Today me and my three coworkers were removing a large Honey Locust from a small backyard. Two of us showed up first, I set my line and placed the other climber's line as well once I climbed up to my TIP. The other two arrived a couple hours later and one started rigging down pieces from both of us while the other dragged brush and chipped. At 2pm, the rigging guy had to leave for a class, so the other one switched to rigging down for us. Me and the other climber were working opposite sides of the tree and we each had our own rigging line, ring and block set up. We were using a GRCS as our only lowering device so were taking turns sending stuff. The guy rigging for us is the most experienced of all of us and is our lead climber, as well as the business owner, and is usually very sharp. I had tied off a large limb that was over a neighbor's garage and asked him for feedback on my plan. He totally changed what I had set up, which involved about 10 minutes of me moving around, changing the rigging configuration, setting a higher rigging point, etc. which I did. Once I had everything ready to go, I made my undercut and then verbally checked in with him as to whether he was ready, and he replied "Yep, I've got line and I'm ready when you are." He had me tie this piece near the middle because it was about 20' long and 7" diameter at the butt end and he felt it would possibly have hit the garage if I tied it near the butt due to it's length. Because of this I was focused on how the piece reacted when it came off in case he didn't let it run below me before it tilted. I made my back cut and it fell in the direction I had predicted but way too fast, and landed right on top of the neighbor's garage. He yelled "What just happened?" When I looked at him he was holding the wrong rigging line. I told him he had the wrong rope and he immediately acknowledged the mistake and even said that he knew I was using the other line and just screwed up. The garage had only a few damaged shingles, mostly due to the brush spreading out all the weight. Nobody was hurt either which is most important. There are plenty of takeaways from this for me. 1- Anyone can make a mistake, no matter how experienced. 2- I could have visualized him holding the correct rope prior to cutting, regardless of whether it seemed redundant or not. 3- having a second lowering device and having a line dedicated to each may have prevented this. 4- having two guys climbing and one guy rigging seems inherently less safe than one climbing and two doing ground work.
Rigging Mistake
- Thread starter Njdelaney
- Start date
Shadowscape
Been here a while
- Location
- far north
Thanks for sharing, Noah. Another lesson well put.
And you now have something to hold over the owner's head should he give you a hard time about something you do wrong in the future. Money in the bank.
Barc Buster
Branched out member
- Location
- The land shaped like a hand
Thanks for sharing Noah. It’s always helpful to hear how stuff went bad. Sorry you had a bad day and I’m glad nobody got hurt. I definitely wouldn’t have felt comfortable having one guy rig for 2 climbers off one device with two different ropes.
thanks for sharing! like you said the scenario with two people climbing and one person on the ground sounded unusual to me.
a friend of mine wanted to rig a small branch because the customer was worried about his rododendrons. he tied it on but made his cut infront of the knot sending his piece free falling hitting the rododendrons. must‘ve been a similar feeling.
glad nobody got hurt.
a friend of mine wanted to rig a small branch because the customer was worried about his rododendrons. he tied it on but made his cut infront of the knot sending his piece free falling hitting the rododendrons. must‘ve been a similar feeling.
glad nobody got hurt.
VenasNursery
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Michigan
Thanks for sharing things can happen so fast it’s ridiculous glad no one got hurt and minimal damage
Stumpsprouts
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Asheville
Very sobering. Very good communication and experience but still things like this can happen.
I agree with your last conclusion and others- most of the time, having two climbers in a tree slows things down and leads to safety issues.
Humans are not really wired to multi task, so asking one groundie to handle 2 climbers and their rigging was probably not the best game plan. Over the years I have learned that K.I.S.S. usually wins the day when it comes to tree work. Thankfully nobody was hurt and the garage sounds like an easy fix. Call it a win and a lesson learned..
southsoundtree
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Olympia, WA
Thanks for sharing.
I call ropes by color.
Red (red rigging line is attached to pull up) on (the) blue (climbing rope)!
Tension (the) red (rigging line)l
(The) red (rigging line) is clear (of the piece that was just lowered and untie, ready to pull up).
I call ropes by color.
Red (red rigging line is attached to pull up) on (the) blue (climbing rope)!
Tension (the) red (rigging line)l
(The) red (rigging line) is clear (of the piece that was just lowered and untie, ready to pull up).
evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
I’m glad everyone is safe, and at the end of the day the garage is just a object to bruse an ego.
I have many questions..
Why did the groundie didn’t pull the rope out of the block?
What was the other climber doing at the time?
It’s always a good plan to take slack out… all parties do a double check… I just don’t get how someone could be lowering such a limb, and not take slack out more so when lowering with a GRCS.
Sounds like the job was beyond safe work levels for the crew on hand. Aka a rush job trying to bust it out when under staffed and under a time line that is too short. A management failure….
I have many questions..
Why did the groundie didn’t pull the rope out of the block?
What was the other climber doing at the time?
It’s always a good plan to take slack out… all parties do a double check… I just don’t get how someone could be lowering such a limb, and not take slack out more so when lowering with a GRCS.
