Running splices home with a winch?
- Thread starter Ghrrum
- Start date
Jimmycrackcorn
Participating member
- Location
- Boston
Something similar to this is what's being suggested..
This method is deff overkill but serves the same function. You milk it, trap slack by throat & pull on winch.. I just happen to use the hydraulics in my dump trailer instead of a winch.
Also just a word to the wise.. some would say that if you need these mechanical advantages to make your buries, you've done something wrong & should start over.. The thing with that is, there are times where you can follow manufacturer directions to the "t" & still have major difficulty burying.. At that point if you've done it over & over with same results & your using all the right little tips & tricks, you probably need to rethink how things are being tapered.. how much is being removed, for what distance & how much core tail & cover tail is actually in there causing it to be so hard to bury... Also, some covers don't want to expand much to accept these buries, even after following direction. Soo, their all going to be a little different.
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This method is deff overkill but serves the same function. You milk it, trap slack by throat & pull on winch.. I just happen to use the hydraulics in my dump trailer instead of a winch.
Also just a word to the wise.. some would say that if you need these mechanical advantages to make your buries, you've done something wrong & should start over.. The thing with that is, there are times where you can follow manufacturer directions to the "t" & still have major difficulty burying.. At that point if you've done it over & over with same results & your using all the right little tips & tricks, you probably need to rethink how things are being tapered.. how much is being removed, for what distance & how much core tail & cover tail is actually in there causing it to be so hard to bury... Also, some covers don't want to expand much to accept these buries, even after following direction. Soo, their all going to be a little different.
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Jimmycrackcorn
Participating member
- Location
- Boston
Well yeah.. just like the last picture would suggest.. your supposed to keep tension on the eye while milking the slack towards the eye.. There's a boat load of splicing videos on YouTube, have you looked into that at all? There much easier to follow than a thread here.. For example go on & search Tachyon Splice.. Velocity Splice.. Ocean Poly Splice..
Jimmycrackcorn
Participating member
- Location
- Boston
No problem..
You got your head wrapped around it now.. it makes sense? If i think of any other tricks in the meantime, I'll let you know. Just fyi.. i am by no means a master at splicing.. I've just spent alot of time in the past 8 months reading & trying to use different techniques.. I'll typically splice something a couple times a week.
You got your head wrapped around it now.. it makes sense? If i think of any other tricks in the meantime, I'll let you know. Just fyi.. i am by no means a master at splicing.. I've just spent alot of time in the past 8 months reading & trying to use different techniques.. I'll typically splice something a couple times a week.
No worries, are you using a splicing wand or fids?
Jimmycrackcorn
Participating member
- Location
- Boston
I don't have any wands.. if you mean "wand" as in Biron Toss Wand.. I just bought some 18 or 20ga fence wire & twisted it up around a biner or ring & use as wire fid, made a few different sizes.. I don't have traditional fids either.. I use different sized knitting needles..(think Grandma) knitting a sweater. But... I think depending on Cordage the Selma fids could be useful.. or whatever style holds onto the Cordage the best without tape. However, i do mark them & use them for measuring as well as hogging out covers before trying to fit a fid into it. I'll also use them to run a soft fid through certain larger 12 strands when i don't want to snag anything with a wire fid.
However.. the thing that makes it all come together is a "Soft Fid" that i use.. two different sizes too. It's this stuff called "Tech Flex" (expandable sleeving/generics all over Amazon). I use 1/8in & 1/2.. When doing buries i pull the Tech Flex through with the wire fid first (which goes right through wicked easy), do some Core removal a few inches back, tape it off loose stuff, slide the Tech Flex over the end & just pull it through.. Since using this method, I've never ever had trouble doing buries ever again.. Whereas when i first started i was having a very hard time.. It's especially helpful on Cordage that has super tight covers or trying to do double x-overs within a cover like with 12 strand e2e's..
Here.. I'll shoot a few pictures..
Core Removal (colored the tape so you could see where i put it, pretty self explainitory though)
Tech-Flex
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TimBr
Official Well Known Greeter
- Location
- Northern Virginia
@Jimmycrackcorn; The following quote from your post above absolutely sounds like a Holy Grail kind of splicing tip, and I have not yet even begun to try to splice rope. Did you find this tip somewhere else, or is it just something you thought to try out of pure frustration? Saying that since you've been using this method, you've never had trouble doing the bury again, is a huge, bold statement of effectiveness. It makes me think your technique should be taught as standard operating procedure. Thanks so much for taking the time to post this tip! - Tim
"However.. the thing that makes it all come together is a "Soft Fid" that i use.. two different sizes too. It's this stuff called "Tech Flex" (expandable sleeving/generics all over Amazon). I use 1/8in & 1/2.. When doing buries i pull the Tech Flex through with the wire fid first (which goes right through wicked easy), do some Core removal a few inches back, tape it off loose stuff, slide the Tech Flex over the end & just pull it through.. Since using this method, I've never ever had trouble doing buries ever again.. Whereas when i first started i was having a very hard time.. It's especially helpful on Cordage that has super tight covers or trying to do double x-overs within a cover like with 12 strand e2e's.."
