judges
- Thread starter whataview
- Start date
jim454
Participating member
- Location
- The land of Utopia
Those are the breaks, you're at the judges mercy.
Talk to the judge,
I don't put much faith into "reputable sources"
Talk to the judge,
I don't put much faith into "reputable sources"
- Location
- Enid, Ok
if it were a only against a certain competitor and it happened regularly against said competitor, i would look to have 'him' removed. now, if it was the same for all competitors across the board, it is what it is.
The judge's mercy?
Shouldn't each competitor be judged fairly and evenly with other competitors regardless of affiliation?
While Id agree about not putting much stock into "reputable sources" what if this particular judge has a history of bias against competitors outside of their circle of friends?
Shouldn't each competitor be judged fairly and evenly with other competitors regardless of affiliation?
While Id agree about not putting much stock into "reputable sources" what if this particular judge has a history of bias against competitors outside of their circle of friends?
jim454
Participating member
- Location
- The land of Utopia
Now you know why I don't judge John.
Talk to the judge.
Talk to the judge.
jim454
Participating member
- Location
- The land of Utopia
That's the problem, just about anyone can claim bias.
Correct me if I'm wrong John but can't a competitor file a complaint?
Correct me if I'm wrong John but can't a competitor file a complaint?
Sure a complaint can be filed, but it has to be done in writing on an official complaint form within one hour(I think) of said infraction. Scoring sheets aren't generally shared with competitors until weeks afterward.
Wouldn't you feel cheated if when you viewed those sheets you could see that 2 of 3 judges scored your climb uniformly and the 3rd had scored you ridiculously lower for no apparent reason?
The Masters climb used to call for 5 judges. Then the highest and lowest scoring judge's scores were automatically thrown out to prevent bias in either direction. Then the 3 remaining scores were averaged for the final score.
For some reason this isn't done anymore.
Wouldn't you feel cheated if when you viewed those sheets you could see that 2 of 3 judges scored your climb uniformly and the 3rd had scored you ridiculously lower for no apparent reason?
The Masters climb used to call for 5 judges. Then the highest and lowest scoring judge's scores were automatically thrown out to prevent bias in either direction. Then the 3 remaining scores were averaged for the final score.
For some reason this isn't done anymore.
- Location
- Retired in Minneapolis
It's hard to get enough skilled judges to have 5 at the work climb. Also, getting enough volunteers to take the time to tech/judge is really difficult.
Giving competitors access to score sheets can open a huge can of worms. without the ability to look at all of the score sheets from all of the judges from all of the events is NOT going to give an accurate vision of the issue.
If you/someone feels slighted you/they should take it up with the chapter Exec Committee and the head judge/chair of the TCC. Do all of this in writing/email in a professional way.
Giving competitors access to score sheets can open a huge can of worms. without the ability to look at all of the score sheets from all of the judges from all of the events is NOT going to give an accurate vision of the issue.
If you/someone feels slighted you/they should take it up with the chapter Exec Committee and the head judge/chair of the TCC. Do all of this in writing/email in a professional way.
- Location
- Manchester UK
Are we talking about a work climb or a masters here?
Surely it should be easy to find 5 judges for the masters at the world championships! There are so many knowledgable people floating around, you cant spit without hitting a potential masters judge.
In the UK this season, I think we've had 5 judges for both masters events at every comp, by getting climbers to help judge. I think thats a great way of doing it.
Surely it should be easy to find 5 judges for the masters at the world championships! There are so many knowledgable people floating around, you cant spit without hitting a potential masters judge.
In the UK this season, I think we've had 5 judges for both masters events at every comp, by getting climbers to help judge. I think thats a great way of doing it.
Riggs
Participating member
- Location
- Bryn Mawr , Pa.
I agree , there should be five judges . If there is going to be just three , than the score sheets should be made available . Judges "should" be held accountable for the way they score , especially at an event of this magnitude (ITCC). Throw out the low and the high , keeps it fair .
The reason they don't send out the score sheets is because judging used to be unfair , and people had a right to be ticked off. Judging at the Masters ITCC should be an honor and I can't believe they can't find five .
