Splicing
- Thread starter PurdueJoe
- Start date
NickfromWI
Participating member
- Location
- Los Angeles, CA
VT, Beeline, and HRC are spliced the same. Core dependant splices.
So far, the manufacturers directions for Poison Ivy and Blaze are the same as their industrial double braid splice (like you'd use on Double Esterlon). You can get those directions at http://www.yalecordage.com/html/pdf/yale_indust_dbraid.pdf
Let us know how it goes, we'll get you on your way.
love
nick
So far, the manufacturers directions for Poison Ivy and Blaze are the same as their industrial double braid splice (like you'd use on Double Esterlon). You can get those directions at http://www.yalecordage.com/html/pdf/yale_indust_dbraid.pdf
Let us know how it goes, we'll get you on your way.
love
nick
Hi Nick,
I was a little nervous, I had bought some beeline (5/16") on a recommendation and after a few emails to yale with only one half hearted response I decided to splice the line using a conventional dbl braid industrial splice. Before everyone gets concerned that I've signed my own death warrant and I will surely plummet to my demise, I have to tell you that my original thinking was I wanted the cover on the eye and the splice would be strong enough, technora (75% of the cover) is tough stuff too. After finding a post from Nick back in April I started to question my reasoning.
...So I got out the 8N, threw a log chain around a large tree and tethered an eye and eye botched spliced beeline between the two with a 23kN DMM biner in line as a "gauge". Well my doubts about the poor splice were unfounded, much less the splicing technique. With the 5k+ lbs. force it would have taken to break the biner the splice would have had to maintain over 60% of beelines tensile, I'm assuming more. The other part to this "test" is the force was somewhat of a bouncing force, with the traction varying and my clutch control not the greatest. I think ropes probably respond to an initial shock load better than aluminum, how ever worthless the line might be afterwards, how that correlates to how much better I feel about the splice now I don't know.
The other thing that was kind of interesting was that there was what seemed to be little spots of wax between the strands of the outer cover of the eye afterwards, they must wax the strands and the force before breaking squeezed it out. It might be a good indication of the beeline being over stressed if one was ever in doubt.
In short I'm not recommending that people start disregarding the manufacturer's instructions and splice their line however they want, I just wanted to share what I thought was an interesting experience.
I was a little nervous, I had bought some beeline (5/16") on a recommendation and after a few emails to yale with only one half hearted response I decided to splice the line using a conventional dbl braid industrial splice. Before everyone gets concerned that I've signed my own death warrant and I will surely plummet to my demise, I have to tell you that my original thinking was I wanted the cover on the eye and the splice would be strong enough, technora (75% of the cover) is tough stuff too. After finding a post from Nick back in April I started to question my reasoning.
...So I got out the 8N, threw a log chain around a large tree and tethered an eye and eye botched spliced beeline between the two with a 23kN DMM biner in line as a "gauge". Well my doubts about the poor splice were unfounded, much less the splicing technique. With the 5k+ lbs. force it would have taken to break the biner the splice would have had to maintain over 60% of beelines tensile, I'm assuming more. The other part to this "test" is the force was somewhat of a bouncing force, with the traction varying and my clutch control not the greatest. I think ropes probably respond to an initial shock load better than aluminum, how ever worthless the line might be afterwards, how that correlates to how much better I feel about the splice now I don't know.
The other thing that was kind of interesting was that there was what seemed to be little spots of wax between the strands of the outer cover of the eye afterwards, they must wax the strands and the force before breaking squeezed it out. It might be a good indication of the beeline being over stressed if one was ever in doubt.
In short I'm not recommending that people start disregarding the manufacturer's instructions and splice their line however they want, I just wanted to share what I thought was an interesting experience.
- Location
- Nashville, TN
I have spliced Blaze.... and yes it does take a huge amount of force to bury..... i guess it's a good thing that i have these huge pythons attached to my shoulders /forum/images/graemlins/9lame.gif... no really, you need a good pair of gloves, and a lot of elbow grease. It can be done though..... i would say that you need to start with something easier.... stable braid would be a good choice to practice on
Good luck
Rob
Good luck
Rob
- Location
- Enid, Ok
Welcome to splicing!
Yes Clay, the blaze can be done by hand.
Many thanks to Nick who on his way back to California, stopped in for the weekend. We spliced 5 pieces of blaze, and a chunk of bee line.
On some of the blaze eyes, we were both on it getting it to settle in. A couple extra strands could be taken at the initial taper spot and that would help you a little. Make sure to lock stich whatever you do.
Yes Clay, the blaze can be done by hand.
Many thanks to Nick who on his way back to California, stopped in for the weekend. We spliced 5 pieces of blaze, and a chunk of bee line.
On some of the blaze eyes, we were both on it getting it to settle in. A couple extra strands could be taken at the initial taper spot and that would help you a little. Make sure to lock stich whatever you do.
NickfromWI
Participating member
- Location
- Los Angeles, CA
Clay, let's see some pictures! That's cool to hear!
