Introducing Deep Root Fertilizing

bluebeecher · Feb 17, 2016

Hey Guys and Gals,

This spring I would like to add DRF in my area which has a population of about 150K. To my knowledge no one is currently offering this service. I was wondering if any of you have recently introduced this service in your market and what your experience has been? Any advice or tips would I'm sure be very valuable!

My plan is to offer this to my clients and mention it on every job, possibly throw it in to seal some good jobs if there is hesitation. But also I would be marketing this to all my local landscapers, nurseries, and turf companies. I would like to provide these other vendors with the literature, let them sell it to their clients for regular price (in 25$ increments, 50$ minimum), and I will then deliver the service on their behalf, charging them 70%. I will also send some marketing to commercial building and institutions.

My goal for the season would be 200 ferts at an average of 75$ each. Currently I don't do any other spraying and don't plan to, nor do I service turf.

Would greatly appreciate any advice or constructive criticism.

Much Gratitude,
Blue Beecher

easyphloem · Feb 17, 2016

What kind of products do you plan on using, and have you priced those out? What equipment do you have to apply the fertilizer? Do you have a small enough business that you can do the extra 200 visits on properties with such a low profit margin? Would that cut into any of the more profitable parts of your business, and if so, why not charge more for the fertilization?

SZ

easyphloem · Feb 17, 2016

And my vote is yes to fertilization. If you use good products, people are primed to want to "feed" their trees (even though we know how trees actually make their food).

Last year I sold $38K in fertilizer, and I don't really push it on everyone I meet. But it is a renewable service, so I plan on selling another 40K this year, while renewing a good portion of last year's fertilization programs.

In all, I have over $200K in renewable services (PHC, FERT, LAWN) that I am building upon yearly. Last year I had just over a million in sales, with 21% in non general tree work. The fert and PHC programs are where the real profits are, and pre-pay incentives in January for renewing services brings in much needed cash flow when the phones aren't ringing.

SZ

bluebeecher · Feb 18, 2016

Thanks so much for the great info SZ!

So, the product I am looking at using is the Doggett Injecto-Feed (spring and fall blends). I have priced it out so that my cost of product would be 25% of my final cost. I will be doing some of the injections, as will my dad and my apprentice, so I should be able to keep my labour costs down. I am estimating that the average time on a job would be around a half hour, do you think this is fair?
I don't think this will impact my tree services as I am currently looking to hire a climber to take over some of my duties. About 50 of these 200 jobs I am hoping for would be my own clients so I would already be on site for tree work.

As for equipment, the high pressure rig I am looking at from Rittenhouse is around 5K (canadian) but they offer an assemble-it-yourself kit for about half, and I can lessen that by using an aftermarket engine rather than the expensive Honda engine.

I also feel that people will love this service, but they just have never been made aware of it. Where I am in Ontario we have pretty hard clay soils so I think the side benefit of fracturing the soil will be a huge draw. However due to our weather conditions, abundance of native species, government regulations, and overall lack of interest, I don't think I will ever introduce pest control or IPM.

This will be my fifth year in business and so far my business strategy has been to price myself a bit less than my established competitors in order to build a client base and get more word of mouth referrals, which are always the best.
I am willing to extend that to DRF to a certain extent, but you are right I may need to adjust my figures once I've better crunched the numbers. Once I have a set $/gallon price I can then draft up a table to help clients determine how much fert they will need based on number/size of trees, length of hedge, or size of garden they wish to be fertilized. It would be sold in increments (at least by 3rd parties) so that I can deliver the exact amount ordered (as per the flow meter on the wand), with the option to pay me for more on site.
My own clients will be able to pay after I am done, based on the volume of product applied.

I really want to go for it, the hard part is just convincing the wife (we all know that right??). Your info and experience will help a lot so thanks again! What % of your DRF comes from residential vs commercial/institutional clients?

