'll need to watch the video again, but it seemed like you edited out the parts that show how you manage to recover your rope when you make a long toss for a redirect. Leaving that part in is something I would find very instructive. It is a skill I still need to work on.

Thanks for posting the video, and for your explanations of your setup and technique.

Tim

Tim, I was using a Hank of Tachyon and a Hank of 11mm KMIII. My fave in the Bone is Tachyon, but the KMIII is very not bad with the 3/4" Bollard.

At 2:18, I throw the entire fall of the KMIII through a high union in an adjacent stem. I then pass a second redirect and descend on both Bones, to a point where I can swing over to the second stem and lanyard in. At 3:08, I've retrieved the fall of KMIII, removed it from the Bone, pulled it taught, and reinstalled it in the Bone. I basically repeated this again before coming down to prune out the limb over the roof.

By using the KMIII sort of as a lead line, and leaving the Tachyon out of those redirects, when I finished with the limb, I was already tied into both stems to go back and install the cable.

Looking back, it wasn't the most efficient climb I've ever done, but I was learning and sharing at the same time. The main goal of mine at that time was to be tied in twice throughout the entire climb, whether moving or positioned for work. I was able to achieve that goal without adding any significant time to the climb. In fact, what I edited out most was all the hand saw cuts I made without a lanyard...because I was tied into two systems.

 

[flying french man]

Tim, I was using a Hank of Tachyon and a Hank of 11mm KMIII. My fave in the Bone is Tachyon, but the KMIII is very not bad with the 3/4" Bollard.

At 2:18, I throw the entire fall of the KMIII through a high union in an adjacent stem. I then pass a second redirect and descend on both Bones, to a point where I can swing over to the second stem and lanyard in. At 3:08, I've retrieved the fall of KMIII, removed it from the Bone, pulled it taught, and reinstalled it in the Bone. I basically repeated this again before coming down to prune out the limb over the roof.

By using the KMIII sort of as a lead line, and leaving the Tachyon out of those redirects, when I finished with the limb, I was already tied into both stems to go back and install the cable.

Looking back, it wasn't the most efficient climb I've ever done, but I was learning and sharing at the same time. The main goal of mine at that time was to be tied in twice throughout the entire climb, whether moving or positioned for work. I was able to achieve that goal without adding any significant time to the climb. In fact, what I edited out most was all the hand saw cuts I made without a lanyard...because I was tied into two systems.

I have look that this video and the one you have made with the snow covered tree numerous times. Trying to figure out the structure of the tree and the way you had plan your work , trying to understand the benefits etc... At that time I was also moving from Ddrt to SRT so I did'nt understand everything , but it shure help me progress in my climbing. So the question is...!!when is your next video with all your new tricks and knowledges + the added experience you had on DSRT during that last year?? Hahaha . But for real I would be curious to see how you set-up those news things on your harness and the way you use it. For me DSRT is something I use time to time when the scenario need it, so I'm not super efficient at it but I would like to progress in that way of climbing.

 

[moss]

My fave in the Bone is Tachyon, but the KMIII is very not bad with the 3/4" Bollard.

Oceans, I have a Bone to pick with you, whenever you use the phrase "very not bad", you really need to put a "TM" mark after it, that's a registered trademark bro! I'm intending to expand the use of that tag line for a "Very Not Bad™" product line, stuff like "Tree Climber's Pocket Jello™" (power snack), "OldRopeRestoringSalve™" etc., appreciate your cooperation!
-AJ

 

[TimBr]

@moss, I think @surveyor might have a "Bone" to pick with you for using the word "Bone" without the registered trademark symbol. Hey, just how did you manage to insert that symbol into your post, anyway? You may be about to teach me something here.

Its not on my keyboard, so I'm wondering if you had to write your post in a word processing program and then paste it into the posting box?

Thanks. Just kidding about the "Bone" trademark, by the way.

Tim

 

[moss]

Its not on my keyboard, so I'm wondering if you had to write your post in a word processing program and then paste it into the posting box?
Tim

On Windows OS hold down the ALT key and type 0153, when you release the ALT key the TM will be inserted into your text. Not sure on a Mac

 

[CanadianStan]

@moss, I think @surveyor might have a "Bone" to pick with you for using the word "Bone" without the registered trademark symbol. Hey, just how did you manage to insert that symbol into your post, anyway? You may be about to teach me something here.

Its not on my keyboard, so I'm wondering if you had to write your post in a word processing program and then paste it into the posting box?

Thanks. Just kidding about the "Bone" trademark, by the way.

Tim

You can definitely copy+paste the character from Google, or if you're on a Windows computer, press Alt + 0153 (Pressing each number separately on your numpad while holding down Alt).

