NJ Board of tree experts.

ThatsNotMaple said:
Unfortunately this is a separate issue from pesticide applicator licensing. Two licensing processes. In NJ if you climb or operate a bucket you cannot also apply pesticides to trees unless you have a licensed tree expert as well as a licensed pesticide applicator. However, a landscape company can do so with just an applicator.
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I understand, I was floating the idea as a possible loop hole work around. Maybe not the most legit way to stay in business but still a way to stay in business, possibly. Cheaper then the fines and all that. The pesticide license sharing is definitely way shadier though, in my opinion.
 
So let me get this straight ... you are saying that in NJ you can’t start a tree business with an ISA? You need to pass their certification process? Is this only if you plan to use chemicals? Or does this mean no cutty cutty in NJ?
 
Stephen Moore said:
So let me get this straight ... you are saying that in NJ you can’t start a tree business with an ISA? You need to pass their certification process? Is this only if you plan to use chemicals? Or does this mean no cutty cutty in NJ?
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the way I read the information, if you have a cert like the ISA cert Arb, you are in the clear but have to register it with the board. Owning a company though you need to take the operators test.
 
Correct you cannot start a company with just ISA credential. The LTE test is very rigorous I am a CA as well as an LTE and the LTE exam is very challenging. I think they are not doing the reciprocity for CA's anymore.
They have an easy exam to be an LTCO which allows you to be licensed to do some tasks.
The business now also needs to be licensed proving you have the proper liability and workmans comp insurance and they do check work comp classification codes.
I agree with the new regulations as it will level the playing field and take the uninsured guys out. This is not new news it's been talked about for years. It finally just passed in January I think. You also need to have a company safety policy.
 
In BC you can be insured for tree work and not be certified strangely enough? However, you need to possess a business license in incorporated municipalities. This may include the requirement for certification. And legally you can’t do any work around energized lines here without a CUA. So if you ain’t certified it will limit what you can do. You would at least need a CUA on staff- in the truck!
 
Sounds like NJ has it sorta right? But the client would be the one on the hook here if you didn’t have compo? And the same goes with insurance? I wouldn’t dream of doing tree work without insurance! Holy crap! Could you imagine? What would happen to you financially if you had a major incident? You would never earn another legal dollar! And that’s after you get out of jail!
 
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Baja Mike said:
Correct you cannot start a company with just ISA credential. The LTE test is very rigorous I am a CA as well as an LTE and the LTE exam is very challenging. I think they are not doing the reciprocity for CA's anymore.
They have an easy exam to be an LTCO which allows you to be licensed to do some tasks.
The business now also needs to be licensed proving you have the proper liability and workmans comp insurance and they do check work comp classification codes.
I agree with the new regulations as it will level the playing field and take the uninsured guys out. This is not new news it's been talked about for years. It finally just passed in January I think. You also need to have a company safety policy.
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I think the idea behind the regulations is a good thing. Tree companies should be checked for proper insurance. The business registration and licensing is a really positive aspect of the legislation. What I don't like, is that this law has essentially moved the goal-posts for arborists. The language differentiating tree companies from "ground based landscape" firms is especially concerning, as this basically tells me that as long as they don't climb or use a bucket they don't have to follow the regs even if they are working with trees.
I was denied eligibility for my LTE this year due to lack of documented work experience. My firm is already licensed and the owner is an LTCO. I've passed my CA exam, and I will just use the next year to self study for the LTE exam. I will have to miss time from work for the prep course most likely, which will have a negative monetary impact on the company and on my pockets. Meanwhile, Joe Landscaper is doing PHC for trees, building a larger clientele, selling bad applications, misdiagnosing problems, recommending bad species, planting trees too deeply, and obviously making money.

My only other thought is to start a sister company, label it as a landscape company, and run our PHC program through that. Seems ethically sneaky though.
 