BB

oldoakman · Feb 18, 2016

I do fertilization as a main focus of a side business from my regular muni job. I also include preservation and consulting as well. Like you, there is no one in the area performing such services. I was able to aquire a slide in sprayer with a 300 gallon tank at a very reasonable price several years ago. I have to agree with Stephan, I think you are pricing yourself way too low. I have done jobs at apartment complexes where we pumped 2400 gallons and believe me it takes a lot of time. If I am at a site where movement is required but minimal, I figure 2.5 to 3 hours to empty 300 gallons. The maintenance on the machine can be brutal, I had new diaphrams put into my pump at a professional rebuilder recommended by the manufacturer and they found an issue with the main case. the repair cost me almost $1000. Tips for the injection gun can run as high as $70 or more and they wear out quickly. Pretty steep for a part time endeavor. Depending on the materials I am using and the site, I charge between $2.50 and $4.00 per gallon delivered. I have had a few private accounts but most of mine are commercial properties. My son helps with this work which is good because it gives him something to do as he has a disability that limits his employability. Hope this helps.

bluebeecher · Feb 18, 2016

Thanks for sharing your experience OOM.
I confirmed with my supplier, and the wholesale cost of the mix would be 0.50$/Gallon.
So I will likely be charing around 2.50$/Gallon delivered. My estimate of 75$ per job is assuming that at first, a lot of people may only want one tree done, or a small garden area. But hopefully with more affluent customers and commercial clients, it may be sales of several hundred dollars of product.
Question for you guys, when you have to refill your tank and you are away from home, do you "buy" water from your client (either because you need more water for them, or for the next client?)

Thanks again you guys are so helpful!!

mrtree · Feb 18, 2016

Bluebeecher are you ISA certified?

If you are ISA CA and fertilizing without performing a soil and foliar test are you not breaking the ISA CA code of ethics and liable for revocation of your credential?

easyphloem · Feb 19, 2016

mrtree said:
Bluebeecher are you ISA certified?

If you are ISA CA and fertilizing without performing a soil and foliar test are you not breaking the ISA CA code of ethics and liable for revocation of your credential?

You should report him.

Then, sit back and let the swift, brutal justice of the enforcement team from the ISA rain down upon his poor soul.

And by swift, brutal justice, I mean a reminder to pay his dues.

SZ

Treetopflyer · Feb 19, 2016

I threw a vote for yes up there for you to add to the persuasion when you show this to the wife. Good luck!

mrtree · Feb 19, 2016

Oh I think that ISA is only looking out for the trees.

bluebeecher · Feb 19, 2016

I wasn't sure if that comment was made tongue in cheek, but i don't think it is...
I am ISA certified, and provincially licensed, and a B.Sc. grad, and a college arborist grad....and a student of common sense. The truth is, if I would have to always send off for a soil sample not only would the added cost discourage most homeowners, but by the time i would get the results I would have missed the ideal early-season period for application. In the end what would the results tell me? Maybe to dial back the concentration of product, but I likely would still apply it. The product I will be using is made to remain in place in the soil and slow release for 2 years, and is a lot better than the alternatives that the stores and turf companies offer: Granular or spray fertilizers that mostly get used up by grasses and weeds, and run off after the first big rain.
In sensitive areas I will not use fertilizer but instead only water to fracture/aerate the soil, which with our local soils is beneficial.

If the ISA wants to come at me, let them. My business and my reputation have been build on my hard work and skills. I have trained hard to become, I believe, my city's best climber, best pruner and best hedge trimmer and my quality work day in and out is what keeps me in business, not letters behind my name.
I'm sure the ISA wants things done always by the letter, but I have a newborn son who is counting on his dad to provide a good future for him and coming up with new revenue streams (in a responsible, sensible manner) is part of that.

Thank you for your point of view Mrtree and hope I have responded to your concern in an adequate fashion.

IPMArborist · Feb 20, 2016

bluebeecher said:
I wasn't sure if that comment was made tongue in cheek, but i don't think it is...
I am ISA certified, and provincially licensed, and a B.Sc. grad, and a college arborist grad....and a student of common sense. The truth is, if I would have to always send off for a soil sample not only would the added cost discourage most homeowners, but by the time i would get the results I would have missed the ideal early-season period for application. In the end what would the results tell me? Maybe to dial back the concentration of product, but I likely would still apply it. The product I will be using is made to remain in place in the soil and slow release for 2 years, and is a lot better than the alternatives that the stores and turf companies offer: Granular or spray fertilizers that mostly get used up by grasses and weeds, and run off after the first big rain.
In sensitive areas I will not use fertilizer but instead only water to fracture/aerate the soil, which with our local soils is beneficial.