WrittenUsingAltCode™

 

[oceans]

I have look that this video and the one you have made with the snow covered tree numerous times. Trying to figure out the structure of the tree and the way you had plan your work , trying to understand the benefits etc... At that time I was also moving from Ddrt to SRT so I did'nt understand everything , but it shure help me progress in my climbing. So the question is...!!when is your next video with all your new tricks and knowledges + the added experience you had on DSRT during that last year?? Hahaha . But for real I would be curious to see how you set-up those news things on your harness and the way you use it. For me DSRT is something I use time to time when the scenario need it, so I'm not super efficient at it but I would like to progress in that way of climbing.

I think DSRT takes considerable attention to dial in for efficiency. There may also be financial input to acquire the gear. As I've said before, there were some "happy accidents" or coincidence that got my own personal kit to feel seamless. This whole process may be a limiting factor for other climbers, but I honestly feel it can be worth the push.

I will see what I can do in regard to a video of my most current DSRT system in use. It's been quite some time since I've had a decent place to set up my laptop, nevermind managing the camera and batteries and memory cards. That's a whole system in itself that works best when used often. I need to get the cobwebs off it all. Thanks for the gentle push there, FFM!

 

[the.schultz.effect]

Thanks Oceans. When I watched your DSRT video

I saw you toss the bone on redirects. So I assumed you still did it that way and I could not figure the extra benefit of the delta versus the cost (slowness) of taking it on/off/on the delta with the Oceans-Toss-Bone-Method. Thanks for the help and I will no longer practice the OTBM going forward .

love your video Oceans! totally was one of the things that helped introduce me to DSRT. was even one of the inspiration for my lil go at it. what i tended to think was that the technique was easiest/ useful to use in a big broad tree that had relatively close branches where you could reach the crotch that you wanted to place your system through. as opposed to a leggy spread tree where the desired redirect point is far. this could also be a RR vs BDB thing cuz w/ the later you pop the rope out easier and throw it anywhere. another thing to note was how challenging it could be at high rope angles to work two systems coming from different angles and over come the drag, the RR was better than the RW in this situation cuz you can completely compress them. also you must have a masters in rope managment very cool technique but def has a time a place.

 

[TimBr]

@Pfanner man; Great video, Lawrence! I love the "God's eye view" that you employ so often in your videos, which shows the big picture of how you move through the tree. I know that it takes a lot of extra time to constantly have to set the camera up and take it back down for each new section of the tree you want to work on. At least, it would if I was the one doing it. You are so fluid in the tree, maybe the extra time it takes you is insignificant, in your mind.

I guess I'm just trying to say "nice job" and "I appreciate your efforts."

Having said all of that, I was wondering if you would mind posting a link here to your new video series. I could probably find it elsewhere, but I figure the more places the link exists, the easier it will be for all of your potential customers to find it.

I fully intend to order and pay for your video series, and I hope that you are receiving enough customers for your new series to encourage you to continue making new ones.

Thanks again, for all of your obvious time and effort.

One quick question. What is the name of the retrievable redirect technique you are using in this video? Is this yoyoman's "on-bight redirect", or something different? Thanks for your time.

Tim

 

[moss]

Great stuff, love the video. The releasable redirect looks like a a chained slip knot variation, releasable by the tail. Bringing the wrench or runner (not sure) back though the various redirects at the end is classic, that moment of, "I hope it doesn't hang up". Makes me want to run outside and climb ;-)
-AJ

 

[oceans]

Thanks so much, @Pfanner man! Glad the video was a little kicker. I have always appreciated your work as well. Awesome to watch!

I guess the Bone lends itself so well for some of the reasons you stated. In a leggy tree, I like that I can set a predirect, go fetch it and load into it without unloading the other system. Sometimes it makes for a down and out before coming back up...so different from normal SRT out and down. I think a lot comes down to how useful a redirect will be and how challenging it will be to load it.

There is definitely a quickness to carabiner removal vs. unloading/loading the Bone. I prefer the former, but just got really accustomed to the latter.

I do have a means of joining a few lines together, like the Triple Threat, and that definitely comes in handy. Awesome video there too! I like to create mine so the lines are removable from the ring for really quick advancement in some cases. I use a delta link for that.

 

[the.schultz.effect]

@Pfanner man; Great video, Lawrence! I love the "God's eye view" that you employ so often in your videos, which shows the big picture of how you move through the tree. I know that it takes a lot of extra time to constantly have to set the camera up and take it back down for each new section of the tree you want to work on. At least, it would if I was the one doing it. You are so fluid in the tree, maybe the extra time it takes you is insignificant, in your mind.

I guess I'm just trying to say "nice job" and "I appreciate your efforts."

Having said all of that, I was wondering if you would mind posting a link here to your new video series. I could probably find it elsewhere, but I figure the more places the link exists, the easier it will be for all of your potential customers to find it.

I fully intend to order and pay for your video series, and I hope that you are receiving enough customers for your new series to encourage you to continue making new ones.

