Zigzag longevity

Crimsonking

Been here a while
Attention zigzag users:

For those of you who have worn one out, how much use did you get before it started slipping? What rope did/do you use? Did switching to a larger diameter line extend its use?

I picked one up on sale at the expo, and am wondering what to expect. Zigzag haters, please keep input to a minimum, as the choice to use one has been made and will not soon be unmade.
 
Attention zigzag users:

For those of you who have worn one out, how much use did you get before it started slipping? What rope did/do you use? Did switching to a larger diameter line extend its use?

I picked one up on sale at the expo, and am wondering what to expect. Zigzag haters, please keep input to a minimum, as the choice to use one has been made and will not soon be unmade.
I don’t climb as much as I use to but I think @Pelorus has been using one the longest I know, I’ve had all versions, the first 2 I climbed a lot on and didn’t notice any slippage at all. It’s by far the best climbing device out there for what my company does most ( Crane removals ) and every day climbing, heck now that I have the Reon Rounds tether SRS with the ZZ is awesome! I’ve been using tachyon and blue tongue mainly, runs great with it.
 
I'm still using the replacement for the recall and it works fine without slippage on Yale 11.7's
I did subsequently purchase another ZZ for a spare which has seen very little usage.
The Reon Rounds gizmo is on the wish list.
I dont have much affection for that Zillion thingy lanyard adjuster. Way too sensitive, imo.
 
My oldest ZZ is a 2014 Version 2 unit that I bought new and has never developed the hairline fractures in the upper links. I'm not a production climber, so nothing I own gets worn out very fast, and I'm very picky about taking care of tools. That said, none of mine show any wear that affects performance, at all. The V2 one is also my "loaner"... I've let dozens of people play with it, and shipped it all over the country. I was hoping one of the fatties would shock load it enough to cause the link fractures so I could send it in and get another V3 replacement. No such luck, it refuses to crack. It shows enough wear that you can tell it isn't brand new, but that's it. It's going on five years old, and I have no doubt that it will still be good for at least five more.

The best ropes for the ZZ are 24 to 32 strand double-braid or kernmantle ropes in the 11.7mm to 11.8mm range. Smaller ropes spread the links out further and I find that this makes them jerkier and prone to slight slippage... nothing scary, but they will coast to a stop sometimes... maybe six to twelve inches of slide. This probably is only with climber in the 200-lb. plus range. I go about 200 with gear, these days. I've never had a rope 11.5mm or larger slip. It slips very slightly with KM III Max, but that rope is about 11.1 or 11.2mm which is smaller than the 11.5mm that Petzl lists as the minimum rope diameter for the device.

Anything larger than 11.8mm and slack tending is affected. Some 16-strand 1/2" ropes will be usable, some add way too much drag. Two 1/2" kernmantles that I tried were both unusable, the added drag was just too much. One short hank of 1/2" kernmantle worked, but the ZZ didn't just fall down the rope like it does with the 11.7/11.8mm ropes... it would slide down about a foot and stop. That's still usable, but slack tending isn't the usual butter smooth. I've given up on 1/2" ropes with the ZZ, now that 11.8mm ropes are getting common.

I have the one V2 ZZ and four V3 ZZs because... well, aside from the obvious fact that I'm a bit weird, they are still the best MRT device for my needs, I climb with 2 lines most of the time, and I usually keep climbing gear in both trucks as well as the trailer I use when I'm doing tree work.

I also bought up a lot of ZZ V2 units with fractures in the upper links, for cheap, and sent them in for replacement. Petzl only asks for the serial number and your shipping address, nothing more. If it has the fractures, is within the 3 year warranty period (they can tell from the serial number) then they replace it with a V3 unit, and pay for shipping both ways. They don't care if you're the original purchaser, or not. I sent a total of 7 of them in, since 2015. I sold one, and gave one away as a gift.
 
Thanks, guys, for your input. It sounds like I won’t have anything to worry about for a long time. I’m using it with xstatic right now and am finally getting a feel for descending. It’s such a game changer for mrs.
 
I weigh about the same as JeffGu, at 180, and maybe 200 with gear. I have two V3 ZZ's now, both with rope wrench above for SRT. Very smooth! Love 'em. I use Tachyon Ash for shorter climbs (a little bouncy but I like that on a short ascent) and I just bought a long piece of Poison Ivy this Fall for less bounce on taller ascents. The ZZ/RW combos work great with both ropes which I think are 11.7mm. I still have my trusty BDB and keep it on a piece of line with a hook on the end, for special duty like short traverses or positioning sideways. The BDB comes off the rope rather quick and can be used on other lines if needed. That is an issue with the ZZ; it is not mid-line attachable and can't be used on rope with an eye on the end. One thing I just tried today was using the long Poison Ivy piece, with a ZZ/RW on each end, for alternating ends when moving TIPs up a tree. I was using canopy ties with an AB knot and SS oval screw link each time, and no pull-downs til I finally wanted to quit the tree. Then I made a pull-down with the opposite tail of the rope to retrieve the rope from the ground. I am still a beginner at limb walking and redirects but have already gotten totally addicted to using the SCAM setup with a pair of RollClipZs. The SCAM works fine with the built-in pulley on the bottom of a ZZ.
 
Meant to add, one thing that has happened to me several times, which is not serious but still a PITA, is while descending and tending the ZZ with my hand around it, my glove will get sucked into the links. Have to re-attach one of the ascenders and raise up enough to free it. Once it sucked it up quite hard when I was bombing down. Took a bit to free it and it pinched my finger too.
 
I’ve done that with hitches, which is part of the reason I don’t wear gloves anymore. The worst was when the rubber peeled and wrapped my hand around a drill bit when bolting a tree.
 

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