If the ISA wants to come at me, let them. My business and my reputation have been build on my hard work and skills. I have trained hard to become, I believe, my city's best climber, best pruner and best hedge trimmer and my quality work day in and out is what keeps me in business, not letters behind my name.
I'm sure the ISA wants things done always by the letter, but I have a newborn son who is counting on his dad to provide a good future for him and coming up with new revenue streams (in a responsible, sensible manner) is part of that.

Thank you for your point of view Mrtree and hope I have responded to your concern in an adequate fashion.

IPMArborist · Feb 20, 2016

bluebeecher said:
Thanks so much for the great info SZ!

So, the product I am looking at using is the Doggett Injecto-Feed (spring and fall blends). I have priced it out so that my cost of product would be 25% of my final cost. I will be doing some of the injections, as will my dad and my apprentice, so I should be able to keep my labour costs down. I am estimating that the average time on a job would be around a half hour, do you think this is fair?
I don't think this will impact my tree services as I am currently looking to hire a climber to take over some of my duties. About 50 of these 200 jobs I am hoping for would be my own clients so I would already be on site for tree work.

As for equipment, the high pressure rig I am looking at from Rittenhouse is around 5K (canadian) but they offer an assemble-it-yourself kit for about half, and I can lessen that by using an aftermarket engine rather than the expensive Honda engine.

I also feel that people will love this service, but they just have never been made aware of it. Where I am in Ontario we have pretty hard clay soils so I think the side benefit of fracturing the soil will be a huge draw. However due to our weather conditions, abundance of native species, government regulations, and overall lack of interest, I don't think I will ever introduce pest control or IPM.

This will be my fifth year in business and so far my business strategy has been to price myself a bit less than my established competitors in order to build a client base and get more word of mouth referrals, which are always the best.
I am willing to extend that to DRF to a certain extent, but you are right I may need to adjust my figures once I've better crunched the numbers. Once I have a set $/gallon price I can then draft up a table to help clients determine how much fert they will need based on number/size of trees, length of hedge, or size of garden they wish to be fertilized. It would be sold in increments (at least by 3rd parties) so that I can deliver the exact amount ordered (as per the flow meter on the wand), with the option to pay me for more on site.
My own clients will be able to pay after I am done, based on the volume of product applied.

I really want to go for it, the hard part is just convincing the wife (we all know that right??). Your info and experience will help a lot so thanks again! What % of your DRF comes from residential vs commercial/institutional clients?

BB

This is a great service to offer but only if done well. I do several hundred thousand in fertilization so here are a few tips:
-Doggett makes great products and arguably the best tree fertilizers. However, any of their powdered products will not work in traditional sprayers (poly tanks). You will need mechanical agitation in the form of paddles. Minnesota Wanner and John Bean both make great sprayers for this.
-I highly recommend taking soil samples before any fertilization. It is more scientific, and environmentally friendly. Applied product that isnt' needed/used by the tree may be a source of leaching. The soil sample should also provide a great reason to the client that it actually needs to be done (assuming the results say that it does!). Charge for soil samples. They're not free to you, so they should be free. Soil samples will help you sell more fert, not the other way around. Don't worry about the lag time of having to send it off to the lab. You can fert almost year round with Doggett products.
-Fertilization along with any PHC can't be done by any "tree guy." You actually have to know something and be a good arborist. I think your rates are FAR too low. A general rule in the industry is that any PHC or fert treatment product should not be greater than 10% of the price of the job. I wouldn't do any fertilization for less than $150. A good rule of thumb is to get $5/gallon. If you underprice this service you are basically setting a baseline with the customer that what you're doing isn't really worth that much - its not true. It's far better to have 30 customers who pay you $5 gallon, then a whole bunch who pay you fraction of that.
-Don't charge your customers for water. Find a fire station, landscaper, or other source within 20 minutes or so where you can regularly fill up. If you have a 200 gallon sprayer, you should be able to apply 400-600 gallons a day and do a good job. This means that you should try and get $2,000-3,000 in revenue per day.

