Pre-Fatality Checklist?

hl_tree

hl_tree

Location
New Fairfield, CT
Over the last couple of weeks I've been working for a person who is of questionable intellectual ability, for lack of a nicer way to put it. There wasn't much work to be had, and he had some jobs, which meant money in my pocket.

We'll start with electrical hazards.

Small job, just a couple of small norway maples by a service drop. Apparently the insulation had worn away on one of the lines, causing a spark when a branch brushed up against it on the way down. I backed out, "Get the power company to come do it." This person said to give him the gear, he'll do it. I had to talk him out of it.

On now to Chipper hazards.

One day we were working in a storm damage site (I had all PPE on, and got mocked for doing so). For some reason numb nuts decided that it would be a good idea to climb up on the chipper, and kick some stuck branches into the chute while the rollers were still going.

Now for Chainsaw hazards.

The other day, working on a municipality job... he felt that he had hit something with his 361?. Rather than shutting the saw off completely to asess the situation, he simply engaged the chain brake, and then with bare hands inspected the chain... the engine was still idling.

To top it off... we'll go with Falling hazards.

There was a branch stuck on top of the roof of a dilapidated building. Not a huge branch, but not a small one either. We had ropes, power pole saw, 361, 020, and a regular pole saw... plus a backhoe. Rather than toss a rope up to get the branch and pull it off the roof, he decided to use the backhoe to gain access to the roof. He got into the front bucket of the machine, with his trusty 361, had the machine lift him up to the edge of the roof... and scrabled up to the top where he cut away at the branch, throwing it to the ground... all the while unsecured to ANYTHING. Once done, he simply slid down the steep pitched roof into the safety of the front bucket. Down he came, unscathed.

After that day, I decided no more. I don't feel like being around to whitness a fatality, or SERIOUS injury.
 
sounds like some safety training is called for. any chance of influencing this guy toward education? not that it's your responsibility, but working around someone with safer work habits might just save this guys life. maybe you already tried that - just my 2 cents. you see a serious accident coming, he doesn't - would you push the guy out of the path of a train barreling down on him if he didn't see it? yes, of course. that would only take a minute though i guess. dunno. just thinking out loud..
 
I've found education just doesn't make a difference for the people who don't care. Its a state of mind to be safe. You can tell them all the dangers and reason with them for doing certain things but sometimes it just comes down to people not really caring about thier personal well being.
 
[ QUOTE ]

Small job, just a couple of small norway maples by a service drop. Apparently the insulation had worn away on one of the lines, causing a spark when a branch brushed up against it on the way down. I backed out, "Get the power company to come do it." This person said to give him the gear, he'll do it. I had to talk him out of it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Check

[ QUOTE ]

For some reason numb nuts decided that it would be a good idea to climb up on the chipper, and kick some stuck branches into the chute while the rollers were still going.

[/ QUOTE ]

Check
[ QUOTE ]

Rather than shutting the saw off completely to asess the situation, he simply engaged the chain brake, and then with bare hands inspected the chain... the engine was still idling.


[/ QUOTE ]
Check
[ QUOTE ]


To top it off... we'll go with Falling hazards.

he decided to use the backhoe to gain access to the roof. He got into the front bucket of the machine, with his trusty 361, had the machine lift him up to the edge of the roof... and scrabled up to the top where he cut away at the branch, throwing it to the ground... all the while unsecured to ANYTHING. Once done, he simply slid down the steep pitched roof into the safety of the front bucket. Down he came, unscathed.



[/ QUOTE ]

Check.


Wow. I have done every one of these things in the past. I still check saw tension every once in awhile with the engine idling and I still get on a roof without being secured. However, you have a point, hi_tree. Some personalities don't mix in the tree world.
 
I have the pleasure of getting "ribbed" for ppe as well.
"you see, I have twenty years experience" Quote while grabbing a saw with
a longer bar because while hands extended overhead on his tip toes he couldn't reach the branch with the 200t. I've decided to be responsible for my own safety, those that refuse to listen to common sense are on their own. Those that show promise or the slightest interest, are welcomed with open arms. I'm actually happier now. I think a lot of us have done some of those things because, early in our careers, that's what was shown to us by the expert of the day.
 
Check, check, check...sounds a bit like playing Russian Roulette.

Why do these things! If there is a safer way to proceed why wouldn't you choose that option?

There are two words that come to mind here...


Widows


Orphans
 
Hi_Tree, I hope you didn't think I was poking fun at you. I was just pointing out that I could have been that person you were working with (as well as the overwhelming majority of tree climbers in the US). True, not all of those practices are safe. But often times, they seem necessary at the time.

Not to sound preachy, but many tree climbers who fit your description are great climbers/people/workers.

This is an old discussion on the buzz; but to change these guys, I think you must earn their respect first (as a climber/worker). Show by example that yours and their safe practices are in their long term interests.

And pick your fights. I used to check chain tension, saw idling, without engaging the chain brake. I'm safer now, and engage the chain brake. Usually.
 
Dont stop trying to educate these guys. Be an Ahole if you must. Mabey they will think about it some day and change.
Many will consider these to be minor infractions. Not me.
Every point that you brought up is valid.
I must say that compared to what I have witnessed here in Az, your freind sounds like a real pro. Dont work for them anymore if you can help it. It will give you ulcers and wrinkles.


I speak for the trees
I YELL AND I SHOUT
for the finer things
that are on their way out!
 
Three strikes and you're out. If you have done some training about the benefits of not being dead/dismembered, the employee should know better.

Antother thing to consider, this job isn't for everybody. I'd rather see somebody get fired and pissed off than get hurt.
 
Every once in a while I get the feeling to be a little antagonistic and maybe offer a little broad generalization. Most of the time I hit the 'delete' instead of 'send' button.

So, am I more tired or maybe a little stronger than my peers because I'm willing to turn off a saw, check, and then re-start it? Substitute check with reposition and I must be wearing myself out, falling behind on productivity, burning extra kilo-calories.

To borrow from the aviation field:

There are old climbers.
There are bold climbers.
There are no old bold climbers.

Still no lifeguard at the gene pool.

----------
Yes, awareness is the first step, training.
And awareness is the second step, for intelligence is no substitute for wisdom.
 
The way I see it... it takes only a few extra seconds to shut off, and then re-start a properly functioning chainsaw. If you want to check chain tension, or sharpness... shut it off, do whatever you want, and then start it up again.

The electrical stuff... as a multimillionaire once told me... $1,000,000 in the bank isn't worth a dime if you're not alive to spend it.

The falling stuff... tie a rope off to the thing and pull it off. Not hard to do.

I'm not even going to bother to try to educate this person... as far as the train comment goes. It's not worth it. If I push him off today (and lose my own life in doing so) odds are he'll be right back in front of a different train tomorrow.
 
You know a lot of us have bad habits that I'm sure we could all justify to each other. We all have or different ways of doing things. This might sound a little crazy but you can always tell a cautious person from a plain stupid person. If your on a roof unsecured and you don't pay attention to the edge ... you might fall. I have a long history in line clearance and in that line of work you take alot of risks. Not saying they are worth it but they are necessary. There is only so much you can do sometimes but using your best judgement and caution is a definite must. I agree with Humper, these people are the ones who set our insurance rates but anyone with any sort of experience in our line of work can't tell me they aren' always safe. We all try to the best of our ability and thats what counts. I would never let someone I was working with do something dangerous that I thought would get them hurt. If I thought I was more capable of doing the same task in a safer manner then I would just do it... or advise them very closely.
 
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