Richard Mumford-yoyoman
Been here a while
- Location
- Atlanta GA
Especially in the first use example of this video, I see a real danger in demonstrating a single tie off with heavy metal attached to a shock absorbing line.
Toggle Knot Development - Thoughts?
- Thread starter bonner1040
- Start date
Richard Mumford-yoyoman
Been here a while
- Location
- Atlanta GA
Well you know how I feel about a less expensive, better performing option.
I dunno, Richard...if the mousetrap TreeStuff invents efficiently kills mice, but also frequently and without warning whacks your fingers, is it really a better mousetrap? I think core values play a larger role in who I spend my tree equipment $$$ with, than trade-offs such as price, weight, eye appeal, etc.
Richard Mumford-yoyoman
Been here a while
- Location
- Atlanta GA
Well, I only really know my own core values, but back to the questions of this post.
So the Crosby hardware runs about $70 to get about a 4000 pound working load limit. The rigging line can be spliced or tied on to the hardware, without worries of passing the knot through the ring, it has a super reliable connection, it comes in numerous sizes with a working load limit up to 20,000 pounds, any choice of rigging line can be attached in the field.
So here we go, are we looking for a better mousetrap or a better bottom line.
Is that mousetrap a winner? Will it win over the hearts and minds of the masses? (barring extrinsic factors like a competitor's attorneys sending threatening letters to suppliers). Time will tell. I liked the video though.
I am continually on the lookout for products / methodology which will make my job easier and more efficient, but am becoming more jaded and less gullible of late. Gotta get beyond the hype and the visions of rainbows and unicorns; my fingers are leery of getting whacked.
I am continually on the lookout for products / methodology which will make my job easier and more efficient, but am becoming more jaded and less gullible of late. Gotta get beyond the hype and the visions of rainbows and unicorns; my fingers are leery of getting whacked.
Richard Mumford-yoyoman
Been here a while
- Location
- Atlanta GA
Love innovation, period.
Richard Mumford-yoyoman
Been here a while
- Location
- Atlanta GA
Keep it up Carson and crew, just remember who you do it for.
Richard Mumford-yoyoman
Been here a while
- Location
- Atlanta GA
How is it limited in its rope applications? And the toggle will be more secure than just a shackle and a hook?
What kind of price reduction can we expect for this new device?
NorCalBrock
Branched out member
- Location
- Chico
Z'sTrees
Branched out member
- Location
- Hartsel CO
One thing the crosby setup cannot do is pass thru a rigging thimble. For me and the way I do things this is an advantage. May not be everyones cup of tea.
If you want to be able to use the rigging line without it, tie it on or use the other end. Spliced end wears out? Resplice it.
Splice rigging lines have been around for at least a little while...
If you want to be able to use the rigging line without it, tie it on or use the other end. Spliced end wears out? Resplice it.
Splice rigging lines have been around for at least a little while...
Daniel
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Suburban Philadelphia (Wayne)
The same could be said for the crosby. I was thin ign a way to fix that would be to have a keeper knot like a prussic on the rope behind the ring to cinch it up and make sure it can't move when unloaded
Richard Mumford-yoyoman
Been here a while
- Location
- Atlanta GA
Crosby has a special T protrusion that makes unintended removal unlikely but even possible remotely as described in this video.
Is it possible the ring may come off on the return from the ground? Just curious. I would love to try this. I currently use a 50KN fixed eye snap. I can tie knots quite quickly but, the snap speeds the ground end.
If you'd offer me the opportunity I'll give this a fair shake. I'll even splice it on the rope, so all I need are those metal parts!
- Location
- portland
This is the reincarnation of old tech. Its been done and there are easier ways to do it. We barrow tech from sailing all the time and this is right up that alley. A modified "T" shaped device attached to a rigging prussic would be adjustable, solve the concern of cutting the rope, be midline attachable, would keep the climber from being concerned about having that stupid ring run down the rope to the ground, it would work with rigging rings and could be used with a bowline or spliced eye. I probably sound like a smart ass but its not my idea, several sailing companies have already solved this problem. Harken being among them
My apologies but, what are you referring to as a rope receiver? What would it look like? Field testing would be a great idea, regular guys trying these pieces would be. Maybe Nick Bonner will chose a couple average arborists for this! 
bonner1040
Branched out member
- Location
- Boston
They are currently in field testing!
Hi BigKid, I mean the toggle should go into a rope loop rather than a metal ring.
Above the toggle is on the Prusik to allow tightening on the branch. I also added a ring on the rope loop to slide and cinch the toggle in the loop.
I'm going to use the above for small self rigging to test it out. The toggle is made out of hickory and is based (copied) from the Tylaska dog bones, a toggle they make in aluminum and stainless steel.
I think that this type of configuration would also work good on the end of a winch line.
Above the toggle is on the Prusik to allow tightening on the branch. I also added a ring on the rope loop to slide and cinch the toggle in the loop.
I'm going to use the above for small self rigging to test it out. The toggle is made out of hickory and is based (copied) from the Tylaska dog bones, a toggle they make in aluminum and stainless steel.
I think that this type of configuration would also work good on the end of a winch line.
NE Tree
Branched out member
- Location
- fremont, Ne
The toggle in the spliced eye is a great idea. What if instead of being on a prussic, the toggle was spliced to an xrr to allow it to move on the rope and cinch down?
Edit- then again,that kinda puts us back at square one eh?
Ive been working occasionally on questions like this, not quite ready to present my own findings. I would say that either adding additinal protective coating to the last five feet of the rope or adding a chafe sleeve would be a nice way to enhance the value of this system as it stands.
As guys are saying, there a lot of solutions from the sailing world, such as the soft shackle principle in the sling above.
I think it would also be good to improve the bend ratio to 3 or 4:1, as I understand it, you lose over 40% of rope strength in the bend at the ring or a half hitch. Its just an area of very concentrated wear and fatigue for the rope.
How is this an improvement on using a good steel carabiner with an ANSI rated gate, in a spliced eye?
I think something modular might be nice so you can potentially start the re-rig process before the line is returned. But thin it would have to be an improvement over the CMI webbing slings, especially when passed through chafe sleeve to improve wear and equalizing.
As guys are saying, there a lot of solutions from the sailing world, such as the soft shackle principle in the sling above.
I think it would also be good to improve the bend ratio to 3 or 4:1, as I understand it, you lose over 40% of rope strength in the bend at the ring or a half hitch. Its just an area of very concentrated wear and fatigue for the rope.
How is this an improvement on using a good steel carabiner with an ANSI rated gate, in a spliced eye?
I think something modular might be nice so you can potentially start the re-rig process before the line is returned. But thin it would have to be an improvement over the CMI webbing slings, especially when passed through chafe sleeve to improve wear and equalizing.
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