Thanks again, for all of your obvious time and effort.

One quick question. What is the name of the retrievable redirect technique you are using in this video? Is this yoyoman's "on-bight redirect", or something different? Thanks for your time.

Tim

theschultzeffect.com i wish i would have had more resources and time to make the vid series cuz it would have been awesome to get some of the great innovators like Oceans involved.

the retrievable redirect in called the Minty Rose, it's in my vid series. It's Ben Minty Rose's of the UK, learned it second hand from Paul Poynter. caution as their are some subtleties to it i experienced first hand

 

[SoftBankHawks]

What a great thread, I've not been reading the buzz for a while. And welcome Pfanner man, very nice to see you here, by the way, just in case you didn't know, Ben took the retrievable 'Minty' from Ashley's renowned book of knots.

If anybody fancies a trip this November Oceans and I will run (possibly the world's first) TRT workshop in Matsumoto, Japan. A little far but it's gonna be ace !

 

[the.schultz.effect]

What a great thread, I've not been reading the buzz for a while. And welcome Pfanner man, very nice to see you here, by the way, just in case you didn't know, Ben took the retrievable 'Minty' from Ashley's renowned book of knots.

If anybody fancies a trip this November Oceans and I will run (possibly the world's first) TRT workshop in Matsumoto, Japan. A little far but it's gonna be ace !

really? i've been doing a bit of experimenting with that lately looking at a different way to set it up and a different way to work it

 

[oceans]

really? i've been doing a bit of experimenting with that lately looking at a different way to set it up and a different way to work it

Haha! An inverted OT. That's great! How's the drag on that system with 2 Wrenches?

 

[SoftBankHawks]

There is real beauty in flipping things over, I'm convinced that the symmetry in Eric's DSRT system has a deeper resonance than function and this of course leads into asymmetrical ideas, 2 systems become 1 system become 1 and half systems and reverting, the constant change through desire of movement. But playing so much with systems I am drawn back to the lightweight 8mm in TRT....and that it is effectively a loop that can be turned upside down lends itself to many rigging puzzles.
I can only see a reason for such large TRT rope (11mm) if you want to kill many birds with one stone, ie hit SRT, DSRT and TRT all in one go but for me that loses something of the freedom that 8mm TRT gives.

 

[oceans]

There is real beauty in flipping things over, I'm convinced that the symmetry in Eric's DSRT system has a deeper resonance than function and this of course leads into asymmetrical ideas, 2 systems become 1 system become 1 and half systems and reverting, the constant change through desire of movement. But playing so much with systems I am drawn back to the lightweight 8mm in TRT....and that it is effectively a loop that can be turned upside down lends itself to many rigging puzzles.
I can only see a reason for such large TRT rope (11mm) if you want to kill many birds with one stone, ie hit SRT, DSRT and TRT all in one go but for me that loses something of the freedom that 8mm TRT gives.

I'll agree with about all that. Funny that I find the 8mm line so light, but more fussy to manage than 11mm. Makes me wonder if a 10mm system could be constructed with appropriate mechanical hitches that work SRT or "Shared" SRT. Whoop!

 

[flying french man]

Some of you are running two rope in one device using 8mm rope or so. My question is...wich rope are you using. If I'm not mistaking it's the same approach has twin rope for ice climbing or general mountaineering . I was looking at mammut , petzl, or edelrid rope in the 7.7 to 8.7 diameter at the store today but the static elongation ( at 80kg) is around 6.8 % wich is not fantastic for treework. Do I miss something ? Or you get along with this type of rope? Thanks

 

[SoftBankHawks]

I'll agree with about all that. Funny that I find the 8mm line so light, but more fussy to manage than 11mm. Makes me wonder if a 10mm system could be constructed with appropriate mechanical hitches that work SRT or "Shared" SRT. Whoop!

Hmmm, yeah, it's difficult to decide which way to focus on it, I certainly felt that way and asked Kevin what the chances were to get a 20mm rope runner made up, still waiting a year later so I ran out of breath. I'm more interested in using the highline of TRT and using pendulum climbing ala DdRT rather than dedicated DSRT, I've done a full circle since Oceans last came over.

My rope is Sirius 500, a marine rope made by Teufelberger and static as all hell.

I'm writing this at lunch time, we have a job in Morioka, you remember the big tsunami 5 years back, well a portion of the hillside slid onto the train tracks and we are removing big Sweet Chestnut trees, the thing is though there are lots and lots of targets that are taking data about the integrity of the slope so it has been a riggers dream/nightmare job. Anyway, just this morning I used the TRT highline to great effect on a really long dead branch that was right over a sensor. The rigging rope redirect setting was easy enough, bang on the COG but I couldnt weight the branch and a re-direct would have put me in the wrong place for cutting. DSRT would have worked too but I only needed it for 1 cut on a day long tree.