Training a new climber

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Tmannsclimber

Just curious about what you expect out of a new climber? Such as a timetable about what skills they should know and how fast you would introduce technical rigging and takedowns. I ask because I have been working in treework for a little over a year and I do most of my climbing during oak season "deadwooding season". I started out using VT system and dont really understand why it is not recomended for new climbers? I know how to use redirects and use a pully type friction saver. I assend using mybar system rigged to the friction saver. I try to be as safe as possible watch out for ground crew when there is multiple climbers. I'm told in a round about way that I'm not fast enough. The closest climber I have to compare myself to has been climbing for over 15 years. Just trying to get an idea about what yall expect out of new climbers.
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Just get up there and do the job in a timely manner and don't frig nothing up.

Easy peasy japanesy!
 
I was told this after I had to accend up one tree lower alittle and swing over to a heavy leaner over a very nice house. I still had a bad tie in point that gave me a low rope angle to work with. This made the long limb walks more difficult. Also I had to lower down remove two 8" dead limbs and get them roped down before I could remove a large dead limb that was above them to save the nice house from getting a new roof.
 
don't sweat it too much, take your time, just move steadily and with confidence and you're stoked, it takes time, and you shouldn't even begin to compare yourself with a climber that has 15 years experience.

jp
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I'm a new climber, on trees anyway, and I know I'm slow. I've had the same sort of problems, fouling the rope and making a limb walk harder, spending too much time climbing, not enough sawing. One problem though is that I just like climbing too much so I tend to go after every little dead twig if nobody's watching... it's fun so I do it as much as I can. Hard to make money that way though.

I think efficiency is what separates the the climbers with lots of experience... not just speed, but knowing how to visualize and solve problems. There is no substitute for experience.

With that said, the fact that you can work safely in the tree and get the job done still makes you valuable... people aren't exactly lining up for tree worker jobs. When people say you're slow, consider the source... are they working climbers or armchair quarterbacks? Every tree is different and things look easier from the ground than they do 70' up after an hour or two of climbing, balancing, and sawing.
 
I think speed is a concept and word which is misused. I've not been climbing for years but have observed quite alot of people moving about in trees and it appears to me that the best climbers are those who are smooth, graceful and plan their climb.

Speed usually translates into flayling around clattering into limbs with a distinct lack of calculation, co-ordination and style.

I'm fortunate in that I have had the opportunity to work with some very good, naturally gifted climbers which gave me the chance to observe the intracacies of their movement in the tree.

From watching these guys and seeing some comp climbers i'd say, don't try to be fast, aim to be fluid, graceful and plan your climb - efficiency and speed will be by-products.
 
constuctive criticism is one thing but when someone on the ground is hounding you to go faster is another. go the "speed" that you feel safe. If you're rushed that could lead to mistakes. planning your work and working your plan(alot of you know this) can really increase your efficiency for the task at hand. Remember,it always looks easier from the ground. Utilizing the tree for rigging scenarios i.e. getting the most out of each rigging set up can increase efficiency. And one of the most important factors in appearing "fast" in a tree to me is the skill level of the man or woman on the ground.
 
Take your time do your thing get it right speed comes with experience nothing else...ive seen climbers who think they are the sh1t come a croper very quickly through rushing with out thinking logical.....15 years is a lot of experience on situations,and different types of trees and there caracteristics,using vt and pulleys is nothing on that
 
I look at the tree from the ground and try to set up a game plan as to were to start from and so on. This way I'm not fighting my with climbing line. Since I dont climb alot over the summer I was just trying to get an idea as to how fast you like to see your climbers progress. I ask my boss if I'm doing alright and I get a " I guess so, I haven't trained many climbers. I'm not a very good trainer". He is a great climber ( speed, fluid, rigging, balance). So I guess thats why he cant give me a good reply. I know that you cant put a time on trees because they are all different. Just want to know a general idea of progression and experience.
 
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I think speed is a concept and word which is misused. I've not been climbing for years but have observed quite alot of people moving about in trees and it appears to me that the best climbers are those who are smooth, graceful and plan their climb.


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you hit the nail on the head.
 