Let me know if you have any questions and good luck!

oldoakman · Feb 23, 2016

IPMArborist said:
-Doggett makes great products and arguably the best tree fertilizers. However, any of their powdered products will not work in traditional sprayers (poly tanks).

please explain this statement further. I have one of these with two jet agitators and the return bypass and have no issues maintaining the solution in suspension.

flintlock · Feb 25, 2016

You can use Doggett powered products in a spage only tank. We have multiple rigs built by MW that only have 2 jets in the bottom to keep the product in suspended. Be careful not to let the product sit too long in without agitation. Also different formulations will fall out of suspension differently watch out for anything that has sulfur in it. That tends to fall out quickly. One other thing that can't be stressed enough is to check the strainer (filter) OFTEN!!!!

IPMArborist · Feb 25, 2016

flintlock said:
You can use Doggett powered products in a spage only tank. We have multiple rigs built by MW that only have 2 jets in the bottom to keep the product in suspended. Be careful not to let the product sit too long in without agitation. Also different formulations will fall out of suspension differently watch out for anything that has sulfur in it. That tends to fall out quickly. One other thing that can't be stressed enough is to check the strainer (filter) OFTEN!!!!

This is pretty spot on. I would just add that while it is possible, sometimes it's not worth the hassle. Mechanical Agitation will work far better. I've seen too many poly tank rigs clog up with this stuff. If you can get it to work thought, great. Doggett recently came out with some SRN liquid formulations, I'd consider checking these out as well. It wouldn't be nearly as big a deal to leave a little in the tank overnight or something.

RopeShield · Feb 25, 2016

Why not just broadcast?
What is your soil type?
DRF is a waste of time, energy and material for parts of southern Ontario and most of the world.
I have not seen a single study that shows DRF is more effective than broadcast.
If their turf is being fert that most likely is enough.
Fertilising without analysis and observations is poor science. Take care

deevo · Feb 25, 2016

IPMArborist said:
This is a great service to offer but only if done well. I do several hundred thousand in fertilization so here are a few tips:
-Doggett makes great products and arguably the best tree fertilizers. However, any of their powdered products will not work in traditional sprayers (poly tanks). You will need mechanical agitation in the form of paddles. Minnesota Wanner and John Bean both make great sprayers for this.
-I highly recommend taking soil samples before any fertilization. It is more scientific, and environmentally friendly. Applied product that isnt' needed/used by the tree may be a source of leaching. The soil sample should also provide a great reason to the client that it actually needs to be done (assuming the results say that it does!). Charge for soil samples. They're not free to you, so they should be free. Soil samples will help you sell more fert, not the other way around. Don't worry about the lag time of having to send it off to the lab. You can fert almost year round with Doggett products.
-Fertilization along with any PHC can't be done by any "tree guy." You actually have to know something and be a good arborist. I think your rates are FAR too low. A general rule in the industry is that any PHC or fert treatment product should not be greater than 10% of the price of the job. I wouldn't do any fertilization for less than $150. A good rule of thumb is to get $5/gallon. If you underprice this service you are basically setting a baseline with the customer that what you're doing isn't really worth that much - its not true. It's far better to have 30 customers who pay you $5 gallon, then a whole bunch who pay you fraction of that.
-Don't charge your customers for water. Find a fire station, landscaper, or other source within 20 minutes or so where you can regularly fill up. If you have a 200 gallon sprayer, you should be able to apply 400-600 gallons a day and do a good job. This means that you should try and get $2,000-3,000 in revenue per day.

Let me know if you have any questions and good luck!

That's great advice and I just started doing it last year as well and do $5 gallon with a minimum charge. I have a portable pump and can fill up at clean creeks, and ponds. My first stop is of course the local hydrant! Beware of filling up in towns that use chlorinated water as it may not mix well with your fertilizer !

Pelorus · Feb 26, 2016

This will be my fifth year in business...BB

......and already your "city's best climber, best pruner, and best hedge trimmer..."

I would like to take this moment to congratulate you for your epic achievements, professionalism and high self-regard. Well done, good fellow.

oldoakman · Feb 26, 2016

IPMArborist said:
This is pretty spot on. I would just add that while it is possible, sometimes it's not worth the hassle. Mechanical Agitation will work far better. I've seen too many poly tank rigs clog up with this stuff. If you can get it to work thought, great. Doggett recently came out with some SRN liquid formulations, I'd consider checking these out as well. It wouldn't be nearly as big a deal to leave a little in the tank overnight or something.

I've used the SNR liquid products with outstanding results. I also never let any solution stand overnight in the tank and clean screen after each job. Always worth the time and effort to clean things up.