Blaze can and should be done by hand. Yale buries their XTC lines by machine.
love
nick
Blaze can and should be done by hand. Yale buries their XTC lines by machine.
love
nick
NickfromWI
Participating member
- Location
- Los Angeles, CA
[ QUOTE ]
That brings up a whole other topic, to lockstich in the traditional sense or whiplock with yales instructions... I think the whiplock looks cool, and it's easy too.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, the whiplock looks cool. It's down fall is that it can fall off after being chafed away or swiped with a handsaw, or snagged on a chainsaw tooth. I prefer small stitches (like NICCS Method....pictures available when I get a better camera).
Some customers prefer I do both....whiplock to appease competition judges, and NICCS Method in case the whipping ever disappears.
love
nick
That brings up a whole other topic, to lockstich in the traditional sense or whiplock with yales instructions... I think the whiplock looks cool, and it's easy too.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, the whiplock looks cool. It's down fall is that it can fall off after being chafed away or swiped with a handsaw, or snagged on a chainsaw tooth. I prefer small stitches (like NICCS Method....pictures available when I get a better camera).
Some customers prefer I do both....whiplock to appease competition judges, and NICCS Method in case the whipping ever disappears.
love
nick
R
rich_h
Guest
One thing that I like about the whip lock is that it is very easy to see if it deforms, a sure sign that the piece has been put under way too much load and should probably be retired.
One thing I really dislike about the whip lock is that if done by Yales instructions you have the whipping passing completely through the cord on only 3 occasions. The lock stitch method definitely is much more secure in that it will pass completely through the cord many more times.
All in all it depends on what is being made and what the use it as to which method I will use.
One thing I really dislike about the whip lock is that if done by Yales instructions you have the whipping passing completely through the cord on only 3 occasions. The lock stitch method definitely is much more secure in that it will pass completely through the cord many more times.
All in all it depends on what is being made and what the use it as to which method I will use.
- Location
- NJ
I just would like to make a few things clear for myself. I just recieved the samson splicing kit last night and did one up. Looked great all I need to go is stitch it up. My main interest for learning is to splice up my poison ivy and fly line. Use the same directions to splice these two as well? Also is the 1/2" fid ok to use or should I look for a smaller one if they make one?
Also I am hoping to do a little splicing with Beeline and HRC. Nick I noticed you posted "Core dependant splices" to use on these type of ropes. Do you have a link for splicing instructions or should I just check some sites for the book? Thanks.
Also I am hoping to do a little splicing with Beeline and HRC. Nick I noticed you posted "Core dependant splices" to use on these type of ropes. Do you have a link for splicing instructions or should I just check some sites for the book? Thanks.
NickfromWI
Participating member
- Location
- Los Angeles, CA
Fly uses a very different splice. It's quite fun. See NERs site for the directions.
Is the kit you got from Samson for double braid ropes? You won't need the 1/2" fid. Use some wire or a coat hanger to make a pull fid. Check out the Toss Wand, while you're at it.
For core dependant splices, you have to look at Samson's Class II double braid splices. A locking brummell will serve you well when doing ultratech, beeline, or HRC for eye-eye hitch cords.
love
nick
Is the kit you got from Samson for double braid ropes? You won't need the 1/2" fid. Use some wire or a coat hanger to make a pull fid. Check out the Toss Wand, while you're at it.
For core dependant splices, you have to look at Samson's Class II double braid splices. A locking brummell will serve you well when doing ultratech, beeline, or HRC for eye-eye hitch cords.
love
nick
Being fairly new myself to splicing I use the coat hanger method, a couple things I found,attaching the hanger to a steel biner makes a nice handle. Also I use a 3/4" steel pipe into the side of a workbench it makes a nice spot to hook the biner onto to massage the bury/crossovers through, while pulling. Maybe not the best way but it works for me.
Good luck
Steve
Good luck
Steve
- Location
- Ontario, Canada
Do you double the coat hanger all the way back or just put a loop in the end?
How do you attach the core to the hanger, is it tight or loose through the loop?
How do you attach the core to the hanger, is it tight or loose through the loop?
- Location
- Nashville, TN
Double it up and use the connected end to pull the Core/cover through
- Location
- Ontario, Canada
Roger that! thanks.
Ok, the pics
This is the broken carabiner. I am assuming the tip at the top of the mouth broke first, I don't know for sure, I wasn't about to watch it. After seeing that I wondering if that wasn't designed to be a weak point, if that breaks the ropes could still hold the carabiner and it could still support weight... right? say like after a shock load.
This is the broken carabiner. I am assuming the tip at the top of the mouth broke first, I don't know for sure, I wasn't about to watch it. After seeing that I wondering if that wasn't designed to be a weak point, if that breaks the ropes could still hold the carabiner and it could still support weight... right? say like after a shock load.
Attachments
you can't really tell, I rubbed off a lot of the bigger spots to see what the stuff felt like... waxy. The waxy dots seemed to be squeezed out mostly at the intersection of the strands. It was more noticable around the polyester strands, maybe just because they were black.
Attachments
Nick you're right, I had the XTC line mixed up with blaze, XTC was the one I was thinking of "1500 pounds... needed to burry"
http://www.yalecordage.com/html/pdf/fire.pdf
http://www.yalecordage.com/html/pdf/fire.pdf
New threads New posts
-
test
-
-
-
-
Free CEUs: February 05 & March 05 - 'Urban Forestry Today' Webcasts @ Noon (Eastern)- Started by UFT
- Replies: 0
-
-
