New helmet mounted camera. SRT and traverse DdRT

[Richard Mumford-yoyoman]

I am trying my new helmet mounted camera. Did a climb with it a couple of days ago and thought I would post it for comments. I took out the sound (just me hitting my head on things and huffing and puffing anyway) and used CC closed captions for remarks.
I'm not asking for free instruction but being new to the sport critique is welcome.

SRT up a pine with Unicender, past canopy anchor with tail, set traverse line using false crotch, traverse and descend.


SRT up one pine, traverse and down another. Press CC to see remarks.

 

[boreality]

With a ground installed anchor point you haven't had a good inspection even with binos. A healthy looking branch has bad angles on conifers. Don't trust a tree especially a single branch.

The simple solution is to take your return line or whatever it's called and walk/whip it around the stem keeping it as high and tight to the stem as possible. I wouldn't of climbed on that.

 

[bonner1040]

You wouldnt climb on this?

 

[boreality]

Better angle.

Even whipping the return to the back side will help to hold it against the stem but I prefer at least a half wrap. That tree only had a handful of branches to work around. Too easy.

 

[oceans]

Bo, are you saying it would be better to redirect the force of the ascent side of the line around the main trunk of the tree somehow? I could understand that, though that limb looked alright to me.

Moss and I were recently discussing healthy White Pine limbs that can pop out at the collar in Winter, though the load would most certainly need to be applied well away from the collar to cause failure.

YoYo, looked pretty good there, but that trunk of that second tree looked pretty darn hollow. In hindsight, it's the traverse that scared me, thinking that putting a potentially heavy side load on the defect from well above it could have been bad. Can't tell from a video, but it looked like callous tissue that has been compartmentalizing for quite some time. I'm sure you know that the forces applied at low rope angles can be very high, and they increase/decrease dramatically with little change of rope angle in the more horizontal orientations.

Thanks for posting...I watched this in a coffee shop without volume so I could be wrong, but even the CC didn't reveal how you set your throw-line/DdRT system in the second tree. Don't leave out the goodies!!!

 

[islandarb]

I am sure he used the boomarang trick that Jerry Baranek used in his DVD series, I have never tried it but it's really cleaver for the traverse...I have set traverses like that while cleaning a series of close palms, ( not that tall mind you } the forces on opposing palms is great at those rope angles for sure, feels like they would pop the ring and harness apart.....doubtful but nerve racking none the less....I usually release one side which drops me down and then across and up with the next this is a lot better instead of a horizontal crossing, just too much tension....

 

[boreality]

I only watched the first ascent's tie in. I had a knee jerk or maybe just a jerk reaction to the anchor.

Yes oceans get some stem or weave it through other branches. It's easy ground work and as your walking around the tree looking up it's further inspection and alot of deadwood and hanger removal. I don't even count the branch as my tie in height it just positions the string or rope for that height of wrap to begin. On a bushy tree I'll take whatever I can get whipping it around but remember if it's not against the stem it's close to useless.

I've had two big good looking branches pop off in my climbing career not counting willows. Hello. You don't know what they are til you tap them with a handsaw.

 

[Richard Mumford-yoyoman]

Great responses and input, I pay a lot of attention to what you all write! thanks!
Yes, the anchor is pretty high, about 90' I think as I was using a 200' foot rope and by the time I looped it down, there was only about 20 laying on the ground. It took me a few shots and I felt your concern with the TIP, not much very low I could choose from and certainly lots of dead wood in the way. I don't know what the actual numbers would be but I almost always get my anchor in these situations flush with the trunk so I am taking about a sheer force as apposed to a breaking a branch or leveraging it out of the tree. Seems you can put some pretty serious load down when you are talking about sheering it off as opposed to breaking it off or bending it over. Like bending a nail over as opposed to sheering it off.
The thing that gives me the willies, (love that feeling though) is being about halfway across the traverse, looking down about 90' or whatever and knowing you are hanging on some piece of metal inside that swivel that you can't see and only hope the 70 buck or so covered the quality control. I always like having a second connection to something but of course that would defeat the purpose of the swivel. The only other connection I have is a foot ascender and I have thought that little situation thru.
I do like DdRT for these kinds of traverses as I can easily control the angles and feel the tension being placed on the ropes. Knowing that if I keep the angle at about 120 degrees, I think they call that the critical angle, I will not exert more force on the TIP or my line than what I ascended with. In other words, in my case 200 pounds of pull. The vertical force and horizontal force (relation to the ground) will be even less.
Yes, the defect was there and pretty deep but lots of sound growth around it and being anchored above it put some stress there but I figured that to be much less then the tree has with a little wind. One day that is probably going to be where it comes down.
I would be interested to know if anyone has ever computed the side force a wind exerts on the tree canopy in relation to a couple hundred pounds from a climbing line.
Again, really appreciate the input. My responses are not in anyway a defense, just trying to explain what I was thinking so if I am off base I can get other opinions.
Loving this stuff.

 

[islandarb]

Yo Yo what about setting the line in the traverse tree, was it the boomarang shot,,like Jerry B's vids show....

 

[oceans]

Yeah, how did you set the traverse?

And, I'm thinking that the diffusion of wind forces due to all the needles, twigs, branches, stems, and trunk could be much different than the direct force applied by a climber in a specific location. I don't have data to convey what I'm getting at...it's just a theory.

 

[Richard Mumford-yoyoman]

[ QUOTE ]
Yo Yo what about setting the line in the traverse tree, was it the boomarang shot,,like Jerry B's vids show....

[/ QUOTE ]
I have been learning that boomerang and like it.
In this video(link below) I set a line about 15 feet away and I have been practicing on the ground with very consistent results at 30' and ok at 40', but being in the tree with branches at angles and awkward positions gives it a whole new dimension. I can't do it with my left hand for ...., well not good.

setting a line with the boomerang at time 12:00, almost the end of the video.