"However.. the thing that makes it all come together is a "Soft Fid" that i use.. two different sizes too. It's this stuff called "Tech Flex" (expandable sleeving/generics all over Amazon). I use 1/8in & 1/2.. When doing buries i pull the Tech Flex through with the wire fid first (which goes right through wicked easy), do some Core removal a few inches back, tape it off loose stuff, slide the Tech Flex over the end & just pull it through.. Since using this method, I've never ever had trouble doing buries ever again.. Whereas when i first started i was having a very hard time.. It's especially helpful on Cordage that has super tight covers or trying to do double x-overs within a cover like with 12 strand e2e's.."
@TimBr - the tech flex method is old. Normally used is a similar stainless steel product that is used in the exact same manner. I can't locate a pic at the moment, but they are out there.
@Jimmycrackcorn Cut that section flush that's frayed and melt the ends like you would a rope. I've been using it for years. I like to use the RED for splicing though. Have white, black, and orange additionally on hand. I Buy mine in a couple hundred foot rolls.
@Jimmycrackcorn Cut that section flush that's frayed and melt the ends like you would a rope. I've been using it for years. I like to use the RED for splicing though. Have white, black, and orange additionally on hand. I Buy mine in a couple hundred foot rolls.
@Ghrrum
Its recommended to use gloves and tie down points when milking and burying the splice and at some of the other points( because of the forces we have to exert on some of the ropes when splicing and the heat that builds up among other things). Some of the Covers are really tight and need that extra UMPH to get it where it is supposed to be. If you watch some of the videos, they attach the line to a climbing harness and pull to assist in the process. Sailrite has it in a couple videos as well. When I did the Sirius line the other day, I had to bounce in my harness dangling from a tree to get the last 1/8" of the eye buried. Milking the Cover and moving the splice around to loosen it up.
Part of the reason why manufacturers and resellers prefer to sew eyes vs a splice on certain ropes and invest in ~$25k tacking machines. In the long run, they can charge for the sewn or splice and it pays itself off in the long run in time saved. Treestuff charges $25/ splice and $15/ sewn eye.
The cover not having enough room in it made me think to cut a portion of the core out, like an inch, and start the process then. That would compress enough for an easier bury at the end.
TLDR; Mechanical advantage makes it easier.
Its recommended to use gloves and tie down points when milking and burying the splice and at some of the other points( because of the forces we have to exert on some of the ropes when splicing and the heat that builds up among other things). Some of the Covers are really tight and need that extra UMPH to get it where it is supposed to be. If you watch some of the videos, they attach the line to a climbing harness and pull to assist in the process. Sailrite has it in a couple videos as well. When I did the Sirius line the other day, I had to bounce in my harness dangling from a tree to get the last 1/8" of the eye buried. Milking the Cover and moving the splice around to loosen it up.
Part of the reason why manufacturers and resellers prefer to sew eyes vs a splice on certain ropes and invest in ~$25k tacking machines. In the long run, they can charge for the sewn or splice and it pays itself off in the long run in time saved. Treestuff charges $25/ splice and $15/ sewn eye.
The cover not having enough room in it made me think to cut a portion of the core out, like an inch, and start the process then. That would compress enough for an easier bury at the end.
TLDR; Mechanical advantage makes it easier.
- Location
- Oregon coast
Getting the final bury on a double-braid can be tough but I've always thought it was supposed to be. I wouldn't want the final stage of a splice to go in easy because I would worry that it could come apart just as easily. However, snapping and jerking the line to set the splice seems to take a toll on my wrists and shoulders pretty quickly. I'd like to try using a technique which would incorporate a simple mechanical advantage (5:1 or maybe even 3:1). This scenario would require two people but could also be done solo.
Picture this:
The line would be set horizontally between two anchors with the m/a set up and the "throat" of the splice resting on a flat, firm object (tree stump or just a wide round). Of course the splice would be buried as far as possible (comfortably) by hand in the usual way. Then, one person would put steady tension on the line while another person would gently hammer on the splice with wooden dowels as if they were playing a drum roll.
If all goes as planned, the splice would work itself all the way home because of the combination of the tension and the drumming.
The drawback though, is that it would require having (at least) one friend. : /
Picture this:
The line would be set horizontally between two anchors with the m/a set up and the "throat" of the splice resting on a flat, firm object (tree stump or just a wide round). Of course the splice would be buried as far as possible (comfortably) by hand in the usual way. Then, one person would put steady tension on the line while another person would gently hammer on the splice with wooden dowels as if they were playing a drum roll.
If all goes as planned, the splice would work itself all the way home because of the combination of the tension and the drumming.
The drawback though, is that it would require having (at least) one friend. : /
@MorningStar , I normally use a Boat Cleat that I zip/screw into a stump using lag bolts and remove when done. Sometimes I use a piece of webbing wrapped around the trunk as an anchor point. In both instances I have used my truck winch, or done a pull system, Orange come-a-long to burry double braided line. Recently hanging from branches and bouncing, - My children find this method the best since they splice too and get to involve the neighborhood kids when we are setting multiple burry's.
SomethingWitty
Arkansawyer
- Location
- LR
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