is it too late?

TCtreeswinger · Apr 30, 2015

This basswood is marked for removal for Saturday having second thoughts on its condemnation. High traffic area easily can hit half million dollar home. Kids running around all the time and boats if it goes the other way. Its shielded by a oak on western side and has a sister stem that is three feet away. Homeowners now want it down but are concerned about stability loss of other stem. I don't think any cable is strong enough to hold if it fails and the span would still allow it to hit house.

TCtreeswinger · May 1, 2015

Roughly 75' tall 24" diameter wound at 25'. I know guy and the others would say save it. I also know most rational guys I know would say remove it. I have deleted most other pictures I have because I decided to take it out but I am having second thoughts. Thoughts and opinions?

Paul Mertz · May 1, 2015

Basswood? Take it down soon. That rot will only get worse and will eventually fail.

TCtreeswinger · May 1, 2015

That's what the text and my experience say but I've seen many other trees saved. And like I said how will this affect the other stem that is obviously rooted with this stem. I've already recommend small reduction on other stem but they want to wait

Paul Mertz · May 1, 2015

I would keep a close eye on that other stem in future years. It seems to me that basswoods rot badly over time with the slightest wound. Kind of depends on exactly how they attach at the bottom.

TCtreeswinger · May 1, 2015

2-3' gap in between stems its just the loss of roots that concern me.

Paul Mertz · May 1, 2015

That's a better situation than that pictured. I was thinking it was a 2 stemmer coming out of the ground at the same spot. Reducing the crown of the remaining stem will hopefully be enough to keep it going.

TCtreeswinger · May 1, 2015

Yes the remaining stem should be OK with reduction. I just don't want to take this one out if it can be saved

guymayor · May 1, 2015

What is the objective? To relieve the ugly sight of what looks like a cankered wound from removing an excessively large branch. Looks like that sucker's been limbed up pretty good; an excellent way to increase risk!

why do you think there is a net loss of strength? check that woundwood out--like flexible iron!
to assess, ya gotta remove the dead bark and stuff and ID the margins of the wound. Photo and measure and reassess next year. Document growth of woundwood aka strength gain.

Continuity and growth are what matters; formulas are just mathematical masturbation that ignores wood quality, and dynamics.
no whole-tree shot?

I've seen 4' dbh basswoods with ~4" shell wall.

guymayor · May 1, 2015

" I know guy and the others would say save it. I also know most rational guys I know would say remove it."

TC maybe you could expand on this rational thing a little. lol
Rational means reasoning, so what rational reason is there to whack this thing?

You do realize the irony: One arbo whacks the big limb as an overreaction to solve a clearance or some such issue, the next arbo whacks the whole tree as an overreaction, to solve the ugly cavity problem.

Rational mitigation of the aesthetic and *perceived* risk issues might include tacking windowscreen over the cavity. But first get paid to inspect the tree competently and assess the facts, not suppositions.

JeffGu · May 1, 2015

I have a master plan. Get a yard gnome. Paint his clothes with black and white, horizontal stripes. Put him inside the cavity. Put window screen over the cavity, and iron bars (rebar should be fine).

Ok, that probably wasn't helpful. Carry on.

Mark Chisholm · May 2, 2015

What does the tree owner want to do? If they say they do not want to accept the level of risk, then you shouldn't either. If they are ok with it, then maybe there's a creative way to anchor it at a few different heights to the neighboring tree? If that is not an option, then I am not sure what else can be done besides overall reduction and monitoring.

guymayor · May 2, 2015

Mark, good thought on using adjacent trees for support, to mitigate the perception of risk.

Without a whole lot of investigation, I don't think any of us is qualified to opine on the level of risk. If, despite our limitations, we communicate that we understand it, we are liars pure and simple.

Reduction and monitoring is a good default plan to proceed, despite our ignorance, to give trees a chance to teach us what we do not know.

Mark Chisholm · May 3, 2015

I was contemplating my decisions on a friends property today the whole time we were working. One Tree closest to the house (all pin oaks) had multiple areas with mushrooms on the trunk, cankerous sunken spots, and a hollow. It had some die back as well. I gave them the best info I had and they decided it was time to remove it.

The other 3 were a clump that grew as a team. The front was in good shape, but had mushrooms and a large canker. The one on the right rear lost a large limb and when we Pruned it we found about a 5' twisted seam on both sides, probably from hurricane Sandy. The back left one had two large dead leads and some other die back. All 4 had issues and I hated every minute. I hope nothing fails in the near future. I just couldn't let him remove all of them. We'll see.....

JiKeidan · May 4, 2015

Paul Mertz is right... As deep as the rot is on that lead already, and as heavy as basswood/linden is, get rid of it. They can always plant another one, and if taken care of properly, won't yield the same risk in another 20 years

TCtreeswinger · May 8, 2015

Sorry I have been busier than expected. Guy, I still see myself as "irrational" for wanting to save trees like this based on perceived risk. I took Mark's advice and proposed multiple cables when I got to the job site.

They are family so trust my opinion but after having a few storms this spring decided the worry wasn't worth the risk for them. The tree was hacked away at as Guy guessed for lake view by the prior owner.

All in all it opened up the view which they now enjoy and we have reduction on the on the other stem planned. Bittersweet I suppose?

Mark Chisholm · May 10, 2015

Thanks for the follow up.

tomthetreeman · May 10, 2015

Anecdotally, I see very little damage to lindens after severe weather events, and it seems to me that they are flexible and handle movement and load better than other species.

-Tom

TCtreeswinger · May 10, 2015

Yeah it was a tough call for me. But in the end its not my tree and not my decision to make. I presented them with all of the knowledge I have of defects and tree characteristics and let them decide. Like Mark said it boils down to level of risk the tree owner is willing to live with. This tree will be on my mind for a long time though. Next time I'll push harder for preservation