As far as in this tree, for now let me just say it is a "better grapnel" and I will just have to leave it at that now. I'm deciding if I want to market it or just put it out there. You guys don't miss anything do you!

 

[Richard Mumford-yoyoman]

[ QUOTE ]

And, I'm thinking that the diffusion of wind forces due to all the needles, twigs, branches, stems, and trunk could be much different than the direct force applied by a climber in a specific location. I don't have data to convey what I'm getting at...it's just a theory.

[/ QUOTE ]

I would love to see some numbers on this. I am sure there is some engineer that has figured that out for the tree community somewhere, just don't know where to look.
I'm figuring my pull on the tree with this kind of traverse at around 150 pounds or less. I realize doing the math just gives a number that may or may not apply to the unknown but it is a start. I think we would all be surprised at the force the wind can apply. Maybe some sailor with tree sheets to the wind can tell me. I think about when I am driving down the road, put a 12x12 piece of cardboard out the window at 30 mph and compare that to a canopy with the stem, branches and everything else multiplied lots of times.
Interesting

 

[Richard Mumford-yoyoman]

[ QUOTE ]
...
And, I'm thinking that the diffusion of wind forces due to all the needles, twigs, branches, stems, and trunk could be much different than the direct force applied by a climber in a specific location. I don't have data to convey what I'm getting at...it's just a theory.

[/ QUOTE ]


Found some great stuff on the subject, take a look at table 3 for some good examples.



.

 

[boreality]

OK that was on a beefy collar. I'd climb on that and I didn't watch long enough to see the angle. And those branches were a little long to walk the rope around.

I saw the down rope on the same side and hoped you weren't on one branch. As soon as I saw the top I stopped watching and started posting. I rarely get conifers with collars that big. But it could of been made stronger by jigging the weight on a spiral on the way down, maybe. Or did I miss the boat again.

Actually you sent up a friction saver, right? Nevermind I better watch this video again I think you had too much stuff going on for me to focus. Or I took a trip and never left the farm. My climbing system is very simple. That works good for me because so am I.

That was a big branch you were tied into.

 

[islandarb]

Bore, I like you, you certainly crack me up...but I too am simple and YO YO really had some stuff going on which is good he seemed proficient with it...I would have gotten strangled by all that gear...but some dudes handle all that stuff well...Kudos YO YO....

 

[boreality]

Yup that was a good climb and video. It never works out good when I don't watch til the end.

 

[Richard Mumford-yoyoman]

[ QUOTE ]
Actually you sent up a friction saver, right? Nevermind I better watch this video again I think you had too much stuff going on for me to focus. Or I took a trip and never left the farm. My climbing system is very simple. That works good for me because so am I.
That was a big branch you were tied into.

[/ QUOTE ]
It was kind of a long video so I think a trip to the farm was completely justified.
The initial anchor was on the the Butterfly with screw link, then I moved up the tree another 15 feet or so and set a friction saver for the traverse line DdRT. I used a leather cambium saver for the other side. I like to have the ring and ring friction saver for added options.
Yep, I do like the gear, that is half the fun for me but it also helps get my 200# up the tree. (well, probably 220# because I have all the gear

) I did send up the friction savers and DdRT stuff up with the Butterfly when I set the anchor, that helped.
Thanks

 

[Adam_P]

I'm impressed by your line tamer in the first vid and your boomerangage in the second.

I'd always thought that people hated that line tamer. It looks like yours is working pretty well. What throwline are you using? Do you actually use that thing when working, or just for fun?

When I first got Gerry's videos I replayed the boomerang part probably a half a dozen times. It totally looked like magic. It looked like in that second video you got it in 2 shots. Nice. I need to practice..

 

[oceans]

Nice boomer', YoYo! Very nice.

 

[Richard Mumford-yoyoman]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm impressed by your line tamer in the first vid and your boomerangage in the second.
I'd always thought that people hated that line tamer. It looks like yours is working pretty well. What throwline are you using? Do you actually use that thing when working, or just for fun?
When I first got Gerry's videos I replayed the boomerang part probably a half a dozen times. It totally looked like magic. It looked like in that second video you got it in 2 shots. Nice. I need to practice..

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for the feedback, you are very kind. Love that avatar of yours!

I understand the frustration with that Line Tamer, I sent the first one back, when I got the replacement and it was the same, I tried to fix it. Added the curly wire and modified the housing to make it mid-line attachable. It made it work pretty well. I do use it, often, fold it up in my cube with the trow bag. It needs to be better though and one day I will fly to China and find someone to make it for me. Being that it is a modified fisherman's line stripper so they can remove 1000' of line in seconds, it is just geared too high for our needs. It just needs a slower, more geared down motor and it would be great. I find it works ok with Zing-it and in this video Dynaglide.
On that boomerang shot, that was the third try. On the first one, when I pulled it back it took a swing about 20 feet below and hit a branch just right and wrapped itself around about 7 times! Just my luck. Had to use my other line to unwrap it (wouldn't want to climb down and do it).
Funny thing is, I still have not bought Gerry's video and I have not seen it done. I just put boomerang and branch together and treated it like some long range yoyo trick. I want the video but always seem to put some pulley or lanyard on my list when I make the order but I will get it as I want to see it done. It is a very useful, in the tree move and I am sure the video is full of stuff I need to learn.


I uploaded this video with some slow motion of the boomerang, at 3:05 I could have made it 45 feet if I was standing a little further back. I realize this is all much earlier than in the tree but great practice anyway.

Since this is a video thread....
I just posted a little night climb I did.

A night climb getting into my lounge chair for a little rest..........some would not call this rest but I think you guys understand.