Sounds like the job was beyond safe work levels for the crew on hand. Aka a rush job trying to bust it out when under staffed and under a time line that is too short. A management failure….
Matias
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Butte County
One of the guys I work with brings me on mostly for large complex trees. I will go out a little farther than him and take more smaller cuts, but still make cuts that need to be rigged off, and we do exactly as Sean describes; have never had a mishap. Not saying it could never happen, and we've certainly saved our own asses by double checking, which is why we talk through every single cut to be rigged.
The trees that we've done would've taken twice as long with 1 up 2 down instead of the reverse. Our groundie is a stone cold crusher when it comes to managing the ropes and the chipping simultaneously.
Sometimes I will setup a cut to be rigged and handle some other small stuff in the area while groundie is busy.
Glad to hear that nobody got hurt and the damage was less than feared.
The trees that we've done would've taken twice as long with 1 up 2 down instead of the reverse. Our groundie is a stone cold crusher when it comes to managing the ropes and the chipping simultaneously.
Sometimes I will setup a cut to be rigged and handle some other small stuff in the area while groundie is busy.
Glad to hear that nobody got hurt and the damage was less than feared.
The slack was out of the blue line and that is part of why I didn't bother looking at him when he said he was ready. I don't know if he had it looped around something on the ground, or was standing on it, or who knows. There was one place that it was over a union to add some friction and Honey Locust bark can be grabby and the rope was a fat, fuzzy double braid so maybe he pulled the slack out and the bark held it. It's all speculation at this point. I can say that he was feeling frustrated that he underbid the job and had voiced that a couple times, so he was probably less focused than he should have been. While I understand him feeling that way, I don't rush beyond my own comfort level when I'm off the ground, no matter what the case may be. I will definitely hustle on the ground under time constraints though. I appreciate all the input so far, thanks guys. I like the idea of always calling a rope by it's color as a protocol and I plan to bring that up at our meeting on Friday.
And @evo The other climber was moving his rigging to the next lead he was going to start piecing down. I have no idea why he didn't pull the other rope off the bollard, especially since he had such specific instructions about what he wanted me to do with my rigging line and was watching closely. We were using the GRCS because of the possibility of tip-tying some pieces and lifting them to break them off but we were primarily using it like a portawrap.
evo
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- My Island, WA
Sounds like the guy was really distracted. When I say slack out, I expect to see the piece I’m about to cut, move a little (butt tied is the exception but if butt tied I will put a hand on it and give it a bit of a pull).
That was what I was trying to get at, just throwing another suggestion that is a quick and easy rhythm to get into.
southsoundtree
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Olympia, WA
For me, pulling the slack out is different than tensioning the rope.
Me: Light tension on blue!
Roper: Light tension on blue!
Me: Thank you!
Me: I'm going to face-cut to swing it to the side and down. Hold the tension, ease it down, and let it run when it the hinge breaks.
Roper: Hold the tension. Support the hinge sideways and down.
Let it run.
Me: Thank you.
$0.02
Me: Light tension on blue!
Roper: Light tension on blue!
Me: Thank you!
Me: I'm going to face-cut to swing it to the side and down. Hold the tension, ease it down, and let it run when it the hinge breaks.
Roper: Hold the tension. Support the hinge sideways and down.
Let it run.
Me: Thank you.
$0.02
Barc Buster
Branched out member
- Location
- The land shaped like a hand
Yep this^^^ it’s so simple and that’s why it works.
southsoundtree
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Olympia, WA
We did similar communication for speed lining, recently. I landed at least half on the feed-tray, no control line. Maybe 3/4+.
As the roper, knowing how long, heavy,
green/dead, and if I would develop slack from a rear-side limb instead of a front-side limb, etc, was key to it being easy. It was the climber's first speedlining.
The taller the tree, the harder it is for the roper to assess.
Communication makes it safer and easier.
"Ok" is poor communication. It means one person heard something, maybe even the correct thing.
As the roper, knowing how long, heavy,
green/dead, and if I would develop slack from a rear-side limb instead of a front-side limb, etc, was key to it being easy. It was the climber's first speedlining. The taller the tree, the harder it is for the roper to assess.
Communication makes it safer and easier.
"Ok" is poor communication. It means one person heard something, maybe even the correct thing.
Bendroctanus
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- Springfield
On a side note, there is something to be said for politeness.
Yep. Its took me a long time to figure out that a "thank you" and a "please" are much better at creating an efficient and harmonious job-site than a raging asshole who is always in a hurry.
Mick Dempsey
Carpal tunnel level member
- Location
- France
Agreed, but my nephew for example is always ‘thank you-ing‘
and ‘good job-ing’ and it gets on my tits, it’s like every bit of rigging is an event.
A simple ‘lovely’ or ‘nice one’ On a decent bit of rope work is enough.
Matias
Been here much more than a while
- Location
- Butte County
Yea, I reserve the "good job" for when the climber is out of the tree, but I do sometimes get excited when they let it run so smoothly I barely feel a wiggle. I let them know very vocally how much I appreciate it
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