Sailing Winch As Splicing Tool

Ragnar

Ragnar

Participating member
Location
Texas
Teaching the kids to splice. Other than the final buries, they can do all steps themselves. Premium Ropes had a video of them using a sailing winch and it seemed to work well. I will sometimes use a hi-lift jack but that is not an option for the kids. I know a regular winch, block and tackle, and hydraulic are options outside but I would like something they can use indoors (mounted to the splicing table).

Having never used a sailing winch, I am asking for any insight/thoughts on specs.

Premium Ropes used a size 46 Lewmar self-tailing. Not sure if it was a single or two speed. Either way, that size is more than I would like to spend (even used).

I am considering a smaller model Lewmar or Harken (size 20) single speed self-tailing. My only concern is if it can easily generate enough force to do standard buries encountered in the type of splicing we normally do here.

Below is the video from Premium Ropes

 
That would be very useful, save on labor and wear on the cover when using a Prusik for assistance. A lot of splice testing videos show the splice burying more when some force is applied.
 
If I wanted one for splicing, I'd shop for used winches. A single used winch seems to sell for a fraction of the new cost. Check sailing sites. And I'd welcome cosmetic blemishes to further reduce the price.

Don't manufacturers' sites provide some type of spec on the capabilities of winches?
 
Yeah, the break testing videos I watch in slow motion often show the eye gettig smaller before it breaks. When I tension splices on the Hi-Lift, they do suck in more as well. According to Hi-Lift specs, 4600 lbs is what it can apply but I dont think I max it out.

The winch manufacuteres provide the gear ratios, line size etc. but no pulling force specs. My guess is they avoid listing a pull spec becuse of variables involved (strength of person, length of crank handle, angle etc).

I have been looking for used. Will keep looking and make some calls.
 
I have a mech advantage kit, not enough space to use it indoors/on a bench. With the sailing winch, it would nice not to have to untie a knot after pulling on it.

Read a few articles on sizing/pulling power of sailing winches. Sounds like they are sized by their power ratio. So a size 46 has a power ratio of 46.

Assuming I have been maxing out the hi-lift at the 4600 lbs listed spec (in a basket configuration), which does get the job done, a 2300 lb straight pull should work with a sailing winch.

Average tension applied with 10" crank handle = 50 lbs x 46 power ratio = 2300 lbs for an adult. Less if a kid is using. So it does seem like a size 46 is approx size needed. May need a cheater bar or longer crank.

I dont think going to a larger winch is going to happen as the price really starts to climb as you go larger than a size 46.
 
Please don't shoot the messenger, but just to be devil's advocate here, I'd worry about having to force a bury so much that I had to use a winch to get the eye to snug up. Early days for me had troubles with bury's caused by snagging the core somewhere along the line or not tapering correctly or fiddling with used rope. Some splices were finished by yanking a little more with me in a harness but never having to force this much (also manipulating the eye back and forth). Rope is after all textile and stressing the cover fibres so much in forcing a bury and making it this tight, might this not actually weaken the whole final splice/ cover? Also if the bury is so tight, does this affect the ability to lock stitch or tear something up in that process? It'd be interesting to me to see pull testing results on splices that were this difficult to bury frankly, 'cuz I've never had to force splices this much, esp. if using a prussik to milk cover. Maybe try milking more than the five fid lengths of rope - covers can move around a bunch if you're using mechanicals especially, which flatten the rope. My two cents.
 
Last edited:
But just because you have the power of a winch doesn’t mean you need to use all of that power. I would think you cranked up on the winch as much as needed. The winch just takes place of you pulling on it to bury the splice thus making it easier.
 
I agree about not having to force it. I can usually tell if something is off well before the end of the bury. A snag is different that things just getting tight.

Just lookin for a way to make it easier for kids. I have watched several splice videos by rope manufactures that show the use of machines or mechanicals to complete the splice.

And yes, for most 1/2" climbing lines, I am not able to whiplock closer than 3" from base of eye. Some of the things I make wont see enough tension in use so I like to tension before whiplocking.
 
Last edited:
I can speculate that maybe in large commercial splicing setups, machines are used to speed things up (with lots of quality control around the previous steps) and most probably for RSI issues with having to do repetitive tasks? Just my two cents though.
 
West Marine has a BOGO sale on new Lewmar winches.... Anyone else interested in one? From what I have seen 50% of new price is what used winches go for on ebay. I am open to size 40-46.

Sites-WestMarine-Site

West Marine
www.westmarine.com www.westmarine.com
 
Work bench may not be up to task....

i-dXhMTFS-L.jpg
 
I should have gotten one of these years ago. Work bench is def the weak point. I would like to mount it to a long piece of I-Beam with an anchor on the other end. Will run this as is for now. This was just some 10mm sailing line. Have done Tachyon, Blue Moon, Vortex, and Predator (toughest one IMO) but the winch did all the final buries. Don’t regret getting a size 52. I would not suggest less than size 46. Self-tailing would be nice but this is a non-self-tailing version and it works fine. I hold tension with one hand and milk cover with the other. I doubt the self-tailing jaws of a winch this size work well with smaller lines. Can just skip the self-tailing jaws if you have them and are using a small diameter line. Self-tailing winches were more expensive when I was looking.

i-w7KTWfC-L.jpg
 
Last edited:
Ragnar said:
I should have gotten one of these years ago. Work bench is def the weak point. I would like to mount it to a long piece of I-Beam with an anchor on the other end. Will run this as is for now. This was just some 10mm sailing line. Have done Tachyon, Blue Moon, Vortex, and Predator (toughest one IMO) but the winch did all the final buries. Don’t regret getting a size 52. I would not suggest less than size 46. Self-tailing would be nice but this is a non-self-tailing version and it works fine. I hold tension with one hand and milk cover with the other. I doubt the self-tailing jaws of a winch this size work well with smaller lines. Can just skip the self-tailing jaws if you have them and are using a small diameter line. Self-tailing winches were more expensive when I was looking.

i-w7KTWfC-L.jpg
Click to expand...
why would you not recommend a smaller winch than a 46? measured my harken 46 and got 1400 kg of pull, i would hope my splices will slip together with lessforce :)
 
Just based on the ease of cranking. Sounds like you apply 66 lbs of force to crank handle. I dont think I apply that much and the kids certainly dont. For me, its nice to be able to one hand operate the crank without a lot of effort. Also, larger winches prob have larger drums to accept more wraps. When I get a better mount, it would be nice to get a line scale to see how much tension it really can apply. Also, applying tension on a bench may be different than when solid mounted to a tree. The bench would probably start to rotate around if I really got after it.
 
Last edited:
Bumping an old thread. Actually bought two of these winches. Was going to keep both but decided to list #2 for sale.

Lewmar 52 Sailing Winch – For Splicing

Older style. Standard/non self-tailing. Obviously used and has had some repairs done at some point in its life. Condition is as expected for a sailing winch made sometime between 1982 and 1992. I bought a pair of these. Tore them both down, cleaned, replaced missing parts (which were hard to...
www.treebuzz.com
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

New threads New posts

Kask Stihl NORTHEASTERN Arborists Wesspur TreeStuff.com Teufelberger Westminster X-Rigging Teufelberger
Back
Top Bottom