Driving Class B CDL Truck with out CDL

[MA Arborist]

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[Vicente]

I've pulled a 14k dump trailer with my 01 dodge diesel 2500, I wasn't at 14k (still heavy though) and the trailer was de-rated for legality but it wasn't a problem trailer had good brakes, I have an electronic brake controller in my truck.

 

[Steve Connally]

I agree with @Reach Not only will you get a ticket, risk loosing your license, but they'll impound your truck and you'll pay for towing, storage, and a release fee. You'll be forever on the radar of the local motor carrier cops and it'll ripple for you for a very log time. Just get legit.

 

[Steve Connally]

What kinds of 3/4 ton trucks have the capacity to pull that heavy of a trailer?

I pulled a 20k trailer with my Ram 2500. Had to shut the ac off and leave many vehicle lengths between the cars ahead of me and me. It stopped but it was ass end heavy. Looked I dropped the rear end. I pulled it for about a year then sold the business. Don't know how long my trans would have lasted. I also would have put air bags on the rear to try to keep the front end on the ground. Young and stupid was the MO at that time.

 

[stheis004]

sorry to to derail a bit but here’s a senario I’ve searched all over for and can’t really seem to find a definite answer…any thoughts? ( talk to dot…I know but still am going to ask here…)

Can a 14k rated & registered trailer legally be towed empty (4,000lbs) by my 3/4 pickup that has max towing of 9,500lbs (a number I can only find online), gcwr would be well within specs.

 

[Reach]

sorry to to derail a bit but here’s a senario I’ve searched all over for and can’t really seem to find a definite answer…any thoughts? ( talk to dot…I know but still am going to ask here…)

Can a 14k rated & registered trailer legally be towed empty (4,000lbs) by my 3/4 pickup that has max towing of 9,500lbs (a number I can only find online), gcwr would be well within specs.

My understanding is that yes it can, provided your truck is registered in combination, or the trailer is registered at or below 10k. The actual weights don’t matter unless they’re over what the registered weights are - the registered weights are what the law cares about.

I find it unlikely though that you’ll be bothered by DOT if you’re pulling an empty trailer behind your 3/4 ton truck provided the sum of the GVWRs (the GCWR of the combination) is less than 26k.

 

[ATH]

My understanding...(and this probably wi change by state):
Commercial carrier enforcement ONLY has authority over vehicle combinations that exceed the weights discussed above that require a CDL. Therefore they wouldn't look at you. Also, assuming that is the case and you are loaded under rated weights of oth truck and trailer, the rating of a vehicle only applies to that enforcement... doesn't otherwise matter. Obviously you don't want to go over what your truck is rated for...but you wouldn't be with an empty trailer.

The one you might want to ask though is your insurance agent. I doubt they'd have a problem if you tow some weighing under your trucks capacity. If this is your trailer and one you're using a lot to haul light stuff/never needing the capacity, you could ask the manufacturer to provide you a 9500 lbs tag for it.

Go all the way back to the OP...buy a 33000 rated truck and get it de-rated to 26000 if you can realistically operate it at that weight.

 

[Fivepoints]

My understanding...(and this probably wi change by state):
Commercial carrier enforcement ONLY has authority over vehicle combinations that exceed the weights discussed above that require a CDL. Therefore they wouldn't look at you. Also, assuming that is the case and you are loaded under rated weights of oth truck and trailer, the rating of a vehicle only applies to that enforcement... doesn't otherwise matter. Obviously you don't want to go over what your truck is rated for...but you wouldn't be with an empty trailer.

The one you might want to ask though is your insurance agent. I doubt they'd have a problem if you tow some weighing under your trucks capacity. If this is your trailer and one you're using a lot to haul light stuff/never needing the capacity, you could ask the manufacturer to provide you a 9500 lbs tag for it.

Go all the way back to the OP...buy a 33000 rated truck and get it de-rated to 26000 if you can realistically operate it at that weight.

Remember that 26k derated truck still requires a class A if you stick a trailer larger than 10k behind it.