The reason they don't send out the score sheets is because judging used to be unfair , and people had a right to be ticked off. Judging at the Masters ITCC should be an honor and I can't believe they can't find five .
Its hard to say, a judge in the tree may see somthing in the tree that the judges on the ground cant see. One judge may see somthing from one angle that others cant see from another. If its a question on safty like in the A.R. then you have the ability to write out why you think you are right and that paper goes under reveiw by the head judge. In most cases the head judge will come up to you and let you know why they made their decision and discuss it with you. I seen this first hand on Sat. at the Int. comp. It comes down to the fact that we are all human and make mistakes. That is why I think the road is clear and a car just appears out of noware and he is slamming on his horn and flipping me off when I pull out in front of him. What I thought I saw wasnt what was really their. Stuff happens.
- Location
- Asheville,NC
judges...what are those?
Hey Tophopper and friends,
First, do you really think that we don't read this page? I find this thread really insulting as no complaints have been sent to either George or I (this is Lynn by the way) or the MSA exec board in the 4 years that we have run the MNTCC.
Second, tophopper you of all people should not be involved in this issue. We practically begged you to judge and you decided it was better for you to go fishing. You had your chance and you muffed it.
Where this thread has started, I would ask that whomever has the problem will talk to George and I face to face, like a real person does, not behind our back like some sort of Sally.
Lynn
MSA TCC Co-chair
612-910-8280
First, do you really think that we don't read this page? I find this thread really insulting as no complaints have been sent to either George or I (this is Lynn by the way) or the MSA exec board in the 4 years that we have run the MNTCC.
Second, tophopper you of all people should not be involved in this issue. We practically begged you to judge and you decided it was better for you to go fishing. You had your chance and you muffed it.
Where this thread has started, I would ask that whomever has the problem will talk to George and I face to face, like a real person does, not behind our back like some sort of Sally.
Lynn
MSA TCC Co-chair
612-910-8280
Lynn,
Involved in what issue? Now its an issue? I was merely replying to a hypothetical question posed on a public forum, and giving my feedback. Your right, I wasn't there. That doesnt exclude me from sharing my opinion about a posed hypothetical question. Your defense on the matter makes it look like it was more than hypothetical.
I never said a thing about you or George or the way you run the TCC. Truth is, I think you guys have been doing a great job for the the years you have run it. Happy now?
and since were clearing the air, I was never asked to judge the event (certainly not begged), but more so told I was going to either compete or judge by your co-chair. If I had been "asked" I may have. But I wasnt. Anyway thats besides the point.
Im glad you are here and glad you read the posts here at the buzz. Did you really think, I thought that maybe this wouldnt be viewed by you or George. Sorry hun, I call em like I see em, I dont sugar coat sqwat for anyone, and Im not about to censor myself because I think you or someone else may take offense to my opinion.
Scroll up and read my post. I agreed that issues should be brought to the committee, you must have missed that?
Relax a bit Lynn, nothing was implied by anyone but yourself.
John
Involved in what issue? Now its an issue? I was merely replying to a hypothetical question posed on a public forum, and giving my feedback. Your right, I wasn't there. That doesnt exclude me from sharing my opinion about a posed hypothetical question. Your defense on the matter makes it look like it was more than hypothetical.
I never said a thing about you or George or the way you run the TCC. Truth is, I think you guys have been doing a great job for the the years you have run it. Happy now?
and since were clearing the air, I was never asked to judge the event (certainly not begged), but more so told I was going to either compete or judge by your co-chair. If I had been "asked" I may have. But I wasnt. Anyway thats besides the point.
Im glad you are here and glad you read the posts here at the buzz. Did you really think, I thought that maybe this wouldnt be viewed by you or George. Sorry hun, I call em like I see em, I dont sugar coat sqwat for anyone, and Im not about to censor myself because I think you or someone else may take offense to my opinion.
Scroll up and read my post. I agreed that issues should be brought to the committee, you must have missed that?
Relax a bit Lynn, nothing was implied by anyone but yourself.
John