ThatsNotMaple said:
I think the idea behind the regulations is a good thing. Tree companies should be checked for proper insurance. The business registration and licensing is a really positive aspect of the legislation. What I don't like, is that this law has essentially moved the goal-posts for arborists. The language differentiating tree companies from "ground based landscape" firms is especially concerning, as this basically tells me that as long as they don't climb or use a bucket they don't have to follow the regs even if they are working with trees.
I was denied eligibility for my LTE this year due to lack of documented work experience. My firm is already licensed and the owner is an LTCO. I've passed my CA exam, and I will just use the next year to self study for the LTE exam. I will have to miss time from work for the prep course most likely, which will have a negative monetary impact on the company and on my pockets. Meanwhile, Joe Landscaper is doing PHC for trees, building a larger clientele, selling bad applications, misdiagnosing problems, recommending bad species, planting trees too deeply, and obviously making money.

My only other thought is to start a sister company, label it as a landscape company, and run our PHC program through that. Seems ethically sneaky though.
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But loopie as heck! Id board that ship as soon as possible! That way you can cuntinue your work and experience!
 
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ThatsNotMaple said:
Contact the board. In my experience it is headed by some very reasonable people whose main concern is making sure our industry does not get tanked. You may not be eligible to sit for the LTE exam, but what about the LTCO? Also, what part of New Jersey are you in? If you can get your CA I believe they do reciprocity for LTCO.

The legislation that this is based on is probably average at best. I have my doubts that it will last, as I foresee someone challenging it in court. The heart was in the right place, but it's impossible to police the scope they've outlined. For example - my firm, being a tree company, cannot diagnose or treat tree diseases without an LTE. However, a landscaping firm can do just that because they do not engage in "aerial operations." Any firm proclaiming status as a ground based landscape firm can diagnose and chemically treat trees even if they have no idea what they are doing. Even without this provision, I see the legislation in conflict with the pesticide legislation already in place.

So, while I do believe the industry in our state needs some standardization, I think they missed the mark here. The exam for an LTE is VERY rigorous, and I'm not sure why it matters if someone has 1 year or 10 years experience.

Good luck, but I think if you plead your case the board will be receptive.
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Based on their requirements, I am not eligible for the LTCO. I have 3 years continuous documented experience as a business owner but not the 2 year education to go with it. I have way more than 5 years experience which would eliminate the education requirement, but it was not continuous or always documented.
 
fastbub said:
Based on their requirements, I am not eligible for the LTCO. I have 3 years continuous documented experience as a business owner but not the 2 year education to go with it. I have way more than 5 years experience which would eliminate the education requirement, but it was not continuous or always documented.
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You're eligible. I've read and re-read the actual law many times. If you have a two-year degree then you only need 2 years of continuous documented experience. If you have 3 years of continuous documented experience then you are eligible without the education requirement. You're all set - just apply and sit for the exam. Shoot me a message if you need any more info - I've researched this stuff extensively and pored over every word of the legislation.

Edit: For the LTCO, which is what you're looking for as long as you don't do any PHC or consulting work.
 
I don't think their should be any requirement for any test if you have the knowledge to pass you should be able to sit for the test.From my understanding their is a discrepancy with the ability to spray chemicals as you need to be a licensed pesticide applicator as well in NJ.
 
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Baja Mike said:
Correct you cannot start a company with just ISA credential. The LTE test is very rigorous I am a CA as well as an LTE and the LTE exam is very challenging. I think they are not doing the reciprocity for CA's anymore.
They have an easy exam to be an LTCO which allows you to be licensed to do some tasks.
The business now also needs to be licensed proving you have the proper liability and workmans comp insurance and they do check work comp classification codes.
I agree with the new regulations as it will level the playing field and take the uninsured guys out. This is not new news it's been talked about for years. It finally just passed in January I think. You also need to have a company safety policy.
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Just a couple of questions out of curiosity (based on your comments that I bolded):
1) Do you just need to have a LTE or LTCO on staff? Do they have to be on each job site as well?
2) Was workers comp not required before this law? Isn't it required for all employers in the state?
3) Is it actually going to be enforced so the playing field is level (at least in the area of insurance)?
 
Stephen Moore said:
.....I wouldn’t dream of doing tree work without insurance! Holy crap! Could you imagine? What would happen to you financially if you had a major incident? You would never earn another legal dollar! And that’s after you get out of jail!
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Probably not looking at jail time here for not having liability (possibly for not having workers comp though). However, it is still nuts to work without. I've heard people say "I can't afford insurance" or "I only do this part time, so I can't justify the cost of insurance". My reply is "if you cannot afford the premiums, than you most certainly can't afford to NOT have the insurance!"
 
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