Derating a 14k trailer to 10k lbs might be a good plan if it still leaves you with enough payload. We keep thinking about doing this to haul our mini skid behind our f550. All the rest of our fleet has 7k axles or larger. Spares and having brake parts be common seems like a good idea. We have a 14k trailer now that weighs 3200 lbs. We use it to haul our 8k mini ex so we need to keep it rated at 14k.

In our state anything over 10k unless RV exemption, the dot looks at or can.

 

[Fred_Berkelhammer]

Reed -- what happened to the bucket you had?

 

[Z'sTrees]

I can clarify. You are correct, as far as combination (and therefore CDL) rules go, a trailer that is RATED at 10k pounds or less does not count as a trailer for weight calculations. That means a 26k truck pulling a 10k trailer does not require a CDL.

However, if the truck is rated at 26,001 pounds or more, a CDL becomes necessary. Likewise, if the trailer is rated at 10,001 pounds or more, a combination registration is necessary for the truck, OR if the combination of the truck registered weight and trailer registered weight is 26,001 pounds or more when added together, a CDL is required.

The official federal answer can be found here: https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/registration/commercial-drivers-license/drivers

And the officers who enforce these laws are not always clear on what the law says, so if you believe you are legal and are told otherwise, speak with a DOT compliance company and they may be able to have your record cleared if you were in the right. We have run into that problem.

I've never seen it interpreted this way before. I always thought combined was combined and once you hit 26001 you need a CDL regardless

 

[Reach]

I've never seen it interpreted this way before. I always thought combined was combined and once you hit 26001 you need a CDL regardless

It is not, at least not in PA, or according to the FMCSA (the Federal agency who sets the standards that most states follow). I’ve spent years dealing with these rules and been DOT checked a number of times without incident.

One time we had an officer try to tell us that we were wrong and needed a CDL for a 19k truck with an 8k chipper, but our DOT compliance company proved the officer wrong. This was the same officer who tried to tell us the chipper needed an inspection and registration though, so he clearly didn’t know his rules. (In PA a chipper is an implement, not a trailer so no registration or inspection is needed)

 

[ATH]

Same here in Ohio:
Class B is truck by itself is rated 26001 or more.
Class A is combined truck/trailer rated 260001 or more AND trailer 10001 or more.

 

[Fivepoints]

If anyone is not sure what your state requires, go search up your states cdl manual. They all have a flow chart in them to determine if you need a cdl for what you are doing.

 

[VenasNursery]

I always thought the Feds controls the Federal laws and they are the same in every state?True not true ?
Some states add additional laws?
State laws?
So we have to keep track of both lol
Absolutely terrible system!
And the worst part is that 90% of police are either unsure or just flat out don’t know the laws.
I was taught to be quiet and not try to correct or educate them in any way just let them write tickets take it to court if you’re right you’ll beat them and get it thrown out!
But still loose a half a day of work if not a full day.

 

[Jehinten]

To the OP I know a guy in a similar position who got stopped the other day for a random inspection. He was in a bucket truck towing an excavator, so more than likely class A territory. DOT found 12 arrestable offenses.


DOT must have been having a good day because he got off with only a $183 ticket, but he started the process to getting his cdl the next day.

 

[Vicente]

To the OP I know a guy in a similar position who got stopped the other day for a random inspection. He was in a bucket truck towing an excavator, so more than likely class A territory. DOT found 12 arrestable offenses.


DOT must have been having a good day because he got off with only a $183 ticket, but he started the process to getting his cdl the next day.

A friend of a friend got busted they just made him go get a class B, May be a similar thing.

 

[Ragnar]

Can you buy the CDL truck and have it de-rated or registered for less than 26K? Sadly, only first class citizens get away with not following laws in this country. What difference does it make.

The time to get a CDL was before Jan 2022. The feds toook over the process. Used to be a lot easier and cheaper to get.

Would not suggest running a non pickup CDL rig without CDL. It is also my understanding you can have a 26K truck and 10K rated trailer without need for CDL. Many 14K trailers are de-rated to 10K for this exact reason. Some places have exemptions for farm trucks over the 26K +10K weight within certain distance from the farm. I see plenty of one tons (12K+) and 14K-25K gooseneck trailers runnign down the road. No idea if those are all CDL, I doubt it...