It all depends on the person. I had guys that I somewhat trained for a year. And they just didnt get it....or more likely didnt care. This past year I started with a young guy that had no climbing esperience (other then boy hood stuff). By the end of the year I felt comfortable enough to send him up just about any tree. If it was a +100 E. white pine removal, oak removal, or thinning out a Norway maple tree he was capable of doing it(unless it was a major job). Was he as "fast" as me? No, I been climbing for 8 years and wouldn't expect him to be.

I agree with all the others, it not speed. It is being effiecent that makes the tree go quicker. It is accurately planning your route and tie in spot. Making the most of ever postion and movement. It is know that it will be easier to get that limb from there...so skip it now. It is knowing how to use your equipment to it full advantage. And doing all the above,plus more, with just a glance while working the tree. Unless it is complex, you wont see a experience climber sit back and figure things out...they just know and do it. And if they are figuring it out, it is while a piece is being lowered etc.

It all takes time. The more you climb and think and experience, the more efficent you will become. Climb as many of the trees you can. When your not climbing study how he does it. And then apply it next time you do. When I firtst got out of forestry school, I was like yeah I climb fast. LOL boy was I sooo wrong.

I am fortunate to have a few time and material customers that I let my newbies learn on.
 
Meet your challenges head on Tmannsclimber, they get a little easier each time that way. Dont become too self concious, the first couple of years are usually the most frustrating and at the same time, rewarding of all. Your boss, or whoever else thats implied your not up to speed, is probably just trying to keep you on your toes, so don't worry too much, we've all been there. Remember not to neglect the ground work, just as important. Best of luck and don't get disheartened.
 
Just try and remember your first year driving a car..You had to think about everything. Experience made everything happen. Be safe and youll have the 15 years in and remember the good and bad points of your trainers. This will make you a better trainer when it is your turn. Make sure to enjoy the view once in a while!
 
I am a new climber with just one year doing it accasionally. My biggest concern is always "safety first". Next is the safety of those bellow ( since they're somewhat responsible for their own). Last, and least is the soundness of the objects bellow. Once all is covered comes speed. More or less it is natural. Although I still get nervous up there and not very high. The good thing is that there's no one to rush me. I set the pace at my comfort. I hope this helps.
 
All you really have to do is your job. If you are uneasy up there take your time figure it out and move on. Remember all of the lil mistakes you do and corect them. Speed is for emergencies and compititions. A fast worker is good , but the only way you get fast is to train. Try new systems at the great LOW AND SLOW til you have them down. I always take a breather from the tree and figure from the ground the best way up and the easiest way to do it this to makes you faster. Just think in 15 years of climbing you will be in the same boat training new guys just remember what you learn and do not preasure them.
Learn from your exspierences.
 
Every climber will progress differently. If your in it to learn the trade you'll move more quickly. If it's just a paycheck and something extra curricular the process may be much slower and you may be seeking new employment.

I have trained many climbers and seen many of them come and go and that same question has been asked to me many times. How long does it take to be good. My answer is the same all the time. How long do you want it to take? Are you willing to practice on your off time? will you climb when others are hem hawwing around because they dont feel like climbing that day? Are you willing to pay for some extra seminars to learn what your employer may not teach you ? do the nasty jobs that others wont do.There are many other factors, but be aggressive , safe and minfull of others feelings in this process.
It's ok to be anal retentive about prunning, but there is a time and place for it and sometimes you loose site of what you really set out to do.

What these fellas have said above is a good basis to learn from. Sometimes thinking two to three moves ahead and executing in a smooth orderly fasion, is much faster than a speed demon. Tree work is like a chess game.Each move is to lead into the next.When you figure this out, ( if you havnt already) you'll be amazed at your increase in speed.

Greg
 
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It's just a tree.

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I prefer to think of it as a giant ball of potential energy that could kill you if you don't handle it properly.

Speed comes after a lot of practice. Mastering a lot of smaller skills adds up to proficiency at complex tasks. Its all about technique. Its like a friend said about banjo picking, "You've got to be good before you get to be fast."

Take your time and pay attention to that 15yr veteran. He survived this long.
 
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